Is the Bible 100% truth?

[crushing]

:lisafault:

 

[elder999]

d. Do you think you see anything in the revealed divine nature of God that would require Jesus to take a wife?

Yes. He was a Hebrew man who other men called "Rabbi." Q.E.D.

I also see nothing in His "taking a wife" that would take anything away from his "revealed, divine nature," and, frankly,don't see how anyone else could.

To me it seems you only want to say anything that you think will discredit God and/or Christianity, or a belief in God and/or Christianity.

I believe in God. I respect Christianity. I have a deep and abiding love for the teachings of the rabbi, Yeshua. I'm not interested in discrediting God or Christianiity.


I don't respect a great deal of Christian dogma, however.

Or the dogmatic, for that matter.

From my perspective, you say some pretty outlandish things, and often with no apparent purpose other than to create controversy. I believe you when you say your father and grandfather were priests, and I am sure they were fine and honorable men. I also believe you had training to be a priest, a career path you apparently really didn't want. However, you seem to have left that career path with much bitterness against God and Christianity. To me that is sad. It may explain your attacks on God and the Bible.

I have no bitterness against God or Christianity. I'm not attacking God or the Bible-except the execrable King James' version, and even that I have said was a fine piece of prose.

No, I didn't want to be an Episcopal priest-a profession that has a certain protection in my family trust, a protection I had no need of.

I wound up being another sort of priest anyway, though-what can you do? :lfao:

In terms of this discussion, I've already said that the Bible is full of beauty and truth-in addition to what are, from my perspective- rather obvious errors and mistranslations-and mine is a perspective that's shaped by a lifetime of scholarship.

I'm reminded, though, of something my father frequently said: This Bible has 1836 pages, and you can tear them all out but this one, and you'll be fine.

As for saying things that "create controversy," or stir the pot, isn't that precisely how so much of Yeshua's speech was?

Take that page my dad talked about, for instance:

And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, "Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?"He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? And he answering said, "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself."And he said unto him, ,Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.,]
But he, willing to justify himself, said unto Jesus, "And who is my neighbour?"And Jesus answering said,, A certain man went down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and fell among thieves, which stripped him of his raiment, and wounded him, and departed, leaving him half dead. And by chance there came down a certain priest that way: and when he saw him, he passed by on the other side.And likewise a Levite, when he was at the place, came and looked on him, and passed by on the other side. But a certain Samaritan, as he journeyed, came where he was: and when he saw him, he had compassion on him, and went to him, and bound up his wounds, pouring in oil and wine, and set him on his own beast, and brought him to an inn, and took care of him. And on the morrow when he departed, he took out two pence, and gave them to the host, and said unto him, Take care of him; and whatsoever thou spendest more, when I come again, I will repay thee. Which now of these three, thinkest thou, was neighbour unto him that fell among the thieves?.

And he said, "He that shewed mercy on him." Then said Jesus unto him, Go, and do thou likewise.

But, to each his own. I believe we can make choices as to what our actions are, and there will come a time when we will account for all our actions.

You or anyone else may believe and act as you may wish.

Indeed.

 

[Steve]

Bah christianity stole hel(l) from Nordic Mythology. Truth is Odin and his brothers killed the giant Yme and created the world from his dead body, from his blood the ocean, from his bones the hills, from his hair the trees, from his brains the clouds, from his skull the heavens, and from his eyebrows the nothern lights. 100% fact. Then they created Valkyries and had a party.

Heresy. Next you'll tell us that Christmas was a pagan holy day. Or, worse... that Easter wasn't a xtian holiday!

 

[oftheherd1]

Yes. He was a Hebrew man who other men called "Rabbi." Q.E.D.

I also see nothing in His "taking a wife" that would take anything away from his "revealed, divine nature," and, frankly,don't see how anyone else could.

I just think that Jesus being God, he would have no reason to marry. I think it would be an example and distraction He would not want.

I believe in God. I respect Christianity. I have a deep and abiding love for the teachings of the rabbi, Yeshua. I'm not interested in discrediting God or Christianiity.


I don't respect a great deal of Christian dogma, however.

Or the dogmatic, for that matter.

In the pejorative sense it is usually used, I would agree. But the doctrines found in the Bible would be correct to use.

I have no bitterness against God or Christianity. I'm not attacking God or the Bible-except the execrable King James' version, and even that I have said was a fine piece of prose.

No, I didn't want to be an Episcopal priest-a profession that has a certain protection in my family trust, a protection I had no need of.

I wound up being another sort of priest anyway, though-what can you do? :lfao:

I am glad you are not bitter. But I am sure you understand I do not agree with your use of the word execrable to describe the King James Bible.

In terms of this discussion, I've already said that the Bible is full of beauty and truth-in addition to what are, from my perspective- rather obvious errors and mistranslations-and mine is a perspective that's shaped by a lifetime of scholarship.

I'm reminded, though, of something my father frequently said: This Bible has 1836 pages, and you can tear them all out but this one, and you'll be fine.

As for saying things that "create controversy," or stir the pot, isn't that precisely how so much of Yeshua's speech was?

Take that page my dad talked about, for instance:

And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, "Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?"He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? And he answering said, "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself."And he said unto him, ,Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.,]
But he, willing to justify himself, said unto Jesus, "And who is my neighbour?"And Jesus answering said,, A certain man went down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and fell among thieves, which stripped him of his raiment, and wounded him, and departed, leaving him half dead. And by chance there came down a certain priest that way: and when he saw him, he passed by on the other side.And likewise a Levite, when he was at the place, came and looked on him, and passed by on the other side. But a certain Samaritan, as he journeyed, came where he was: and when he saw him, he had compassion on him, and went to him, and bound up his wounds, pouring in oil and wine, and set him on his own beast, and brought him to an inn, and took care of him. And on the morrow when he departed, he took out two pence, and gave them to the host, and said unto him, Take care of him; and whatsoever thou spendest more, when I come again, I will repay thee. Which now of these three, thinkest thou, was neighbour unto him that fell among the thieves?.

And he said, "He that shewed mercy on him." Then said Jesus unto him, Go, and do thou likewise.

Yes, much of what Jesus said created controversy. But I was saying I thought you were intentionally trying to create controversy for your own pleasure. Jesus stated truth, which the Jews did not accept, and that was what created controversy over what he said.

If you weren't intentionally trying to create controversy, for instance using the word execrable to describe the King James Bible, so be it.

What you quoted from the Bible (apparently from the King James?), is indeed a principle worthy to live by. I take the meaning of your father. But personally I would never want to in any way confuse someone into thinking the rest of the Bible was not important, and did not have words from God to live by. Just me of course.

Indeed.

I am just curious, if you don't mind telling me, what Bible version did your father and grandfather use to read and teach from?

EDIT: I hope nothing I have said or asked will be taken by you as confrontational. As I mentioned, I have a lot of respect for you learning and knowledge. I just don't happen to agree with a lot of what you say about the Bible (King James Version). Obviously, you feel the same about my views, as do others in this thread. I can accept that.

 

[Cirdan]

Calling Jesus a dress wearing over rated hippy, Putting up a photo of Jesus as an alien and that just this page. I wonder how understanding people would be if we did that when talking about other religions? Not very I assume since if you did the same thing about Muhammad in say Egypt you would be killed. Id rather not "Join in" Im just wondering if this stuff gets to stay after Aug 1st?

Jesus the hippie, Buddha the fatty, and that Mohamad who likes little girls are all overrated because they don`t know how to party. With Valkyries. Pass the mead!

 

[K-man]

Jesus the hippie, Buddha the fatty, and that Mohamad who likes little girls are all overrated because they don`t know how to party. With Valkyries. Pass the mead!

Where can I sign up? She seems like my kind of Goddess.

 

[Cirdan]

Where can I sign up? She seems like my kind of Goddess.

You just need to be brave and live life to its fullest. You know, fight, drink, feast and enjoy the embrace of a woman. Killing a giant or two won`t hurt either. Then when you die a Valkyrie will ride her flying horse to pick you up and carry you to Vallhalla. Where there is fighting all day and feast all night with the valkyries serving mead.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

As there's been a post reported, please review our TOS regarding 'religion' Thank you.
===

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MartialTalk welcomes people of all faiths and does not condone the wholesale condemnation of a faith or the defamatory general characterizations of a faith, based on the actions of a few.

Members are welcome to their opinions however we must insist that they be posted in such a manner as to not condemn an entire group for the negative actions of a few.

Such actions may run afoul of our hate-speech policies and will be dealt with as such.

Please be respectful of your fellow members, who may believe differently than you, yet are still human beings with the right to believe as they do, the same as you and I.

 

[crushing]

Ok. That's about what I expected from you anyway.

Excellent. I'm glad you understand that I don't see any ideas or memes as being above criticism. I don't approach this subject from privilege or a sense of entitlement. When the Ayatollah Khomeini issued the fatwa against Salman Rushdie, I went out and bought The Satanic Verses in support of free speech. That's where I'm coming from. I want the spell broken that makes discussions about religion so difficult to have. Isn't this something you should expect from everyone?

 

[ballen0351]

Excellent. I'm glad you understand that I don't see any ideas or memes as being above criticism. I don't approach this subject from privilege or a sense of entitlement. When the Ayatollah Khomeini issued the fatwa against Salman Rushdie, I went out and bought The Satanic Verses in support of free speech. That's where I'm coming from. I want the spell broken that makes discussions about religion so difficult to have. Isn't this something you should expect from everyone?

That's not what I ment about YOU. Have a good day

 

[elder999]

I just think that Jesus being God, he would have no reason to marry. I think it would be an example and distraction He would not want.

"Distraction?" How can One who is omniscient, omnipresent and omniprescient be.......distracted? :lfao:

"Exapmple?" How is it that One who sent Man forth to "be fruitful, and multiply," could be setting an example that They did not want by......doing so?

Jesus being Man had ample reason to marry.

In the pejorative sense it is usually used, I would agree. But the doctrines found in the Bible would be correct to use.

Sabbath day: Saturday or Sunday?

Salvation: Assured or not?

I am glad you are not bitter. But I am sure you understand I do not agree with your use of the word execrable to describe the King James Bible.

Without resorting to the Merriam Webster English Language Technical Manual (that's engineerspeak for "dictionary" :lfao: ) hat word means "very bad." There simply are better translations. It simply is "very bad," prose quality notwithstanding.....

Yes, much of what Jesus said created controversy. But I was saying I thought you were intentionally trying to create controversy for your own pleasure. Jesus stated truth, which the Jews did not accept, and that was what created controversy over what he said.

In keeping with the 68 degree rule, I have stated truth and fact, which you do not accept-and that's created controversy.....

I am just curious, if you don't mind telling me, what Bible version did your father and grandfather use to read and teach from?

EDIT: I hope nothing I have said or asked will be taken by you as confrontational. As I mentioned, I have a lot of respect for you learning and knowledge. I just don
't happen to agree with a lot of what you say about the Bible (King James Version). Obviously, you feel the same about my views, as do others in this thread. I can accept that.

"Confrontational?"

Nah. It's a small thing, what onbe person or another thinks of the Bible, after all......

A funny story:

The Jehovah's Witnesses had my family marked for conversion.They really did.

Weekend after weekend, various members would show up on our doorstep, and, weekend after weekend, Dad would take up his Bible, and demonstrate, verse by verse, why he thought they were theologically F.O.S.

One day, he came from the door, laughing, and handed me the Bible, saying, Son, they're here for you, now... and when I went to the door, there were three really lovely sisters on the porch!

The Bible he handed me was, of course, the King James-in the years to follow, I'd see numerous translations, and I have to say (again!) that while quite a few were more accurate, none was equal to the King James for language and poetry-another reiteration of the difference between fact and truth.

 

[oftheherd1]

"Distraction?" How can One who is omniscient, omnipresent and omniprescient be.......distracted? :lfao:

"Exapmple?" How is it that One who sent Man forth to "be fruitful, and multiply," could be setting an example that They did not want by......doing so?

Jesus being Man had ample reason to marry.

Distraction and example to those of us on earth, in the sense that it would distract us away from His reason for coming to earth. I think it also helped helped set Him apart as not the being same as the rest of us. You could just as easily say being Man he had ample reason to sin. But in fact the Bible tells us he did not.

Sabbath day: Saturday or Sunday?

Salvation: Assured or not?

Sabbath day – the seventh day of the week. Sunday is the day chosen by Christians to meet and worship; it does come every seven days. Considering your dislike of dogma, would you like to defend the likelihood that with all the chaos in calendars, and dark ages peasant/serf work requirements, we even know for sure if we are still on the same schedule as the Jews of biblical times? Even so, worshiping on Sunday is worshiping every seven days.

Assured.

John 10:28-29 and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand.

1 John 5:13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

Without resorting to the Merriam Webster English Language Technical Manual (that's engineerspeak for "dictionary" :lfao: ) hat word means "very bad." There simply are better translations. It simply is "very bad," prose quality notwithstanding.....

Or wretched … neither definition I believe, accurately describes the King James Bible. I don't believe there are better translations.
But perhaps you could share some English translations that you think are more correct?

In keeping with the 68 degree rule, I have stated truth and fact, which you do not accept-and that's created controversy.....

LOL First of all, your 68 degree rule describes a fact with two different perceptions of reality. You need to define your “truth” it you want to say that you have stated truth and fact which I don’t accept. I or anyone else can as easily say that to you about my/our own beliefs. But in fact, we, as you, would be using your rule to simply mask what is going on; experiencing two different perceptions of a fact, not two different truths.

"Confrontational?"

Nah. It's a small thing, what onbe person or another thinks of the Bible, after all......

A funny story:

The Jehovah's Witnesses had my family marked for conversion.They really did.

Weekend after weekend, various members would show up on our doorstep, and, weekend after weekend, Dad would take up his Bible, and demonstrate, verse by verse, why he thought they were theologically F.O.S.

One day, he came from the door, laughing, and handed me the Bible, saying, Son, they're here for you, now... and when I went to the door, there were three really lovely sisters on the porch!

The Bible he handed me was, of course, the King James-in the years to follow, I'd see numerous translations, and I have to say (again!) that while quite a few were more accurate, none was equal to the King James for language and poetry-another reiteration of the difference between fact and truth.

I wouldn't say belief in a Bible that was not accurate is a small thing. I think Bibles that are not in fact God's inspired words, can cause doubt and lead people astray, and perhaps keep them from being saved.

Interesting story on the Jehovah's Witnesses. Did you in fact talk to them and show them how you thought they were misguided? Would you still think them misguided, or do you think your father was? Where do you think your father and grandfather are now? Where do you think you will be when you die? Did you at any time sincerely accept Jesus into your heart and ask God to save you?

Again I would appreciate you listing some of the “quite a few” English translations that you say are more accurate. I don’t think that is a correct statement, but can’t properly evaluate it without knowing what translations you are referring to.

 

[elder999]

Distraction and example to those of us on earth, in the sense that it would distract us away from His reason for coming to earth. I think it also helped helped set Him apart as not the being same as the rest of us. You could just as easily say being Man he had ample reason to sin. But in fact the Bible tells us he did not.

He didn't need to be unmarried to be set apart, and His being married would be no more distracting than his wearing sandals, or having a sword, or having tools-all things that are likely, but not mentioned in the Bible.

And some would say that, at the time, His speaking to the woman at the well might be viewed as "sin," in the strictly Hebraic definition of the word, as would His overturning the moneylender's tables at the Temple, and beating them.

Sabbath day – the seventh day of the week. Sunday is the day chosen by Christians to meet and worship; it does come every seven days. Considering your dislike of dogma, would you like to defend the likelihood that with all the chaos in calendars, and dark ages peasant/serf work requirements, we even know for sure if we are still on the same schedule as the Jews of biblical times? Even so, worshiping on Sunday is worshiping every seven days.

Saturday is the seventh day of the week. Not to be "dogmatic" or anything, but that's why Jews still use it as the Sabbath, and it was the day that Jesus kept: the "Last Supper," Holy Communion, was, in fact, a Passover Seder..... No matter.

Assured.
John 10:28-29 and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand.

1 John 5:13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

Not assured:

See then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God’s kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness; otherwise you too will be cut off" Rom. 11:22

Or wretched … neither definition I believe, accurately describes the King James Bible. I don't believe there are better translations.
But perhaps you could share some English translations that you think are more correct?

I never said there was a better English translation.

LOL First of all, your 68 degree rule describes a fact with two different perceptions of reality. You need to define your “truth” it you want to say that you have stated truth and fact which I don’t accept. I or anyone else can as easily say that to you about my/our own beliefs. But in fact, we, as you, would be using your rule to simply mask what is going on; experiencing two different perceptions of a fact, not two different truths.

No, two different truths: one person is sweating, and the other has goose bumps.

One is "hot."

One is "cold."

Truth is perception.The temperature is 68 degrees.


Two truths, one fact.

I wouldn't say belief in a Bible that was not accurate is a small thing. I think Bibles that are not in fact God's inspired words, can cause doubt and lead people astray, and perhaps keep them from being saved.

I believe that none of them are, in fact, God's inspired words.

"Inspired words." Sure. "Inspired by God?" Maybe. Does it matter?

Nope. Look again at Luke 10:25-37, the Good Samaritan story. Answer these questions: What was a Samaritan? Can a man never have heard of Jesus and be assured of salvation? What does this story mean?

Interesting story on the Jehovah's Witnesses. Did you in fact talk to them and show them how you thought they were misguided?

Even worse: I used scripture to talk them right out of their panties!

I mean, they were "there for me," right? :lfao:

Not too much later on, I used the same strategy on Baptists, Methodists, Presbyterians, a Mennonite (SCORE!), Catholics and more Catholics....never did get anywhere near a Mormon girl to try it.....a Maronite Christian from Lebanon, though....etc., etc., etc.....

Would you still think them misguided, or do you think your father was?

My father had, as you do, the strength of his belief. In the end, that's not a small thing, and all I think that matters.

Where do you think your father and grandfather are now?

Wherever they believed they deserved to be.

Where do you think you will be when you die?

Precisely where I believe I deserve to be.

Did you at any time sincerely accept Jesus into your heart and ask God to save you?

For most of my childhood, with death mere rattly breaths away, every day....

Again I would appreciate you listing some of the “quite a few” English translations that you say are more accurate. I don’t think that is a correct statement, but can’t properly evaluate it without knowing what translations you are referring to.

Quite a few translations. Not English-still interested?