Hypothetical Scenario: Extracting yourself from a deteriorating situation

[Xinglu]

Shoot rates vary. Nude work in WNY is free and up. But, we digress.

I've talked to models who checked references, got all the right answers, yet ended up creeped out, and in 2 cases raped. Now, the "big news" cases you hear about are rarely the casual "just met" internet model thing, but established folks, sometimes with history between them. So, there are alot of variables here to consider.

Of course they very, I gave the average rate. Any model that does nudes for "Free" are suckers, or getting something else (barter, like she retains portfolio rights and get prints in exchange for modeling) and thus it is not free.

All of those cases could have been prevented if she had a professional escort with her. As I said, any photographer who objects to a professional escort being there should send bells and whistles and alarms off in the models head. IF nothing unprofessional or dubious is going on, then what is the problem with a guy sitting in the corner watching the shoot if that is what makes the model comfortable and happy?

 

[Xinglu]

Not all of these situations involve the photographer being hired. Often he or she is doing it to build a portfolio/on spec. In that case it does indeed come out of his pocket.

I already addressed that.

Furthermore, any hobbyist who is looking to become pro and is building their portfolio should conduct themselves as a professional and provide services as such. Anything less is not only unprofessional but will make it exponentially harder for them to get work, build a positive reputation, and /or establish any credibility in the field.

Anything less then complete professionalism is unacceptable. Having her escort there covers her rear and YOUR rear as the photographer.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

What other jobs allow escorts?

Last I looked, Playboy and Sports Illustrated don't allow escorts at shoots.

 

[jks9199]

I haven't had time to really give this some thought -- but I do have a couple of thoughts.

First, I think it's a good idea for the model & photographer to meet somewhere public BEFORE the photo shoot. If either gets a bad feeling, there's no need to go further.

Second, it's not practical to have an escort/chaperone/aid at every shoot. For a model doing his/her first nudes, it may be uncomfortable and distraction, for example. But you can backstop in various ways, without having another person present. Begin by making sure that someone else knows the time & location of the shoot -- and when it will end. That way, someone knows where you are -- and when you should be back. I'd also consider perhaps keeping a digital recorder (video or audio) running throughout the shoot, if practical. No -- it won't stop anything, but will provide evidence. (And it might deter some stupidity.) A written outline/storyboard of the shoot would also be a good idea, I'd think. It doesn't have to be so locked tight that there's no room for creativity -- but it should be enough to give both an idea where the lines are planned to be... and know when to say STOP!

You asked about extricating... but the truth is that it's a lot like a choke hold. If you wait till it's locked on -- you can't escape. You've got to recognize it, and stop it before it goes too far -- or walk away.

 

[Xinglu]

What other jobs allow escorts?

Last I looked, Playboy and Sports Illustrated don't allow escorts at shoots.

This is because they as the company provide the security. Furthermore it is not a closed set with a stylist and makeup artists on set.

What do you mean by jobs? Occupations or types of photo sessions?

 

[Carol]

Wow, those sound like some excellent ideas JKS :asian:

. I'd also consider perhaps keeping a digital recorder (video or audio) running throughout the shoot, if practical. No -- it won't stop anything, but will provide evidence. (And it might deter some stupidity.)

Neither one of us are attorneys, but I'd like to expand on this a bit.

In general, as long as both/all parties involved know the recorder is there (all party consent), such a recording can often be evidenciary in court. If the recording device is concealed so so only one person knows its there (single party consent), such evidence is often dismissed as hearsay (this assumes a CALEA/court order is not in place) and may even be illegal -- although prosecutions for this type of wiretapping are rare.

Once the recorder is going, the other party doesn't have to like that it is there, or even agree to it being there, he just needs to know its there and running. (Hint: its a good idea to have this on tape).

 

[Xinglu]

Second, it's not practical to have an escort/chaperone/aid at every shoot. For a model doing his/her first nudes, it may be uncomfortable and distraction, for example.

Any model willing to take their clothes off, be seen by multiple people on set nude (to include the client), and have their nude image published is not going to care if someone providing security for THEM sees anything. Furthermore if this a nude portfolio work, and she expects any work, she needs to get over being shy regarding being seen nude. There is no room for prudishness about who sees you nude when you are a nude model.

At my wife's studio not every model brings an escort (unless it is their agency's SOP), her studio has a great reputation, and in all shoots there are at least 5 other people on set (not including the client who may or may not be there). She does everything from nudes to just product and no model. But EVERY-TIME a new model comes in, she brings an escort. She is encouraged to by us as well because we want her to feel comfortable and safe.

 

[Xinglu]

Recording the photo-shoot... No photographer would ever agree to this, and if she was ever found hiding a camera to record the shoot, she would never work for anyone again. No photographer would hire her. The agency would drop her because they wouldn't want the photographers to think that their agency condones espionage and not going to them for models. Furthermore, it does not PREVENT the rape from occurring in the first place. She is better off having an escort and a call plan. Which provides eye witness account that is admissible in court, prevention via force (just being there), the possibility of rescue (someone is there to respond) and third parties to investigate if something went wildly wrong and both she and the escort where incapacitated.

How is that not practical? At the very least it could be a friend that you trust to be professional.

 

[jks9199]

Wow, those sound like some excellent ideas JKS :asian:



Neither one of us are attorneys, but I'd like to expand on this a bit.

In general, as long as both/all parties involved know the recorder is there (all party consent), such a recording can often be evidenciary in court. If the recording device is concealed so so only one person knows its there (single party consent), such evidence is often dismissed as hearsay (this assumes a CALEA/court order is not in place) and may even be illegal -- although prosecutions for this type of wiretapping are rare.

Once the recorder is going, the other party doesn't have to like that it is there, or even agree to it being there, he just needs to know its there and running. (Hint: its a good idea to have this on tape).

Great point. I'm used to Virginia being a one-party consent state -- and the simple fact that, as a general rule, if I'm recording something, the recording is often legal by definition. But then, I get to play by a different set of rules.

Any model willing to take their clothes off, be seen by multiple people on set nude (to include the client), and have their nude image published is not going to care if someone providing security for THEM sees anything. Furthermore if this a nude portfolio work, and she expects any work, she needs to get over being shy regarding being seen nude. There is no room for prudishness about who sees you nude when you are a nude model.

It's easy to say this -- but something that seems like it's an OK idea when you're setting it up and clothed can sometimes seem a lot less comfortable in reality. I'd expect that after the first couple of times, it's no big deal... but that first time or two? Maybe a little more uncomfortable.

 

[Xinglu]

Great point. I'm used to Virginia being a one-party consent state -- and the simple fact that, as a general rule, if I'm recording something, the recording is often legal by definition. But then, I get to play by a different set of rules.


It's easy to say this -- but something that seems like it's an OK idea when you're setting it up and clothed can sometimes seem a lot less comfortable in reality. I'd expect that after the first couple of times, it's no big deal... but that first time or two? Maybe a little more uncomfortable.

Having put my wife through photography school, I can tell you first hand - the models building nude portfolios don't care who sees them, and more often then not enjoy the attention it brings. Even their first or second time. In fact, most of these nude models are exhibitionist by nature and have been on film of one kind or another before they take any professional shots. They don't just wake up one day and say, "Self, me thinks nude modeling might be for me. Lets have a go at it!" It is a mentality and a mindset. Having worked with many of them of both genders and from "rookies" to "seasoned salts" I'm telling you first hand. We have had first time topless to playmates doing nude shots. And the only thing "rookies" are worried about is if their breasts are big enough.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

I'd like to keep this from becoming an escort debate.

While I agree with you that models, especially when shooting for the first time should have an escort, it's not always practical and it's not always allowed. Not every photographer who says no to them is a creep. He/she might simply have been burned by them somehow in the past.

Also, and I hope the LEO's reading can correct me if I'm wrong, but it only takes a second or 3 for someone with a stun gun to zap someone. If I have 2 tasers, I can quickly immobilize both a model and her escort, and now as a bad guy, I get twice the 'fun'. Last 3 nude shoots I did, the models escorts were petite friends of theirs. Not much of a deterrent.

The scope of my questioning here isn't to debate escorts, but to build a resource of ideas, tips and tricks on how to avoid sticky situations, and how to get out of them when they happen.

Sample of the article I'm assembling, in part based on this discussion.
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New Model Safety Tips
By Bob Hubbard

Modeling is normally a safe activity. Unfortunately, there are a number of unsavory characters out there who will prey on those who are vulnerable. Some shoots can place you in a vulnerable position. So, here are some tips I've collected from various photography and model sites to help ensure your safety.

Do your research into your Photographer.

* Check references with other models he or she has shot. Pay attention to how they say things too.
* Make sure you see examples of their work and look for specific examples of what they want to use you for.
* Check the National Sex Offender Registry : http://www12.familywatchdog.us/
* Use Google or another search engine to look up their name.
* Check on professional modeling sites such as OneModelPlace, ModelMayhem, etc. for information.
* Check “The New Model's Guide to the Industry and Scams” at http://www.modelmayhem.com/po.php?thread_id=275824 for information on scams and how to avoid being a victim of one.
* Find out as much as you can about those you are considering working with. Ask around.
* Be certain to get a verifiable home and/or studio phone number, and street address, for anyone you work with. Especially if you are meeting somewhere
* If a photographer say's he shoots for a certain magazine......look in the magazine and see if his name is in the masthead.. If it isn't, call the magazine to verify him. If they don't know him, drop him/her immediately.

Protect your Privacy.

* Never post personal contact information, such as address and phone number in an area where the public will view it (such as websites, message boards...etc).
* Be very careful regarding posts and e-mail from anyone with a generic (hotmail, yahoo, etc.) e-mail address.
* Be wary of unprofessional posts and emails.
* A private area should be provided for you to change outfits. Remember, you are there to do a shoot, not a striptease.

Protect Yourself on Shoots

* Be very clear about what kind of work you are looking for, and what kind of work you will not accept.
* Never travel on a shoestring and have a back-up plan if things don't work out exactly as planned.
* Especially when working with someone new, if possible, bring along a chaperone to the photo shoot. Any professional photographer should not have a problem with this. Do NOT work with anyone who refuses to allow you to. Many photographers have horror stories about escorts and are very set against allowing them on set during a shoot. They should have no problem however with someone dropping you off and waiting outside the studio.
* Arrive at remote shoots separately.
* Let someone know where you will be at all times.
* Be sure to check in with someone when you arrive, when you leave, when you change locations, and during breaks.
* Know what your limits are as to what you will do, and stick with them. Make certain that both you and the photographer are well aware of them. Leave if the photographer insists you go beyond them. (IE: Do nude when you don't want to.)
* Home studios are fine, just make sure that there is a separate changing area, with a lock. Always check your surroundings. Check for exits etc.
* Be cautious when dealing with photographers who want you to break the law, trespass, or put yourself into vulnerable and compromising situations. Sure the photographer can pay your fine, but the police record will remain yours regardless.
* Ask the photographer about their insurance coverage. Many photographers are uninsured amateurs. While competent photographers, shooting with an uninsured photographer could be a headache should something go wrong during the shoot.

Protect your Future

* Don't do anything that you might be sorry for later. What you do today can affect your career later down the road. "If you pose for a photo that you cannot show your family and friends, and be proud of it, it wasn't worth doing". Mainly YOU should be proud of it.
* There should always be a modeling agreement "release" signed before the shoot, some might prefer after. As long as you get one it should be ok. Make sure in the agreement that you have knowledge of where and how your images are going to be displayed. Try to have full say in this.... If at all possible.
* Again regarding modeling releases, these are to protect you and the photographer. You want to have things in writing, as verbal agreements rarely hold up in court.

Modeling is a safe, fun and often financially rewarding activity. Use clear thinking and common sense while doing it and you'll have a long, safe and enjoyable career.

=====

Bob Hubbard is a Buffalo NY based photographer focusing on martial arts, event, portrait and fine art photography. His work has appeared on several leading websites. Bob can be reached through his web sites bobhubbardphotography.com and martialphotos.com.

 

[girlbug2]

The model should never be alone with the photographer. Just as a doctor always has a nurse present, so should the model have someone there with them. Just way to risky being alone. Not only for the model but the photographer (they to can be accused falsely of sexual assault.)

It’s just not professional of either one involved.

Deaf

Agreed. The experienced professional probably has this all down cold. But how would a 15 year old model know any of this? (that is a pretty typical age for fashion models at least).

 

[jks9199]

Looks good, Bob. One suggestion: Any studio with a changing area and a lock can easily become a trap! You may want to elaborate that they want a lock that the model controls... I'm not sure on the wording, but I think you can see the point I'm making.

 

[jks9199]

Agreed. The experienced professional probably has this all down cold. But how would a 15 year old model know any of this? (that is a pretty typical age for fashion models at least).

A fifteen year old shouldn't be alone with the photographer PERIOD. Anytime a minor is involved -- there should be an adult present on their behalf. That should just be a given! And that's one circumstance that waiting outside is unacceptable.

And any photographer doing nudes of children needs to really, really know what they are doing. The baby-in-the-bathtub is one thing... but nudes beyond that sort of thing really can go into very bad territory very quickly. Even if they're supposed to be "art." The line between child porn and art is vanishingly small -- and often only the opinion of a prosecutor or judge.

 

[MJS]

I'm working on an article on model safety and am looking for some expert advice.

Here is the basic scenario:
A model is alone with a photographer, who is pushing for things to go further than the model is comfortable. They could be in a remote location, or in the photographers downtown studio. The model is alone, and in a state of undress, possibly nude. Photographer is increasingly insistent on model shooting nude, shooting explicit, or engaging in sexual activities with him.

What are the models options, and what can they do to hopefully safely extract themselves from this situation?

Also, what could they do to avoid this from happening in the future?

I would say that before she even puts herself in a position like that, make sure that she knows as much as possible about the photographer. Now, this isn't to say that deep down, the guy could be a nut, but knowing who you're getting shot by is important IMO. Is he some fly by night person or does he work for a reputable company with a proven track record? What do other models have to say about the photographer or the co. he works for? Has anyone else ever been pressured into doing something they didn't want to before?

I would suggest being firm about what you are willing to do/not do. If he is not taking no for an answer, then the session is over. She gets dressed and leaves. If he refuses to let her leave, now he is holding her against her will and anything goes IMO. If it means grabbing something to use as a weapon, then so be it.

Other options are to always make sure you let someone know your schedule. Time of the shoot, location of the shoot, who will be at the shoot, etc. Make contact with someone when you're done with the shoot. Have someone with you during the shoot. Doesn't have to be in the same room, but in the next room, outside, etc.

 

[MJS]

Photographers dislike escorts for a number of reasons. They are a distraction, they can be violent, jealous types. They can steal from the photographer. They can be a legal liability, and a financial drain. They can be a creative buzz kill. Etc.

Assistants are great, when you can afford one, and when they are actually useful.

Well, I say too damn bad. Both people need each other. If the girls dont go to him, he gets no business. If they don't like his terms, they dont get paid and have to find someone else.

I posted my first post before I read this one, but I did address this issue there. I'd say at the least, someone should be able to be outside in the car or in another room. But someone should be nearby.

 

[MJS]

What other jobs allow escorts?

Last I looked, Playboy and Sports Illustrated don't allow escorts at shoots.

With SI, we already know there is no nudity and with Playboy we know its not as graphic or explicit as some of the other magazines, so I would think that the photographers would not even make an attempt to suggest anything more.

Heres a question....with the scenario you originally gave vs. the ones in this post, what are the odds that there will be more than just the girl and the photographer in the room, the set, or where ever?

 

[joeygil]

One more strategy one could use when things look like they're getting dicey. Grab the photog's gear.

I'd imagine this would be more of an issue with a non-pro shooter, in which case gear is very precious. Threatening to damage a $1700 lens or $8000 camera might make somebody come to their senses (or get more enraged...).

"We are done, and if you don't let me go right now, your 1Ds / strobe / 70-200 2.8L IS is flying across the room."

 

[Bob Hubbard]

With SI, we already know there is no nudity and with Playboy we know its not as graphic or explicit as some of the other magazines, so I would think that the photographers would not even make an attempt to suggest anything more.

Heres a question....with the scenario you originally gave vs. the ones in this post, what are the odds that there will be more than just the girl and the photographer in the room, the set, or where ever?

SI does have nudity, it's just that they are covered in paint, or it's done implied.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

If you want to bring an escort to protect you.., don't bother. I'll be here and I'll protect you. If you need them for moral support, you don't belong here either. If you need them for a ride, make up, or other 'good' reason, please talk to me early in our conversatons, as I may already have alternatives.

So, in light of the posts so far, what's this message from a photographer say to you?
Note: Not Me.