How is he compared to a black belt in Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu who studied with a real sensei?
How is he compared to a black belt in Kenpo who studied with a real sensei?
Is he now teaching either of these styles?
Depends on the Bujinkan sensei, I've seen Bujin who where worthless & some who were great. It all depends on how it taught I guess. Compared to Kenpo, IDK but his movements are crisp and he has been fairly effective in a few fights he has been in. He is no teaching but not professionally, he just gets neighborhood kids and a few family members who he teachs things when they ask. Thats kinda a gray area with the teach friends and family, but they know he learned from books and video.
Your missing my point. You are taking the extremes of either end to try and make your point. You are also only using one point of view to make a point and that is fighting. I guess you can call the fight the end all of any martial art or the end product, in other words how functional you or your system is. I get this and can agree that in the end it is all about how functional you are. But you still need to have good form to get you there. You are not just going to be functional because you want to be. There is a process, and the process starts with form. To do a simple punch regardless of style you need to know a few things. The simplest is how to make a fist or fist form. Make your fist incorrect or bad fist form and you have a broken hand if you connect with something.
Now the augment is online ranking in one system or another, doesnÂ’t matter. The idea is bad because if you are going to learn TKD, Shotakan, Wadu, Chin Na, or whatever you need to know if what you are doing conforms to each styles form. If you do a Kempo side kick in a TKD system it will be wrong and you are not doing TKD in that aspect and you should not have a rank as such in TKD. This is the closest thing I can come up with to try and make my point pertaining to this thread.
The broken fist is an assumption as there is many variations of a fist in different systems but you are correct in the kicking aspect which relates back to the many variations of the fist. It all comes down to application of principles and while form is an application of the principles it is not the only applications.
Now to your point of fighting, you still need proper form to be effective, no matter the technique. No you do not have to be in a styles back stance or front stance and the likes, but you do have make a proper fist, and swing in a basic way so that when you make contact you will be effective and not hurt yourself. You have to understand how to deliver any technique with power but still not be out of control as to not expose yourself to an easy counter. You need to know how to start any such techniques as to not telegraph your intentions to much also as to not be countered. All of those basic concepts start with proper form. Not proper forms as in patterns but form in execution. This is regardless of style. Concepts are concepts and they all start with form.
You develop this form over time with drills, sparring, and an instructor to point out your flaws when you make them so you can correct them. No video or online tutorial will do this. Now if you just fight often enough you may come to some conclusion on your own and make the proper adjustments after enough fights and mistakes, yes.
Exactly form is a transmission for function. At a beginning level we often learn form in the execution, that form varies to certain styles and what not. For example; the cross/reverse punch, the principles are exactly the same but sparring is done often times in a vacume of the school; on mats, in a gi & with protective gear. All that changes the function slightly, even watching black belts spar in against each other they present sloppy form as they have to execute multiple actions at once but their sloppy form is all a product of executing several different functioning principles at once. Form changes as the function changes.
Yes there are freaks out there that are quick and strong and will just win in a fight sometimes with no training. I have seen people get KO'd with a wild luck swing by someone with their eyes closed. It did not mean that they could repeat such act at will. It is no different than winning the lottery. You did not need any skill to win, it just happened. Repeat the lottery win at least 50% of the time. OK 20% of the time, or even 5% of the time. No one can.
Now if you train any of those fast strong types of people in any style or art they will be much better. And the wins they use to get by just brute strength or luck will now be easier, and repeatable on an increased basis.
Even though there are two different issue regarding form, form still reigns over simple function. Form makes function more effective in all cases.
Here is the thing, sure there is the luck shot theory. Its kinda like the magic bullet theory. I once get in a fight (started it actually) because I got tired of hearing a guy tell me how tough he was, in a rather rude way. He had no training but buffed up his ability with wieght lifting and strength building exercises.
His advantage of size and power where not some freakish luck but a form of finding an advantage. Could he repeat his KOs of others with a wild swing? Yes, becuase all of them we untrained and moved away from the big guy swinging at them. So they got right in the range of the big hey maker. I did something completely different and stepped into the punch which ended up with him on his tail looking up at me.
It basicly comes down to this I agree online ranking should include some way of improve or correcting someone on what they are doing right or wrong. I agree with that form and function go hand in hand in the vaccume of training but not always so in the realm of sparring or actually fighting. I still believe that form teachs function and function is decided by situation and surrounds. I'll even go so far as to disagree about the issue of stance, becuase the act of learning to transition from back stance to front stance also applies to shidt the body behind a straight punch/jab. All that practive in form translates to principles of function. Form may not be exact in application outside the vaccume of training but is a required element for learning principles which will be applied in a variety of situations & surroundings.
I was less concerned with trying to convense you of anything then say trying to allow you to convense me. I happen to learn allot from Socratic debates.
