Resisting strikes

rabbit

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Does having a higher body mass help you resist strikes? Sometimes in class we spar 10 year olds. A very very light kick can damage them easily. Why? Would a 300 pound guy be able to resist strikes more?


By the way. I don't throw kicks when sparring them anymore.
 

dancingalone

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Certainly mass plays a major factor. You should also keep in mind that an adult male has more dense bone and muscle tissue than a child. He can definitely take more of a hit as well as deliver a more damaging blow. There's also the issue of movement and timing. Children's (under 14?) reflexes are slower and they just will not instinctly move to avoid or mitigate a blow as well as an adult will.

It's a bad idea to pair an inexperienced adult with children.
 

igillman

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We do non-contact sparring if the mass difference is too much but we try not to pair kids vs adults anyway. I have been on the sidelines a few times while everybody else spars because there was nobody close to my weight classification. The only time we break the weight classification rule is if we have black belts, they should be able to handle anyone of any size.
 

jks9199

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Why are adults -- outside of instructors -- sparring 10 year olds?

Sorry, I don't see that an appropriate training scenario unless it's sparring with an instructor for specific training purposes. The size and coordination differences are too great.
 

terryl965

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We never let an adult spare youngster except they are BB and can control everything. I see in no way why any adult should be sparring a 10 year old. Glad you are not kicking them.
 
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rabbit

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We are told we are supposed to be working on control and to purposely kick them in the head.
 

Deaf Smith

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Not when you hit them in the throat or eye or groin.... or the nerves near the end of the jaw.

Deaf
 

terryl965

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We are told we are supposed to be working on control and to purposely kick them in the head.

I do not understand your school if they want adults to hit 10 years old in the head with control, what happen if the little person throws himself into your kick his force would cause him imjury. This is just plain stupid work your control on other adults and let the kids learn a art out of love not out of fear from an adult kicking them.
 

bluekey88

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Yes, body mass helps one resist strikes.

No, adults sparring kdis is bad juju. Too much chance of injury...what happens when you execute a beautiful controlled kick, but the kids zigs when you thought he was gonna zag and oyu nail him full force?

Peace,
Erik
 

jks9199

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We are told we are supposed to be working on control and to purposely kick them in the head.
Criminy!

You need to really assess whether the school you're at knows what they're doing! DELIBERATELY kicking towards the HEADS of kids to learn control?! That's beyond bizarrely dumb! Is this the same school that kicked a kid 200+ times?!
 

HM2PAC

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Sometimes in class we spar 10 year olds. A very very light kick can damage them easily. Why?

You may want to look Google "Concussion" and "Post Concussive Syndrome".

Post concussive syndrome is vital to understand for anyone dealing with contact sports, especially for children.

The big danger is that for about 6-8 weeks after a real concussion, the childs brain is still recovering. During this period another concussion can be damaging or even fatal.
 

granfire

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Hit a wooden shed with a wrecking ball and a concrete block...mass matters.

I'd love to spar 10 year olds, maybe then I could win and get some head shots in.

JUST KIDDING, I can kick pretty good...there are better and safer methods to teach kids sparring. One of my favorites is to whomp them over the head with the foam blocker bats...I get a work out there, too, aside from satisfying my evil side! ;)

But I see no advantage for the larger partner in sparring a little person.

I have been banged up by colliding my technique with my partner's. Some things hurt more than others. I can see a real potential for injury there!

I have been the little person in the match and I am always very greatful when the guys who are in essence twice my size pull 90% of their technique because otherwise I'd be in trouble! I have also sparred the odd kid, but even he was about twice my size and send me flying mostly because his brain had not caught up with his size yet, which is also a factor in sparring, mental readiness.
 

MJS

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We are told we are supposed to be working on control and to purposely kick them in the head.

Maybe I'm missing what you're saying here, but purposely kicking someone in the head, especially if its a child, doesn't sound like having too much control.
 

MJS

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Does having a higher body mass help you resist strikes? Sometimes in class we spar 10 year olds. A very very light kick can damage them easily. Why? Would a 300 pound guy be able to resist strikes more?


By the way. I don't throw kicks when sparring them anymore.

Not when you hit them in the throat or eye or groin.... or the nerves near the end of the jaw.

Deaf

Mass will play some part, but as Deaf Smith pointed out, there are still some targets, that despite the mass of the rest of the body, will still be effective to hit. Technically, we should be looking for the targets that will get us the most results. Perhaps this 300lb person you refer to is well built. Well, hitting them in the stomach may not be as effective as someone who is over weight, but the eyes, nose, groin....those are going to get results, no matter what shape the person is in. :)
 

cdunn

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Does having a higher body mass help you resist strikes? Sometimes in class we spar 10 year olds. A very very light kick can damage them easily. Why? Would a 300 pound guy be able to resist strikes more?


By the way. I don't throw kicks when sparring them anymore.

Essentially, causing damage to a person during striking is caused by the transfer of energy and momentum from the striker to the target. The available amount of each of these is directly and linearly dependant on the effective mass of the striker. Comparatively light objects do not transfer energy or momentum well to comparatively heavy objects. While the relationship between % of transfer and relative mass of the two objects is distinctly non-linear, and exceedingly complex, the peak generally occurs when the striker is about the same mass as the target, and tails off slowly as the striker becomes heaver than the target.

While precision attacks for anatomical effect can work well, brute force tends to come down on the side of mass - even if it's not muscular mass.
 

BrandonLucas

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I know this doesn't answer the initial question asked...

We spar kids in our classes at times. Although, when adults spar kids under 12-14, or if they are particularly small, we spar them on our knees, and it's more of an exercise for the kids to learn how to cover up while attacking. We certainly don't kick any of them in the head, and any contact that is made to any of them is very light, if any at all.

I really don't understand the concept of pitting a 10 year old kid against a 300 lbs. individual in a standing match, unless the 10 year old was 300 lbs...and even then, that would be pretty wrong.

My question to the OP is this: What kind of contact is permitted in these sparring matches, and have you ever questioned your instructor as to why you're kicking a 10 year old in the head?
 

Twin Fist

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on the other hand, if a kid is gonna get molested or mugged, or kidnapped, it isnt likely to be by someone thier age and size.....

I have my kids do SD and spar with me, and the other adults in class, cuz they are gonna NEED to know how to deal with somone BIGGER.

Supervised of course, but still.
 

BrandonLucas

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on the other hand, if a kid is gonna get molested or mugged, or kidnapped, it isnt likely to be by someone thier age and size.....

I have my kids do SD and spar with me, and the other adults in class, cuz they are gonna NEED to know how to deal with somone BIGGER.

Supervised of course, but still.

That's a very valid point...I'm just not sure about having small kids go against large adults in any case. Unfortunately, an average 10 year old is not going to be able to physically ward off a 300lbs attacker...a kid's best defense in that situation is to run and yell.

Now, I'm sure there are things that an average 10 year old can do to a larger adult to defend themselves, but ultimately, those moves wouldn't be legal in a traditional sparring match where the 300lbs attackers are encouraged to kick the kids in the head.

But I do agree that kids should be trained on how to defend against a larger attacker.
 

jks9199

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on the other hand, if a kid is gonna get molested or mugged, or kidnapped, it isnt likely to be by someone thier age and size.....

I have my kids do SD and spar with me, and the other adults in class, cuz they are gonna NEED to know how to deal with somone BIGGER.

Supervised of course, but still.
Kids need to practice self defense against adult-size folks -- not spar. I wouldn't have a major problem with working one-steps and similar sparring-related exercises, either.

But free sparring kids and adults against each other? Nope. An instructor working sparring exercises with kids? Sure. Even, in some circumstances, some controlled free sparring exercises.

As I said before, the size, development, and coordination differences are just too great.
 
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