How long between shodan and nidan?

[Phoenix44]

I was reading the thread on why so many people earn their black belt and then quit, and someone suggested the increasing time between subsequent ranks. Just out of curiosity, in your system, how many years between shodan and nidan for someone who continues to train regularly?

 

[Kennedy_Shogen_Ryu]

With my style you have to be at Shodan for at least 2 years and must be 19 years of age before you can grade to Nidan.
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[Kacey]

Ch'ang H'on (ITF) TKD - the number of years to your next test is equal to the rank you're testing for, so II Dan, two years, III Dan, three years, and so on.

As far as why people quit after I Dan - for many people, black belt is the ultimate goal rather than the beginning that it really should be. For us, the reason why it takes so much longer is because it's harder to change things after you've been doing them longer - the increments of improvement are smaller and harder to create.

Think about how much difference you can see in technique between a first night student and a student who has tested for whatever your first belt is - then think about the difference between a I Dan and a II Dan. Which one shows more differences? Because there is so much to learn as a new student, growth is seen quickly and then levels off... by black belt, much of the growth is mental rather than physical, in the sense of understanding the movements that have been practiced for so long rather than purely physical improvement. I'm not sure I'm stating this clearly, so let me know if that makes sense.

 

[stone_dragone]

In my original school, time was about 2 years of continued practice and teaching.

the next major school was one year - time in grade required was equal to the rank (1st Degree for one year then test, 2nd for two then test, 3rd for three and so on).

 

[tellner]

We don't have formal ranks along the Japanese model, but we do have some rough categories.

First is student. You're a student as long as you're coming to class. Over time you end up doing more - working with beginners, explaining things (aka "your day in the barrel" ).

At some point if the teacher decides you're ready to teach under supervision. With us there was a formal ceremony that went like this:

"Guru, are you taking beginning students right now?"
"Maybe, how come?"
"There are some people down in Portland who are interested, but they aren't ready to drive an hour each way to Longview."
"Do you want to start a practice group?"
"Sure."
"OK. Just bring them up once in a while for quality control."

Some time down the road he'll say "Oliver Shagnasty knows the curriculum and understands how to apply the basic principles. I'm making him a guru in Sera."

Maybe some day a bunch of teachers will get together and say "Guru Shagnasty is really, really good. And he's been doing this since Moses was in diapers. If you get a chance you and your senior students should train with him."

The time between these depends entirely on when the teacher or the group of teachers thinks you're ready. There's no formal requirement.

 

[jks9199]

It's a minimum of 3 years in my style between 1st and 2nd level. Time increases after 3rd level, as I recall. Eventually, it's a minimum of 10 years. But I think that issue is a red herring; lots of people get their initial black belt and quit because they see the belt itself as the goal, not as the entry to serious training. It's kind of like the people who run one marathon; their goal was to run that marathon, not to become a marathon runner.

 

[Big Don]

At my school (Parker/Planas lineage Kenpo) there is a four year MINIMUM between Black Belt ranks. Once you acheive Black Belt you must continue to be a student, you must attend seminars, and you must teach, without doing all three, you won't be promoted.

 

[Brian S]

I was reading the thread on why so many people earn their black belt and then quit, and someone suggested the increasing time between subsequent ranks. Just out of curiosity, in your system, how many years between shodan and nidan for someone who continues to train regularly?

Two years minimum as well as completing other criteria in my system of Goju.

 

[charyuop]

Time between ranks is just a silly excuse. If you reach Shodan and start counting the days till next test you defeat the purpose of training. Who assures you that at the end of the two years you are actually ready to test? Learning and improving yourself alone should be the best reward for your achievement. The belt and Dan is just a symbol not something you aim at.


But this is an old story and everyone has his/her own thoughts about it...

 

[Grenadier]

For our system, we have six kyu ranks between shodan and nidan. You have to pass all six kyu ranks to test for nidan, and each such test generally occurs every three or six months, depending on someone's training and attendence. Some people take nine months between each post-shodan kyu exam, although that's rare.

Thus, it generally takes 2-4 years, depending on how much and how well someone trains.

However, it's not the time requirement that stops people from getting to nidan. It's the fact that all too many people see that shodan ranking as the end of the journey. Either that, or they get bored with it.

 

[searcher]

2 years after shodan.

 

[Flying Crane]

Time between ranks is just a silly excuse. If you reach Shodan and start counting the days till next test you defeat the purpose of training. Who assures you that at the end of the two years you are actually ready to test?

well, I don't think anyone here is suggesting that the next rank is guaranteed after the time requirement. I think it hinges upon showing the appropriate skill and knowledge level for the rank, in addition to the minimum time period. If the time goes by and you still don't merit the rank, you don't get it. Maybe another year, or maybe never. On the flip side, if you learn the required material quickly, that also isn't enough. So a minimum time requirement is instituted to help ensure the material has time to really sink in and the skills develop appropriately.

When people are talking about these minimums, I think it's never implied that it's guaranteed. This is only one factor of many that go into the decision to issue higher rank.

 

[searcher]

well, I don't think anyone here is suggesting that the next rank is guaranteed after the time requirement. I think it hinges upon showing the appropriate skill and knowledge level for the rank, in addition to the minimum time period. If the time goes by and you still don't merit the rank, you don't get it. Maybe another year, or maybe never. On the flip side, if you learn the required material quickly, that also isn't enough. So a minimum time requirement is instituted to help ensure the material has time to really sink in and the skills develop appropriately.

When people are talking about these minimums, I think it's never implied that it's guaranteed. This is only one factor of many that go into the decision to issue higher rank.

Exactly. Our time frame is a MINIMUM and is NEVER a definate. All time in grade is just a rough estimate.

 

[Brandon Fisher]

1.5 to 2 years between shodan and nidan
2 to 3 years for sandan
3 years to yondan
4 years to godan
4.5 to 5 years for rokudan
6 to 7 years to Nanadan
7 to 8 years for hachidan
8 - 9 years for kyudan
9 - 10 years to Judan

This is the normal minimum time but there have been some exceptions.

 

[14 Kempo]

2.0 - 2.5 years Shodan to Nidan, as a minimum, for normal students. It can be faster if you're teaching. Ranks are not given for "Time in rank", it is given when deserving. I believe there should always me a minimum time, but a person should always be flexible. Meaning that if a person is teaching, it normally means they have a better understanding of material and that they are working the material more than the average student and therefore the time may be shortened.

Furthermore, I believe where I came from, a person would need to either rank Shodan to Nidan within 5 years, or re-certify for current rank. I don't know if those time limits changed as higher ranks were obtained.

 

[JWLuiza]

We average six years between shodan and nidan. Average another 5 or so for nidan to samdan. 4 or so after that.