"I can't train with that person" x100

skribs114 134

Grandmaster
This is a bit of a rant, but I'm curious for others who've been in this situation, how you've handled it. This is specifically in the kid's classes. We've gotten to a point in our kids BJJ program right now, where it seems like there's more kids that can't train with each other than can.
  • Friends/siblings that get too emotional when they roll
  • The intense/competitive kids (who can't temper their rolls) with the more casual/sensitive kids
  • The >100 lb. kids and the <50 lb. kids (especially the one kid who's the smallest in the class who always picks kids 3x his size, even against coach's instructions)
  • The specific kids who have annoyed themselves out of the graces of others and they don't want to roll with them anymore
  • As mentioned in a previous thread, coaches can no longer roll with students at my gym, which further limits this
And of course, the kids that are not allowed to roll with each other (i.e. siblings that get too emotional during rolls with each other) are always the last ones to find a partner, and so then you have to spend time breaking up other groups, and then they get upset because they chose a training partner they wanted to roll with, or they already trained with the kid you're trying to find a partner for and so you need to split up even more.

Yesterday it got to a point where we just had to have around 6 kids sit out for the last round, because we didn't have the time to micromanage the rolls.

I get that there's going to be one-offs and specific situations where kids can't roll with each other. But it's gotten the point of ridiculousness. Have you ever had this become a big issue? If so, how have you resolved it?
 
Don't micromanage it. Supervise it. Other than massive size mismatch (120 lb vs 45 lb, for example), or other situations where there is a real safety issue (you can't expect a kid early in their training to handle someone 2x or 1/2 their size safely... gravity is just a thing, and there's probably a big age disparity in those cases, too)... let them work it out. Monitor the potential problems more closely, step in to slow them them down and help them learn to temper things... But otherwise -- let them work it out. If they're taking too long, throw 'em together yourself. If finding new partners or finding a partner takes more than the rest time, they need to be coached on how to pair up on their own quickly.
 
One method I have seen used.... have everyone make 2 circles one inside the other..... (make 2 lines.... pair them off and have the pairs make a circle....) The person on the inside is always on the inside, the person on the outside is always on the outside.... everyone faces their partner, then moves two places to their right.... (the circles move in opposite directions, since they are facing each other)... then roll.... when the roll is over, they get back in the circle and everyone moves two places to the right.

Its simple, easy and quick to do.... it is just hard enough for them to be able to plan to avoid or match up with a specific person, since both lines move opposite.... and you could vary it.... move three places this time or move one place this time..... if you need to help people miss each other....
 
One method I have seen used.... have everyone make 2 circles one inside the other..... (make 2 lines.... pair them off and have the pairs make a circle....) The person on the inside is always on the inside, the person on the outside is always on the outside.... everyone faces their partner, then moves two places to their right.... (the circles move in opposite directions, since they are facing each other)... then roll.... when the roll is over, they get back in the circle and everyone moves two places to the right.

Its simple, easy and quick to do.... it is just hard enough for them to be able to plan to avoid or match up with a specific person, since both lines move opposite.... and you could vary it.... move three places this time or move one place this time..... if you need to help people miss each other....
The problem is this doesn't fix the underlying issue. The underlying issue is that you have big people and small people that by your system could get matched together. The underlying issue is that you have kids that start crying mid-round when they're training with specific other kids (such as their brother) and are therefore not allowed to train together. Your system would not stop those exchanges from happening. If anything, it would exacerbate it.

This is like saying I have a problem when spark meets gasoline, and your solution is to randomly select and hope that spark and gasoline don't mix.
 
The problem is this doesn't fix the underlying issue. The underlying issue is that you have big people and small people that by your system could get matched together. The underlying issue is that you have kids that start crying mid-round when they're training with specific other kids (such as their brother) and are therefore not allowed to train together. Your system would not stop those exchanges from happening. If anything, it would exacerbate it.

This is like saying I have a problem when spark meets gasoline, and your solution is to randomly select and hope that spark and gasoline don't mix.
As the adult watching.... you can count ahead and see who will match up with who.... and then change the number of places to move accordingly.... the students still think it is random.

You are right, it depends on how many problem students you have to manage.....
 
... let them work it out. Monitor the potential problems more closely, step in to slow them them down and help them learn to temper things...
Sometimes we try this. Sometimes it's the parents saying they can't roll together. Sometimes there's been an incident and a parent has been really upset. Sometimes the coaches are just tired of the same two kids causing problems every time they roll.
But otherwise -- let them work it out. If they're taking too long, throw 'em together yourself. If finding new partners or finding a partner takes more than the rest time, they need to be coached on how to pair up on their own quickly.
Again, we try. But the one kid we've spent the last several months telling him to pick partners his size, and he always picks the biggest. We pair a big kid with a big kid, and then turn around and he's told one of the big kids to go away so he can roll with the big kid.

Every time there's a kid that's either picky or has a rule about who they can train with and they're the last kid, we tell them they need to find someone faster. But they don't. (This attitude is probably a part of why they get so emotional during rolls).

It's incredibly frustrating. It's not bad when it's just one pair of kids. But yesterday it seemed like it was half the class.
 
This may come across quite blunt, but I mean it with respect.


It's Your class. Why are the kids and/or parents dictating to you who they can roll with?
Aside from the size issue, which is to do with safety, those who have issues rolling with certain others need to learn to deal with it. Martial Arts practice is often touted as great for kids because it develops confidence, respect etc. These qualities dont just magically appear once you reach X belt. They are forged through having to deal with other people, even if its people they dont like - because that's life, and its going to be a reoccuring thing through their lives.
 
Sometimes we try this. Sometimes it's the parents saying they can't roll together. Sometimes there's been an incident and a parent has been really upset. Sometimes the coaches are just tired of the same two kids causing problems every time they roll.
Who's the coach? Are the parents instructors? This is no different than the parent telling the soccer coach that their child should be in goal or trying to dictate the lineup to a Little League coach. For the cases where there have been incidents... you handle the pairing for those individuals. Repeated problem children (pun intended) need to be addressed other ways. Maybe they need to spend the rolling time doing push-ups... or rolling with senior belts who can correct them.
Again, we try. But the one kid we've spent the last several months telling him to pick partners his size, and he always picks the biggest. We pair a big kid with a big kid, and then turn around and he's told one of the big kids to go away so he can roll with the big kid.

Every time there's a kid that's either picky or has a rule about who they can train with and they're the last kid, we tell them they need to find someone faster. But they don't. (This attitude is probably a part of why they get so emotional during rolls).

It's incredibly frustrating. It's not bad when it's just one pair of kids. But yesterday it seemed like it was half the class.
If there are so many that it becomes that big of a problem -- address the underlying issue. Stop the rolling and work very controlled drills until they get their act together. Or consider treating it like a game of musical chairs. If little Timmy doesn't pick a partner fast enough or disrupts a selected pairing, little Timmy sits out the roll, and does some exercise or activity instead. In other words, it's not a way to get a break; the filler activity should discourage taking too long.
 
Who's the coach? Are the parents instructors?
I had a talk with my professor (who was out the day in question) and he said the same thing. Now that I think about it, he's said the same thing in the past to the coach who was running class that day.

He did say there are specific ones we need to separate. Mostly either because of size or because the coaches have recognized the problem. There was one girl in particular he said should only go with people her size or bigger that actually know how to jiu-jitsu. But he named a few of the groups and said they can train together.

He said it's different if a parent comes to a coach and talks to the coach, but even then the coaches don't have to listen to the parents, because its not their class.
 
Reason # 758 that I don’t teach kids under 18 unless the parent trains with them. No spectators allowed. Solves lots of problems. No I don’t babysit. No you can’t watch, but you can participate. Then again, I don’t care about having a business model that makes money. I feel for you and certainly wish you the very best in your endeavors.
 
The problem is this doesn't fix the underlying issue. The underlying issue is that you have big people and small people that by your system could get matched together. The underlying issue is that you have kids that start crying mid-round when they're training with specific other kids (such as their brother) and are therefore not allowed to train together. Your system would not stop those exchanges from happening. If anything, it would exacerbate it.

This is like saying I have a problem when spark meets gasoline, and your solution is to randomly select and hope that spark and gasoline don't mix.
It’s hard with kids and sometimes you just have to tell them that you do NOT get to pick your opponent on the street and that life is not always fair.
Win some. Lose some.

Maybe conduct the two circle randomization drills as listed above (that’s also similar to how we did it in the Army) while limiting what moves the big guys can use rather than full out winner-takes-all rolls?
Or maybe “sell it” as beginner circle (small guys) and an experienced circle (big guys) and have the experienced guys critique their smaller opponents on what they should do differently to pin a big guy?

Every “solution” I come up with seems to make the problem worse.
If you set it up so that the bigger guys fight more people until exhausted before taking on a smaller guy, the bigger guys get more practice and will probably advance exponentially compared to the smaller guys.
The same if you make the big kids “junior instructors” for the little ones.
The big guys start REALLY understanding what they’re doing and will start progressing geometrically while the smaller guys may stay on a more linear trajectory.


Here’s what ChatGPT had to say when I plugged in your post.
I kinda liked the number 6 idea…

This situation is very common in kids’ BJJ and karate programs, and it usually means the class has reached a size where informal partner selection no longer works. The solution isn’t more micromanaging — it’s removing choice and adding structure.

1. Assign partners instead of letting kids choose.
Have the kids line up by size or belt and pair them off: 1–2, 3–4, 5–6, etc. If two kids can’t train together, just skip a spot and rotate. This removes emotional partner choices, social exclusions, and wasted time negotiating.

2. Use a rotation system.
Set up a system where one line stays and the other line rotates to the right each round. This guarantees everyone trains and automatically separates problem pairs. Some gyms also use “king line” rotations where winners move up and losers move down.

3. Divide the class into rough size bands.
Big size mismatches create a lot of problems. You don’t need exact weights, just visual groups such as:
- Group A: under ~60 lb
- Group B: 60–85 lb
- Group C: 85–120 lb
Keeping similar sizes together prevents dangerous mismatches and reduces anxiety.

4. Give problem kids fixed partners temporarily.
If there are siblings or kids who get emotional with certain partners, assign them the same partner for a few weeks. This removes the daily partner search and stabilizes the situation.

5. Separate technique partners from rolling partners.
During drilling, use assigned partners. During rolling rounds, use a rotation system. This keeps things organized while still giving kids variety.

6. Use three-person groups when numbers are awkward.
If the class can’t divide evenly, make groups of three:
- A vs B (C rests)
- B vs C (A rests)
- A vs C (B rests)

Nobody sits out long and the coach doesn’t have to constantly reshuffle pairs.

7. Manage the “tiny fearless kid” problem.
Most gyms have a very small kid who always tries to roll with someone much larger. Create a rule that kids can only choose partners within their size group. If they refuse, the coach assigns the partner.

8. Use positional sparring for emotional or sensitive kids.
Instead of full rolling, start them in specific positions such as mount, guard, or side control. This gives them structure and reduces chaotic intensity.

9. Address the social exclusion issue directly.
When kids refuse to roll with someone, it becomes a culture issue. A common rule in many gyms is: “In this gym we train with everyone.” Exceptions should only be made for size or safety reasons.

The real issue is that the program has grown to the point where casual partner selection no longer works. Most successful kids programs switch to structured rotations once the class gets beyond about 12–15 students.

A simple system many gyms use is:
Line kids up by size → pair neighbors → rotate one line each round.

No negotiation. No drama. Everyone trains.

A simple trick many kids’ programs use to stop the “nobody wants to roll with that kid” problem is something often called the Coach’s Choice Round (sometimes “Random Partner Round”).

At least once every class:

1. Everyone lines up.
2. Nobody chooses partners.
3. The coach assigns partners quickly.

An easy way to do it is to number the kids (1, 2, 3, 4, etc.) and then pair them like this:
- 1 with 6
- 2 with 5
- 3 with 4

Or you can simply draw names. No discussion and no negotiation.

Why it works:

It removes the social signaling that causes the problem. Kids don’t feel like they were chosen last or rejected. Instead, the message becomes: “The coach paired us.” That protects everyone’s ego and keeps things moving.

An even better variation is the “Secret Mission Round.”

Tell the kids: “During this round your mission is to help your partner get better.”

Examples:
- Let them practice a sweep
- Give realistic resistance
- Encourage them if they succeed

Kids suddenly treat partners differently because the focus shifts from “who I want to roll with” to “how well I help my partner.”

Another useful option is a “Skill Mission Round.”

Give both partners a specific task:
- Top person: maintain position
- Bottom person: escape

Now the focus becomes the task rather than the partner, which removes a lot of emotional friction.

The real issue your friend is describing happens in almost every kids program once the class grows and social dynamics start to form. The usual solution is simple: less choice and more structure.

Kids actually relax when the system is predictable.

One rule that helps set the culture is:
“You don’t pick training partners. Training partners pick you.”

In other words, anyone in the room is a valid partner.

Kids almost never complain about assigned partners if the rule is consistent. The problems usually appear when sometimes they choose partners and sometimes they don’t. Consistency fixes most of it.
 
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