Do you practice a "style" or a "system"?

[geezer]

One of my old sifus used to proudly insist that the martial art he taught was a "system" and not "just a style". From his perspective, a "style" was just a collection of techniques that had their own mannerisms and flourishes, and were arbitrarily adopted the way you might adopt a "style" of dress, speech or behavior. A "system" by contrast had to rationally reflect its core concepts and foundation. So a style could include any number of techniques adapted from different martial arts. It might, for example, include some hard, force-against-force blocking, and soft, yielding and deflecting. A "system" on the other hand, would select and train only those techniques that integrate together best accomplish it's concept of combat. In a "system" each movement must work with the others like clockwork or gears in an efficient machine. For any given situation, there would be only one "best" solution... if all the factors such as energy, angle, etc. were identical.

Over the years, I've trained in arts that fit into both of these categories. I began with an eclectic branch of kempo... definitely a "style" including many diverse sub-styles that sometimes worked in contradictory ways. Then I took up Wing Chun/ Wing Tsun. Very tightly defined...much more of a "system". Now I'm studying DTE Eskrima with Master Martin Torres. This art has elements of both system and style. It has the concise logical quality of a system, yet each of the advanced students applies the techniques differently, since they all previously trained to a high level in other arts. In that sense, it's kind of like JKD...

So, enough about me. How about you guys...do you consider your martial art a "style" or "system" according to this definition???

 

[bostonbomber]

This is a good question.

I practice Hung Kuen and I would definitely characterize it as a system, moreover, a "complete system". Its foundation, the 12 Bridge Hands, provide a set of principles on which our movements are based. It is this idea of foundation principles that distinguish an art as a "system" rather than a "style". I would regard the more performance-oriented arts as styles. Just my two cents.

 

[JadecloudAlchemist]

I would say system because it fits this:

(2): the body considered as a functional unit

and this:

1: a regularly interacting or interdependent group of items forming a unified whole

Within the system there can be a certain style to achieve the results of the system.

Now my head hurts from all this thinking:uhyeah:

 

[Drac]

Combat Hapkido called the system of self defense..

 

[kaizasosei]

A style has to do with form and soul. I would think of different types of dance as being styles of movement, but any movement will inherrently carry style. Taekwondo kicks are of a certain character or style and also require certain amount of flexibilty to achieve the form. Some martial arts try to be fluid, others more rigid, for example. There is a certain balance that is present in the movements of all martial arts as well as sports.-In martial arts especially, it is very similarily to dance, extremely important how exactly one moves.

A system i see as having to do with principles and sets forth patterns that can be applied to realistic situations. A breakdancer may have a system as to how he spins on his head or performs a windmill, but once he performs, the style and balance of the action will be more relevant as the act of headspining is usually done to display skill rather than any immediate practical purpose. So to some degree style does have to do with form, strength, integrity, endurance,

All martial arts rely on principles such as distance, timing, leverage, etc...
once such principles are internatlized, they become a system that will prove effective in various situations. I believe that codes of behaviour and politeness could also be seen as systems. A system, like a computer system, implies an interface with which information or energy is efficiently transferred.

While a system is often rather mechanical, a style is usually something dependant on the individual persons feelings, perceptions and abilties. Individual teachings also contain style and are transferred by individuals or manuals using language or pictures.

Both system and style in the martial art should not stop at flowery movements, but in the spirit of combat, should be able to have effect as well. The perfect balance would be beautiful impressive movements and effectiveness combined to achieve success in powerful effective techniques.-for example that is what one usually sees in movies.

I would say i practice many systems and have come to develop my own type of style as well as copied many styles from the many systems and examples that i have had contact with.

 

[terryl965]

I would have to say both, since it is classified as a style but the practcal side of it could be called a system of it own.

 

[Deaf Smith]

I've been trained in a 'system'. But this system is of a 'style' of TKD.

Think of the system one studies as being a subset of the style of a particular martial arts.

There are many TKDs, but all of them have kicking/blocking/punching as well as self-defense. Just some of the 'styles' of TKD offer a somewhat different mix. But they do have a system.

This is very true of any style that has fragmented. Example:

How many styles of Kung Fu are there? Do not most of them have a complete 'system' of self-defense?

Oh, and I'm a firm believer and adapting the art, or style to ones own physical abilities and limitations. Sometimes that requires taking techniques and stratagies from other systems to fill in any gaps one has.

Deaf

 

[D.Cobb]

I practice the system of Mei bu Kan. it is a style of Goju Ryu.

Dave

 

[Cirdan]

Very interesting topic.

The way I see it styles are a pretty broad concept defined by the core principles used and the history of the art in question. A system will have more defined solutions and techniques, it might be firmly tied to one style or be a mix. A system taught in a school will also often have a structured curriculum providing a framework for students to advance in skill.

In the end you break free of the system gaining your own unique style eventually leaving even that behind.

I train in the style of Wado Ryu but we have a system that also has a lot of influences from other arts, for instance Tai Chi. It is quite interesting to see how things introduced at different levels build upon each other to improve your understanding of the art, all the while grounded in principles rather than simple technique.

I also train in the Ju Jutsu Norway system, however this feel more like a style because there is not so much difference in what is taught until advanced levels. Rather the focus will be on improving your flow, rtyhm, rooting etc.
(However I hear the high-ups are working on a more defined core system of techniques here also.)

 

[Franc0]

Cool topic with lot's of good replies. Me personally, I practice a "system" which is devised for the individuals application. In the long run, it's no longer the "insert name here" system, it's the individuals system.

Franco

 

[punisher73]

I think that there are "styles" within a system. I think that the style should lay out a basic foundation and contain it's overall strategy and tactics to accomplish that.

The individual might have a particular "style" to implement those tactics and strategy based on his own attributes and training. You can watch two people from the same instructor perform kata and spar differently even though they learned the same material. This was VERY true of early okinawan karate. Each student was taught by the instructor according to their strengths.

I think there also can be a "style" to punching. Korean styles kick just a little different than Japanese styles that kick just a little different than Okinawan styles even though they are all doing the "front snap kick". Same even goes for western boxing, depending on your coach they have their own way to throw certain punches.

 

[tshadowchaser]

I practice styles within a system
The hand movements may contain more than one style as do the kicks, throws, etc. but they all combine to make the system

 

[iwingchun]

Yeap, i practice in Wing Chun System of kung fu! i think that is the best of all martial arts and the more effective!

 

[kidswarrior]

In the end you break free of the system gaining your own unique style eventually leaving even that behind.

Bingo.

 

[harlan]

Both. The style is Goju...and the system is Goju as interpreted/trained by our group.

 

[bostonbomber]

When I first saw this post, I thought it may end up as a discussion on semantics and how each of us interprets the meaning of "system" and "style". (My original reply supports this.)

The importance of this question is that it draws attention to the fact that what many of us (all of us?) are learning are more than simply a collection of techniques and ways of executing them in order to defeat adversaries. Our chosen arts are systematic, organized approaches to fighting, built on core principles that guide our actions and reactions. (When I say principles, I not talking about those things such as timing and speed that are common to all arts.) The principles enable us to react to unexpected behavior and allow us to change dynamically to constantly changing circumstances.

If what we study is a "complete system", then we should be able to apply that system to defeat ANY type of attack: we don't have to learn TKD kicks for the long range, Wing Chun or Bak Mei for the close range, and BJJ for our ground game. Of course this is difficult to do and it is why it takes so long to truly master an art (this is why "Kung fu" is used to describe the art; it means "hard work" and it applies to all martial arts, Chinese, Japanese, Western, whatever).

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

Interesting topic. Interesting partly because it causes one to think a bit about what they do, as most people use ther terms, 'style' and 'system,' interchangeably.

I think that a lot depends upon who you train with. Some instructors put a much more 'stylized' slant into their training, essentially training students in the instructor's style of whatever system he or she originally learned.

Personally, I train in a system, both in taekwondo, hapkido, and kumdo. As I develop my skills and gravitate towards the techniques that work best for me, and develop a way of executing the techniques which is both correct and unique to me, then I gravitate towards practicing my own 'style' of taekwondo, hapkido, or kumdo.

I have been very conscious of this in that there are techniques that simply do not work as well with my body type, but I have strived to learn them so that when I teach, I pass on the system in as correct and accuarte a way as possible. That way, my students can then develop their own styles that work best for them, as opposed to merely copying mine.

Daniel

 

[Josh Oakley]

I haven't been fully able to define style or system. Once I can fully separate the two maybe I'll be able to tell you.