Is this legal in Bayarea California to carry out?

[jks9199]

Not a lawyer, but the little bit of google I did, it specifies having a concealed carry permit as an exception. Which makes sense (I know, laws don't have to make sense) because if I can carry a gun, who cares if I also carry knuckles?

It doesn't have to be logical... but unless the sources are judges, magistrates, prosecutors or cops in Virginia -- I wouldn't rely on their say so in the face of the black letter in the code that specifically exempts handguns, but not other weapons.

 

[Dirty Dog]

It doesn't have to be logical...

I'll be the first to agree with that.

but unless the sources are judges, magistrates, prosecutors or cops in Virginia -- I wouldn't rely on their say so in the face of the black letter in the code that specifically exempts handguns, but not other weapons.

I've never talked to a VI cop. But CO has (or had) much the same issue. Automatic knives were listed as prohibited weapons, with exceptions granted for Police, EMS and people "with a permit". The only permit CO issues is specifically a concealed handgun permit (not a concealed weapon permit). So I asked a fair number of cops. The consensus was that if I had a permit to carry a gun, nobody is going to care what kind of knife I carry.
Happily, CO did the obvious and sensible thing and removed automatic knives from the list.

 

[jks9199]

I'll be the first to agree with that.

I've never talked to a VI cop. But CO has (or had) much the same issue. Automatic knives were listed as prohibited weapons, with exceptions granted for Police, EMS and people "with a permit". The only permit CO issues is specifically a concealed handgun permit (not a concealed weapon permit). So I asked a fair number of cops. The consensus was that if I had a permit to carry a gun, nobody is going to care what kind of knife I carry.
Happily, CO did the obvious and sensible thing and removed automatic knives from the list.

The reality is that, unless you're doing major stupidity, if you're issued a CCW, cops are likely not going to care about most of the other stuff -- but the code in Virginia makes having a permit an affirmative defense to the charge, and does specifically address handguns, not any other weapon. Of course, we also had a ruling about 15 years or so ago that moved the issue for analysis to whether or not the item is a weapon not the intent for which it was carried. I

 

[Flying Crane]

Doesn't really matter what you believe. The lawmaker SAID that the logic was the mags would be used up.
Here's the quote from US Representative Diana DeGette:


Except it doesn't.

But that is what the lawmaker said.

Ok, so that lawmaker said something incoherent. It isn’t difficult to find stupid or senseless statements from lawmakers. But it takes more than one lawmaker to pass a law. I understand you don’t like the law. So you are simply distilling it down to “the lawmakers are stupid”. But a whole lot of them voted for it and I would bet the others have a better grasp of the concept, or at least can articulate better than she did.

Now the video you posted is unconvincing. You’ve got Jim and Christy comparing how quickly they can fire off rounds in different size magazines. But they are set up at a range, with the magazines all lined up and ready for them, not in a chaotic mass-shooting event. This simulation in no way re-creates what an event would be like. I find it doubtful that their performance at the range would be comparable to such an event, if they were the perpetrator. Very likely their reloading would be slower.

The opening to the video also posted statistics for how many shots typically miss the target in both police shooting in incidents, and home defense occurrences. That further convinces me that people spraying shots like that become a danger to their neighbors. It’s an argument to further limit magazine capacity.

Regarding having multiple guns to discard along the way, (the revolvers) that becomes expensive, which could limit the ability of a perpetrator to follow that tactic.

So overall I am unimpressed by the contents of this video.

No, it's not. Because it doesn't work.

Now this statement is simply silly. Are you really telling me that when a perpetrator pauses to swap magazines, that he is still actually shooting people during that pause?

So how about this: if you believe you can fire off five 6-round magazines just as quickly as two 15- round magazines, then you should have no complaints if the laws limited magazine capacity to six rounds. Because to you, it is irrelevant.

I know that you and I will never agree on this. My opinion: this nation is long overdue for some meaningful and common-sense gun control laws. And no, I am not anti-gun. But I am anti-stupid gun ownership and do believe there ought to be limits.

 

[JowGaWolf]

So how do they treat muslims?

That's why the law was originally made. It was made because politicians didn't approve of the cultural wear. I don't think the majority of the citizens actually cared as it's not something that is often seen unless you go to stores that Muslims like to go to. Lets just say there are people in Georgia who think everyone should be like them or that certain groups shouldn't be different. Lots of Acceptance Issues here. If they could find an argument for green vs pink shoes, they would argue about it until there was a law for green vs pink shoes.

How about people wearing surgical mask for Covid? You get arrested if you wear it, then you get arrested if you don't!!! How do you like that?!!!

That was actually a big fight here between the Georgia Governor and the Atlanta Mayor. The Governor made a statement that people couldn't wear mask referencing the law and the Atlanta Mayor told the Governor to get stuffed lol. The law is on the books and people still wear masks including during Halloween, Landscape projects, medical reasons, flu season, allergy season, cold weather, fitness gear, safety equipment and now Covid. So all of that is ok unless the person is Muslims. The law is still on the books as far as I know.
2010 Georgia Code :: TITLE 16 - CRIMES AND OFFENSES :: CHAPTER 11 - OFFENSES AGAINST PUBLIC ORDER AND SAFETY :: ARTICLE 2 - OFFENSES AGAINST PUBLIC ORDER :: § 16-11-38 - Wearing mask, hood, or device which conceals identity of wearer

I deal with it because it gives me something to pester the KKK about.

As to "weapons of like kind," I didn't catch that earlier, but I've gotten off on things that I was clearly in violation of because because of very good attorneys, and with "weapons of like kind" being such an ambiguous phrase, I'm not worried.

As to the laws not making sense (i.e., you can have a gun but not a switchblade, etc), it all comes down two things that occured at the time these things were outlawed:

1. Targeting certain demographics
2. Moral panic

In the case of the former, cannabis was outlawed because it was mostly used by minorities and white counterculture groups (beatniks, etc).

Eastern martial arts/ninja weapons were outlawed because of the moral panic caused by the movies they were featured in.

Brass knuckles, switchblades, etc were a combination of both: greasers were the demographic being targeted. And those "bad boy" movies with James Dean, Marlon Brando, etc contributed to that.

Of course, guns, are carried by "good hardworking 'muricans," so they weren't being targeted.

Thank goodness all of those gangsters, action hero shoot em up moves are so tame. No way someone with a gun would do all of that. lol.

It is what is is. Things aren't fix because people aren't trying to fix them. Laws are being made for the wrong reasons which is why a lot of them really don't address the root of the issue, so like a weed, the nonsense pops up every year. But at lease we are all safe from those gangs with the retractable baton and the ninjas and their throwing stars.lol.

 

[Dirty Dog]

Ok, so that lawmaker said something incoherent. It isn’t difficult to find stupid or senseless statements from lawmakers. But it takes more than one lawmaker to pass a law. I understand you don’t like the law. So you are simply distilling it down to “the lawmakers are stupid”. But a whole lot of them voted for it and I would bet the others have a better grasp of the concept, or at least can articulate better than she did.

She was one of the authors of the bill. The bill is idiotic.

Now the video you posted is unconvincing. You’ve got Jim and Christy comparing how quickly they can fire off rounds in different size magazines. But they are set up at a range, with the magazines all lined up and ready for them, not in a chaotic mass-shooting event. This simulation in no way re-creates what an event would be like. I find it doubtful that their performance at the range would be comparable to such an event, if they were the perpetrator. Very likely their reloading would be slower.

Right. Because mass shooters don't practice, or prepare or anything.

The opening to the video also posted statistics for how many shots typically miss the target in both police shooting in incidents, and home defense occurrences. That further convinces me that people spraying shots like that become a danger to their neighbors. It’s an argument to further limit magazine capacity.

No it's not. Laws should serve a purpose. If they don't, they shouldn't exist.

Regarding having multiple guns to discard along the way, (the revolvers) that becomes expensive, which could limit the ability of a perpetrator to follow that tactic.

Cheap guns are cheap.

So overall I am unimpressed by the contents of this video.

Now this statement is simply silly. Are you really telling me that when a perpetrator pauses to swap magazines, that he is still actually shooting people during that pause?

I'm saying the pause is so brief as to be meaningless. It's no longer than the pauses to switch targets.

So how about this: if you believe you can fire off five 6-round magazines just as quickly as two 15- round magazines, then you should have no complaints if the laws limited magazine capacity to six rounds. Because to you, it is irrelevant.

It serves no useful purpose. So it's a stupid law. Stupid laws should be repealed.

I know that you and I will never agree on this. My opinion: this nation is long overdue for some meaningful and common-sense gun control laws. And no, I am not anti-gun. But I am anti-stupid gun ownership and do believe there ought to be limits.

It's more nonsense than common-sense.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Ok, so that lawmaker said something incoherent. It isn’t difficult to find stupid or senseless statements from lawmakers. But it takes more than one lawmaker to pass a law. I understand you don’t like the law. So you are simply distilling it down to “the lawmakers are stupid”. But a whole lot of them voted for it and I would bet the others have a better grasp of the concept, or at least can articulate better than she did.

Now the video you posted is unconvincing. You’ve got Jim and Christy comparing how quickly they can fire off rounds in different size magazines. But they are set up at a range, with the magazines all lined up and ready for them, not in a chaotic mass-shooting event. This simulation in no way re-creates what an event would be like. I find it doubtful that their performance at the range would be comparable to such an event, if they were the perpetrator. Very likely their reloading would be slower.

The opening to the video also posted statistics for how many shots typically miss the target in both police shooting in incidents, and home defense occurrences. That further convinces me that people spraying shots like that become a danger to their neighbors. It’s an argument to further limit magazine capacity.

Regarding having multiple guns to discard along the way, (the revolvers) that becomes expensive, which could limit the ability of a perpetrator to follow that tactic.

So overall I am unimpressed by the contents of this video.

Now this statement is simply silly. Are you really telling me that when a perpetrator pauses to swap magazines, that he is still actually shooting people during that pause?

So how about this: if you believe you can fire off five 6-round magazines just as quickly as two 15- round magazines, then you should have no complaints if the laws limited magazine capacity to six rounds. Because to you, it is irrelevant.

I know that you and I will never agree on this. My opinion: this nation is long overdue for some meaningful and common-sense gun control laws. And no, I am not anti-gun. But I am anti-stupid gun ownership and do believe there ought to be limits.

I want to respectfully ask if you shoot guns? I’m not trying for a gotcha. I’m genuinely curious about your level of experience with firearms. I think the discourse is valuable beyond how anyone feels about this law or that gun.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Thanks guys, I am just curious. I am 69, I carry a cane, a fiber filled nylon cane that is very strong and is 20oz. I can take it on a plane and go anywhere. The subject just came up with a friend of mine.

A cane is my go-to when I want something unquestionable. I used to need on on an occasional basis (prior to foot surgery), so I’m comfortable carrying one.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Well that's good. He's alive and well.

And alive not because of the weapon, in this case. As for “well”, I guess that depends how the charges end up.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Not suggesting anything just telling him what I would do at his age. If he carries one or not is his prerogative.
What employment do you think he has at his age?
Off topic but why do the police and authorities in say Philly allow publicly open illegal activities like drug use and probably worse?

Lots of folks over 70 still work. Not everyone manages to make enough to save for retirement.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Read True and Authentic Blogss/Articles About Martial Arts. You wouldn't need to use that!!

Er, what?

 

[Alan0354]

A cane is my go-to when I want something unquestionable. I used to need on on an occasional basis (prior to foot surgery), so I’m comfortable carrying one.

And you have a valid excuse even after you beat the thug up with the cane and police question you. You have foot problem and you need a cane.

I just had problem with my right knee and I just got a cotazone shot, I have a valid excuse to carry a cane......not to mention I am old!!! I don't want to take any chance on the law. I hold my cane with left hand, I have a pepper spray in my right pocket, all absolutely legal.

 

[dvcochran]

That's why the law was originally made. It was made because politicians didn't approve of the cultural wear. I don't think the majority of the citizens actually cared as it's not something that is often seen unless you go to stores that Muslims like to go to. Lets just say there are people in Georgia who think everyone should be like them or that certain groups shouldn't be different. Lots of Acceptance Issues here. If they could find an argument for green vs pink shoes, they would argue about it until there was a law for green vs pink shoes.


That was actually a big fight here between the Georgia Governor and the Atlanta Mayor. The Governor made a statement that people couldn't wear mask referencing the law and the Atlanta Mayor told the Governor to get stuffed lol. The law is on the books and people still wear masks including during Halloween, Landscape projects, medical reasons, flu season, allergy season, cold weather, fitness gear, safety equipment and now Covid. So all of that is ok unless the person is Muslims. The law is still on the books as far as I know.
2010 Georgia Code :: TITLE 16 - CRIMES AND OFFENSES :: CHAPTER 11 - OFFENSES AGAINST PUBLIC ORDER AND SAFETY :: ARTICLE 2 - OFFENSES AGAINST PUBLIC ORDER :: § 16-11-38 - Wearing mask, hood, or device which conceals identity of wearer

I deal with it because it gives me something to pester the KKK about.

Thank goodness all of those gangsters, action hero shoot em up moves are so tame. No way someone with a gun would do all of that. lol.

It is what is is. Things aren't fix because people aren't trying to fix them. Laws are being made for the wrong reasons which is why a lot of them really don't address the root of the issue, so like a weed, the nonsense pops up every year. But at lease we are all safe from those gangs with the retractable baton and the ninjas and their throwing stars.lol.

I am certain every state has some form of mask law. That is a common sense law.

 

[dvcochran]

Not suggesting anything just telling him what I would do at his age. If he carries one or not is his prerogative.
What employment do you think he has at his age?
Off topic but why do the police and authorities in say Philly allow publicly open illegal activities like drug use and probably worse?

My 75 year father in law still goes to the woods nearly every day to fell trees and cut firewood. He may not be as fast as he once was but he sure is consistent. Will out work most people I know.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Doesn't really matter what you believe. The lawmaker SAID that the logic was the mags would be used up.
Here's the quote from US Representative Diana DeGette:


Except it doesn't.

But that is what the lawmaker said.

No, it's not. Because it doesn't work.

Most gun owners I know have literally never practiced quick mag swaps. At the range, it’s painfully obvious.

 

[Alan0354]

Most gun owners I know have literally never practiced quick mag swaps. At the range, it’s painfully obvious.

Ha ha, of cause, that involve dropping the empty mag....to the ground!!!! I ain't going to drop my empty mag on the ground, it doesn't take much to bend the lip out of shape and cause malfunction in the future. I cannot afford that at all. Worst is you don't even know whether you bend it or not until the gun jams. It is not that obvious, just an unnoticeable bend might be enough to cause problem.

No dropping mags......Period for me.

 

[Flying Crane]

I want to respectfully ask if you shoot guns? I’m not trying for a gotcha. I’m genuinely curious about your level of experience with firearms. I think the discourse is valuable beyond how anyone feels about this law or that gun.

I grew up in a hunting family and hunted ducks and geese with my dad, and trap shooting for practice. Used a 12 gauge pump-action Remington 870. As a teenager I had a 10/22 Ruger rifle and a .50 muzzleloader Thompson-Center. Enjoyed target shooting on a fairly regular basis and the occasional squirrel hunt with my uncle. Also had fun target shooting with my dad’s bolt-action .22, his bolt-action .30-06 (Enfield, WW II era) his revolver and his automatic pistol (both .22 Ruger). Had a chance to shoot a friend’s 9mm and .44 magnum Desert Eagle once or twice. Lost interest in hunting as a teenager, but still enjoyed target shooting. Gave my rifles to my dad when I moved to California. A few years ago I bought a .308 Ruger gunsite scout rifle because I thought I might reconnect to some target shooting. Held onto it for about four or five years, and finally sold it because life is busy and I found that I simply never shot it, not once, not even to sight it in. Had no interest.

So yeah, I’ve shot a couple times.

 

[Flying Crane]

She was one of the authors of the bill. The bill is idiotic.

Right. Because mass shooters don't practice, or prepare or anything.

No it's not. Laws should serve a purpose. If they don't, they shouldn't exist.

Cheap guns are cheap.

I'm saying the pause is so brief as to be meaningless. It's no longer than the pauses to switch targets.

It serves no useful purpose. So it's a stupid law. Stupid laws should be repealed.

It's more nonsense than common-sense.

Sorry, not convinced.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Ha ha, of cause, that involve dropping the empty mag....to the ground!!!! I ain't going to drop my empty mag on the ground, it doesn't take much to bend the lip out of shape and cause malfunction in the future. I cannot afford that at all. Worst is you don't even know whether you bend it or not until the gun jams. It is not that obvious, just an unnoticeable bend might be enough to cause problem.

No dropping mags......Period for me.

You could practice a reload-and-retain (useful for tactical reload, for what it’s worth). Most don’t. I see folks having to look down to locate the mag (in their belt pouch) and to load it in the gun, followed by a slow chambering. All sensible on the range, but no preparation for a fast reload.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Ok, so that lawmaker said something incoherent. It isn’t difficult to find stupid or senseless statements from lawmakers. But it takes more than one lawmaker to pass a law. I understand you don’t like the law. So you are simply distilling it down to “the lawmakers are stupid”. But a whole lot of them voted for it and I would bet the others have a better grasp of the concept, or at least can articulate better than she did.

Now the video you posted is unconvincing. You’ve got Jim and Christy comparing how quickly they can fire off rounds in different size magazines. But they are set up at a range, with the magazines all lined up and ready for them, not in a chaotic mass-shooting event. This simulation in no way re-creates what an event would be like. I find it doubtful that their performance at the range would be comparable to such an event, if they were the perpetrator. Very likely their reloading would be slower.

The opening to the video also posted statistics for how many shots typically miss the target in both police shooting in incidents, and home defense occurrences. That further convinces me that people spraying shots like that become a danger to their neighbors. It’s an argument to further limit magazine capacity.

Regarding having multiple guns to discard along the way, (the revolvers) that becomes expensive, which could limit the ability of a perpetrator to follow that tactic.

So overall I am unimpressed by the contents of this video.

Now this statement is simply silly. Are you really telling me that when a perpetrator pauses to swap magazines, that he is still actually shooting people during that pause?

So how about this: if you believe you can fire off five 6-round magazines just as quickly as two 15- round magazines, then you should have no complaints if the laws limited magazine capacity to six rounds. Because to you, it is irrelevant.

I know that you and I will never agree on this. My opinion: this nation is long overdue for some meaningful and common-sense gun control laws. And no, I am not anti-gun. But I am anti-stupid gun ownership and do believe there ought to be limits.

I grew up in a hunting family and hunted ducks and geese with my dad, and trap shooting for practice. Used a 12 gauge pump-action Remington 870. As a teenager I had a 10/22 Ruger rifle and a .50 muzzleloader Thompson-Center. Enjoyed target shooting on a fairly regular basis and the occasional squirrel hunt with my uncle. Also had fun target shooting with my dad’s bolt-action .22, his bolt-action .30-06 (Enfield, WW II era) his revolver and his automatic pistol (both .22 Ruger). Had a chance to shoot a friend’s 9mm and .44 magnum Desert Eagle once or twice. Lost interest in hunting as a teenager, but still enjoyed target shooting. Gave my rifles to my dad when I moved to California. A few years ago I bought a .308 Ruger gunsite scout rifle because I thought I might reconnect to some target shooting. Held onto it for about four or five years, and finally sold it because life is busy and I found that I simply never shot it, not once, not even to sight it in. Had no interest.

So yeah, I’ve shot a couple times.

Thanks, that answers my question. I just always wonder where people are coming from experience wise. It’s productive to talk about this subject from common ground rather than dig in to our respective point of view. We can all agree there is a problem that needs to be addressed with shootings in this country.