Parent in class

[Headhunter]

This is based on an incident in training last night.

I was assisting a kids class as a favour and I was taking a group of purple belts and 3 of them were excellent 1 was just horrible to. Wouldn't listen, was rude to me qnd students, was areogant and obnoxious couldn't do even basic stuff and remember the first techique. So I said to give the other 3 tips but not the other.

At the end of the class the child who didn't get tips came up to me. Now this is a guy who pushes his child into training even when he doesn't want to. I've seen him dragging his kid imto the class while the kids literally crying he doesn't want to go and he brings to every single session and the kid looks miserable most of the time and obviously doesn't want to be there. This guy lives near me and I often hear him bragging that his kids going to be the next Bruce lee and will be a black belt in a year. He also tries to get as friendly as he can with the instructor (he's a mechanic) offering the instructor free services in his car things like that.

So anyway after the class he came up to me asking why his boy didn't get a tip. So I politely explained my reasons. Then he got angry saying and I quote "you don't know love all you never teach your just a punk" obviously that annoyed me but I remained calm and simply said I was responsible for that group and in my opinion he has the essentials needs a bit more work before he can get his next tip.

He then got angry and tried to square off and get in my face and said "give him his tip or we'll never come back" so I replied that I don't want to happen but if that's what you wish to do that's your choice and if you have any complaints speak to the head instructor but I will not be awarding him a tip tonight.

The guy then put his hand in my face and said "you better listen boy or you'll get it" at this point I'd had enough and said. Look I don't want trouble I have nothing against you or your son if I were you I'd walk away calm down and come back next class as its another day but if you make a move on me I will defend myself so be very sure you think of the consequences of the action.

At that point he kind of stopped and walked away. The guy was obviously a bully who was used to getting what he wanted.

This is a long thread but I've put in pretty much exactly what was said and want to know if people think I was right in how I handled it.

Oh and before someone asks why the head instructor didnt step in it was because it was in the car park outside as I'd left before the class bowed out to take a phone call but I told my instructor what happened straight away and he said I did the right thing. But Im interested in what other people think.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

I think you handled it fine, and its good that you informed the head instructor about the incident. The students' parents should not be coming up to you in the parking lot threatening you, and honestly if someone did that to me after teaching a class, I would expect my head instructor to not allow him back.

 

[Headhunter]

I think you handled it fine, and its good that you informed the head instructor about the incident. The students' parents should not be coming up to you in the parking lot threatening you, and honestly if someone did that to me after teaching a class, I would expect my head instructor to not allow him back.

I would agree with that but I don't think it's fair the kid has to get banned for what his scumbag father did. I know I said the kid didnt seem like he wanted to be there but what do I know. I was told he wasn't just going to let it slide and next time the kids there will directly address the issue in front of the whole class

 

[Steve]

This is based on an incident in training last night.

I was assisting a kids class as a favour and I was taking a group of purple belts and 3 of them were excellent 1 was just horrible to. Wouldn't listen, was rude to me qnd students, was areogant and obnoxious couldn't do even basic stuff and remember the first techique. So I said to give the other 3 tips but not the other.

At the end of the class the child who didn't get tips came up to me. Now this is a guy who pushes his child into training even when he doesn't want to. I've seen him dragging his kid imto the class while the kids literally crying he doesn't want to go and he brings to every single session and the kid looks miserable most of the time and obviously doesn't want to be there. This guy lives near me and I often hear him bragging that his kids going to be the next Bruce lee and will be a black belt in a year. He also tries to get as friendly as he can with the instructor (he's a mechanic) offering the instructor free services in his car things like that.

So anyway after the class he came up to me asking why his boy didn't get a tip. So I politely explained my reasons. Then he got angry saying and I quote "you don't know love all you never teach your just a punk" obviously that annoyed me but I remained calm and simply said I was responsible for that group and in my opinion he has the essentials needs a bit more work before he can get his next tip.

He then got angry and tried to square off and get in my face and said "give him his tip or we'll never come back" so I replied that I don't want to happen but if that's what you wish to do that's your choice and if you have any complaints speak to the head instructor but I will not be awarding him a tip tonight.

The guy then put his hand in my face and said "you better listen boy or you'll get it" at this point I'd had enough and said. Look I don't want trouble I have nothing against you or your son if I were you I'd walk away calm down and come back next class as its another day but if you make a move on me I will defend myself so be very sure you think of the consequences of the action.

At that point he kind of stopped and walked away. The guy was obviously a bully who was used to getting what he wanted.

This is a long thread but I've put in pretty much exactly what was said and want to know if people think I was right in how I handled it.

Oh and before someone asks why the head instructor didnt step in it was because it was in the car park outside as I'd left before the class bowed out to take a phone call but I told my instructor what happened straight away and he said I did the right thing. But Im interested in what other people think.

What the hell? So much in this, I genuinely don't know where to start.

I guess, first questions. How old are the kids? How old are you?

 

[Headhunter]

What the hell? So much in this, I genuinely don't know where to start.

I guess, first questions. How old are the kids? How old are you?

The kids about 7 or 8 I'm 54

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I think you handled it well enough. If it was my school, that parent wouldn't be allowed in the school unless he apologized calmly and meekly to you, and I would make it clear even a hint of this behavior he would be banned instantly. I might skip all the words from "wouldn't" to "behavior he". The banning wouldn't be nice for the child, and not fair to them, but allowing that parent to act that way is not fair to the child, nor to anyone else in the school.

 

[Gnarlie]

Instant ban, totally unacceptable behaviour and I pity the child. They'd have to make a very strong case / apology / pledge regarding future behaviour of father and child to be allowed back.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

 

[JR 137]

I don't own nor run a dojo, so take this as you will...

Once it became clear that the guy was going to be that way (at the "...you don't know..." part) I would've referred him to the CI.

As a CI, I'd hate to ban the kid for his father's actions, so I wouldn't. I'd tell the father the kid is still welcome to train, but the father's not allowed in. If he asks how his kid will train, inform him anyone else can bring the kid - mother, grandparent, sibling, etc.; just not him. If he can't accept that compromise, that's his problem.

 

[Midnight-shadow]

If I was running that school I wouldn't tolerate that kind of attitude at all. They would definitely be banned no questions asked. I've had a similar experience with teaching swimming where a parent demanded (not asked, demanded) why I hadn't passed their child on a particular skill, threatening that if I didn't pass them on it they would switch to another teacher. I have no patience for that kind of attitude and so told them to transfer. The funny part was that the teacher they switched to didn't pass the child on the skill either...

Unfortunately some parents think they are experts at everything and think they know better than the teacher, when the fact remains that they know literally nothing and are too stupid to realise it.

 

[JowGaWolf]

You did better than I would have. All of what you said is borderline fight for me. The words aren't a big issue, but the finger in my face is an aggressive gesture that would have put in defense mode right away. I wouldn't had to say any words because at that point he would have seen in my eyes that I'm willing to go to the next step. Especially if he was trying to square off on me. That's never good in my book. Squaring off is like a chess game, and it's where someone is trying to get an advantage in position for the purpose of striking me.

This is just me and self-defense solutions are not a one size fits all. What one person does doesn't mean that another person be successful with the same tactics. The only thing that is for certain is that you were able to control the situation where you were able to prevent things from getting worse. This outcome means that you did the right thing.

I have good relationships with the parents at my school and I think they know that if I hit someone then it would be for a good reason. I'm 90% sure of this simply because my attitude and my personality is totally the opposite of the guy who wants to fight people in the street.

For me I would ban the parent. If they want the child to come back then the child needs to come to the school with another family member or family friend. Anyone but the father. This way I can set the expectations for the child without interference of the father. I would have a serious one-on-one talk with the child and tell him, that if he wants to be a part of the school then "here are my expectations" that I require of him. I will make it clear to him about the standards of the school and that he must rise to those standards and not the other way around. Explain that expectation so that a kid can understand it. Then allow him to make his choice of where he wants to be. He can freely stay or freely leave but it will his choice.

 

[Headhunter]

You did better than I would have. All of what you said is borderline fight for me. The words aren't a big issue, but the finger in my face is an aggressive gesture that would have put in defense mode right away. I wouldn't had to say any words because at that point he would have seen in my eyes that I'm willing to go to the next step. Especially if he was trying to square off on me. That's never good in my book. Squaring off is like a chess game, and it's where someone is trying to get an advantage in position for the purpose of striking me.

This is just me and self-defense solutions are not a one size fits all. What one person does doesn't mean that another person be successful with the same tactics. The only thing that is for certain is that you were able to control the situation where you were able to prevent things from getting worse. This outcome means that you did the right thing.

I have good relationships with the parents at my school and I think they know that if I hit someone then it would be for a good reason. I'm 90% sure of this simply because my attitude and my personality is totally the opposite of the guy who wants to fight people in the street.

For me I would ban the parent. If they want the child to come back then the child needs to come to the school with another family member or family friend. Anyone but the father. This way I can set the expectations for the child without interference of the father. I would have a serious one-on-one talk with the child and tell him, that if he wants to be a part of the school then "here are my expectations" that I require of him. I will make it clear to him about the standards of the school and that he must rise to those standards and not the other way around. Explain that expectation so that a kid can understand it. Then allow him to make his choice of where he wants to be. He can freely stay or freely leave but it will his choice.

I agree and there was a moment I nearly moved when he squared up but what stopped me was I didn't think it'd be a good look me a guy who doesn't teach much anyway fighting in the car park of my instructors club after class with a child actually present. I know it wouldn't be my fight and legally I'd be in the right but it wouldn't be good for the clubs reputation so I stopped but I would've done it if he'd punched

 

[JowGaWolf]

I agree and there was a moment I nearly moved when he squared up but what stopped me was I didn't think it'd be a good look me a guy who doesn't teach much anyway fighting in the car park of my instructors club after class with a child actually present. I know it wouldn't be my fight and legally I'd be in the right but it wouldn't be good for the clubs reputation so I stopped but I would've done it if he'd punched

For me. I would put my safety first. It doesn't mean that you have to fight but it does mean you have to protect yourself. The other side of the coin would be that it wouldn't look good or feel good had he attacked you when you weren't prepared to defend yourself. The effectiveness of the school's teachings comes into question and some parents may then question, "If you can't protect yourself using martial arts, then why would they think their kids can protect themselves with what is being taught." The most important factor is that getting hit with bare knuckles never feels good and it can result in serious injury so for me I always try to position myself to deal with that risk.

But like I said you did the right thing that worked best for you because the guy backed down and walked away. Hopefully you'll never see that guy again.

 

[Steve]

Okay, my opinion, it's really impossible to know who shoulders the lion's share of the issues with that encounter. while I don't think we have enough information to know for sure, based only on what's in that post, I'd say there is a trifecta of dysfunction here.

Sounds like that guy is a jerk.

You say things that suggest to me you know the guy and already have a poor opinion of him. So, whether overt or not, that's a problem here. It certainly doesn't help.

I don't know how you could possibly know he does favors for the head instructor, but if that's true, that's a problem. Your description implies that he expects preferential treatment as quid pro quo.

Finally, if the kid routinely acts out in class, and the head instructor (who is normally there) doesn't address it, that's a problem.

Things like this don't just happen the way you describe out of the blue.

 

[JowGaWolf]

Finally, if the kid routinely acts out in class, and the head instructor (who is normally there) doesn't address it, that's a problem.

This is actually a safety issue for any school that teaches martial arts from a self-defense focus. We are teaching kids how to effectively hurt other people. With that in mind kids need to follow instructions and pay attention and follow the rules. Students practice with functional staffs and the last thing we need is some student running around or not paying attention and walking into the path of someone swinging a staff with the intent to break his or her imaginary target.

We also don't need a student to not pay attention for on instructions dealing with joint locks and joint attacks resulting in that student going full force.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Okay, my opinion, it's really impossible to know who shoulders the lion's share of the issues with that encounter. while I don't think we have enough information to know for sure, based only on what's in that post, I'd say there is a trifecta of dysfunction here.

Sounds like that guy is a jerk.

You say things that suggest to me you know the guy and already have a poor opinion of him. So, whether overt or not, that's a problem here. It certainly doesn't help.

I don't know how you could possibly know he does favors for the head instructor, but if that's true, that's a problem. Your description implies that he expects preferential treatment as quid pro quo.

Finally, if the kid routinely acts out in class, and the head instructor (who is normally there) doesn't address it, that's a problem.

Things like this don't just happen the way you describe out of the blue.

I didn't think the description made it "out of the blue", at all. As I read it, I thought, "Well, that was almost to be expected." You have a parent who thinks their child is entitled, which probably explains the child's lack of engagement. You have someone who is doing extra favors AND thinks their child is entitled, and they're likely to feel entitled to have their way. All it needed was a healthy dose of lack of impulse control.

 

[Steve]

Okay, I'll be very frank. My impression from the initial post is there is a weird, unhealthy culture in that school. I wouldn't feel comfortable congratulating the OP for handling this situation well, because that is not likely true. We have a guy who is teaching often enough at the school to award "tips" which suggests he's not just filling in once. and a main instructor who is, intentionally or not, promising preferential treatment in return for favors. Not to mention a parent who is belligerent enough to allegedly square off with the instructor. I don't know what exactly happened here, but I guarantee we have heard a version that is very generous to the OP.

 

[Headhunter]

Okay, I'll be very frank. My impression from the initial post is there is a weird, unhealthy culture in that school. I wouldn't feel comfortable congratulating the OP for handling this situation well, because that is not likely true. We have a guy who is teaching often enough at the school to award "tips" which suggests he's not just filling in once. and a main instructor who is, intentionally or not, promising preferential treatment in return for favors. Not to mention a parent who is belligerent enough to allegedly square off with the instructor. I don't know what exactly happened here, but I guarantee we have heard a version that is very generous to the OP.

Actually pal maybe you shouldn't make assumptions. Yes it was my first time teaching and since I'm a black belt the instructor trusts any opinions of a black belt on those issues and no you didn't you heard exactly what happened and what was said

 

[Steve]

Actually pal maybe you shouldn't make assumptions. Yes it was my first time teaching and since I'm a black belt the instructor trusts any opinions of a black belt on those issues and no you didn't you heard exactly what happened and what was said

Okay, pal.

 

[Midnight-shadow]

Okay, I'll be very frank. My impression from the initial post is there is a weird, unhealthy culture in that school. I wouldn't feel comfortable congratulating the OP for handling this situation well, because that is not likely true. We have a guy who is teaching often enough at the school to award "tips" which suggests he's not just filling in once. and a main instructor who is, intentionally or not, promising preferential treatment in return for favors. Not to mention a parent who is belligerent enough to allegedly square off with the instructor. I don't know what exactly happened here, but I guarantee we have heard a version that is very generous to the OP.

I'd just like to point out here that all the OP said was the guy was offering things to the head instructor like free car services. He never said the head instructor accepted those offers or let them affect his judgement. I think you're reading between the lines a bit too much on this one Steve.

 

[Headhunter]

Okay, pal.

Funny that you actually haven't said what I'm supposed to have done wrong all you've done is call me a liar for some reason