AKKI: Shaping the Future of Kenpo?

[Brother John]

Seems ironic that you're asking, at least in nature, of some of the questions asked of you before. Would you mind listing your;

Experience in the akki and prior martial arts, ie. years studied, rank aquired, etc..
How much time do you have with an akki certified instructor on a monthly basis?
How are you getting the new material being as you haven't been to that many Vegas camps?

DarK LorD

Sorry Clyde, didn't know I'd been asked these things and left them un-answered.((You saw my belt when you met me in person Clyde))

I've progressed slowly and steadily ever since I began...now I'm but a Brown Belt in the AKKI. Proud of it, making No apologies for it....nor bragging about it. I hope to be testing for Black sometime soon, when everything is ready and I can make it to Vegas.
I'll keep you posted if you like.

My first instructor was in 1998, Mr. Rogert W. Taylor, 3rd degree Black Belt and student of Mr. Mills. He himself was first a student under the NCKKA, then later studied in the IKKA under Bruce Thomson (whom is NOW also a personal student of Mr. Mills and one of the seniors of the AKKI), he then moved to L.A. where he went to Mr. Trejo's school....then he got his Black Belt under Mr. Mohammed Tabatabai. Later he was accepted as a personal student of Mr. Mills and was subsequently (through the years) promoted to 2nd and then 3rd Black w/in the AKKI.
I spent many hours every week with Mr. Taylor and benefited a great deal from his insight and experience in Kenpo Karate. I'm forever indebted to him.
Not all that long ago SEVERAL things happened in Mr. Taylor's personal life (Marriage, major carreer change, moved to a different city....etc.) that made it impossible to continue with him. I then began training under Mr. Sean J. Carey and now also under Mr. John Connolly whom flies up to Kansas as often as he can (more often than you'd think) and has given me a WORLD of help and encouragement and instruction along my path.

True: I've not made it to nearly as many of the Vegas camps as I'd like to have. So how do I gain the new material? Slowly. But steadily. I try to gain what I can when I can and assimilate it to the best of my ability. My instructors do make the camps. Mr. Connolly is one of the real "Regulars" in teaching the different material and goes up to Evanston to learn from his instructor (Mr. Mills) on a very regular basis. (being a comercial airline pilot, he can do that kind of thing). Also: I've got to give a lot of credit to Mr. Alan Jacob for exchanging MANY e-mails with me and letting me call him at all hours when I've got questions or need help with something. His advice, tips and leadership has meant so very much to me. Likewise Mr. Derek Ence has been a help whenever the opportunity existed.... he's also a student of Mr. Mills. As far as contact and help though, Mr. Mills himself cannot be beat!!!!! Though he's an exceedingly busy man in every area of his life, he's made himself so very available to me whenever I've needed to talk to him. He's a very giving man.
I don't know where I'd be without such a supportive group of people helping me out. That's what a good association should be all about I think, backing up everyone.

Honestly Clyde....I don't recall you or anyone asking me these things before. ((PLEASE point out where I've been asked these things and avoided them....I don't think they exist) Seems you've wanted to paint me as evasive.... hope I've dispelled that here.

IF you have any remaining questions, please post them or E-mail me... or you could call me; I'm home most evenings. I'm in the book.

Thanks
Your Brother
John

 

[Brother John]

James-
I'm really glad that we could both keep our exchange respectful, speaks volumes of your personal cultivation as a warrior. :asian:

No doubt about the benefits of gymnastics!!!!! I'm really hoping he keeps his fire stoked for this!

Your thoughts/opinions on the AKKI are thought provoking.... whether I totally agree or not. I at least like to see that you think deeply about what you do and why: in that alone....we are brothers.

(6) Please tell me (this was not mentioned previous) where the grappling knowledge was DEVELOPED from. I will blatantly have to explain where the Ju-Jitsu/Wrestling is in there and that is it in fact INTEGRATED not DEVELOPED.

I just don't know. There is grappling w/in Kenpo Karate (AKKI or not), I'd always thought that Mr. Mills et al have just expouned upon what was already there.... for instance:
The "Guillotine" techniques: These techs all end in different chokes/strangle holds. But the 'choke' or 'strangle-hold' isn't new to Kenpo... it's just that we've used our style of advance to 'enter' the hold itself.
Good question.

Best of wishes to you James.

Your Brother
John

 

[Brother John]

. Would you mind listing your;

Experience in prior martial arts,
DarK LorD

Do you REALLY want me to bore you with this stuff???
Kenpo Karate is my TRUE love. I appreciate the years I spent in other arts, but they are nothing compared to what Kenpo has done for me.
IF you really want to know this stuff I could post it here or PM or E-mail....etc. whatever. OR...you needn't even get bored with it all. I don't consider it to matter all that much.
You decide. I don't care.

Your Brother
John

 

[KenpoEMT]

After having a conversation with an instructor senior to myself, I have come to the following conclusion:

This poll was started under the false assumption that AKKI Kenpo was the 'new' way of motion.

My assertation that AKKI Kenpo is the 'new' form or next generation of American Kenpo may very well be wrong.

To address Ed Parker's American Kenpo as the 'old' way and AKKI Kenpo as the 'new' way is not completely accurate. Master Parker said, "Kenpo never changes, it perpetually refines itself," and I think that is what we are seeing with regard to AKKI Kenpo.

It is clear that Master Parker didn't want his system of American Kenpo traditionalized. It is also clear that he set the minimum requirements of Kenpo in his writings. What this says to me is that Ed Parker's American Kenpo is a stepping stone. It is the first part of the journey. The minimum requirements of Kenpo were set in stone the day Infinite Insights Vol. V was distributed. Master Parker was not a stupid man; he knew that the moment people began purchasing their copies of this volume that the minimum requirements would forever be cemented in the minds of his students. This gives all Kenpoists a common starting place, but to say that the system is complete as it is and should not be evaluated by the individual practitioner is false. It clearly must be examined by the practitioner. Everything has to be questioned and probed for the purpose of moving forward. To constantly rehash the American Kenpo minimum requirements throughout the upper ranks only has limited value compared to progressing with the information provided (not necessarily creating your own system; I think we have enough of those).

Developing a personal 'way' of Kenpo is not an unreasonable expectation (as long as the one doing it is skilled enough to do so). With the core system remaining the same, there should be as many perspectives of Kenpo as there are numbers of skilled Kenpoists.

I believe that Master Mills is moving in the right direction...for himself and those that follow him. I also believe that those who do not strive to take what was to be learned in the core system of AK and move beyond it are not taking any more steps on the journey of development (this isn't to say that those who don't move beyond the minimum requirements are not highly skilled within the core system). This does not mean that anyone should abandon the core system. I fail to see the problem behind a highly skilled Kenpoist merging forms and significantly tailoring techniques as long as all of the material remains effective, and as long as all of the new students are run through the core system first. If every technique can be viewed as a Master Key Technique and applied in any situation by a skilled practitioner, then we have the possibility of many systems developing from the core system, but "if it ain't broke..."

As a side note, maybe one of the points of having so many techniques and forms/sets in American Kenpo was so that eventually the Kenpoist would examine the possibility of combining/merging forms, if only out of sheer frustration at so much material to practice on a daily basis. Train smarter, not harder (or train smarter and harder...).
That's my opinion. In the end, it is a matter of 'do what you love'.

Well, I think I discovered what I needed to discover. Thanks for all of the input.

 

[lonekimono10]

WELL, WELL, I DON'T KNOW WHAT IS BETTER,reading THIS OR THE NEW hARRY pOTTER bOOK, I WENT THOUGH 2 MUGS OF COFFEE READING THIS STUFF,
pLEASE LETS NOT MAKE THIS SITE LIKE SOME OF THE OTHERS,

ps Bruce Smith is a good guy,and a good friend.

 

[KenpoEMT]

pLEASE LETS NOT MAKE THIS SITE LIKE SOME OF THE OTHERS

I echo this sentiment.

 

[Kenpojujitsu3]

WELL, WELL, I DON'T KNOW WHAT IS BETTER,reading THIS OR THE NEW hARRY pOTTER bOOK, I WENT THOUGH 2 MUGS OF COFFEE READING THIS STUFF,
pLEASE LETS NOT MAKE THIS SITE LIKE SOME OF THE OTHERS,

ps Bruce Smith is a good guy,and a good friend.

Here Here!

 

[Brother John]

From everything I know and have heard of him Mr. Smith is a fine man and martial artist.
...and for keeping these forums "Clearer" of the guff that others have.......
YES.....LETS!

Your Brother
John

 

[SHADOW]

(1) A lot of the drills are nearly identical to drills from other systems I've studied. The timing drills I've been exposed to do exist in EPAK techniques already the way I learned them. Several have debated this point and I simply state "you must didn't learn the EPAK techniques in the manner I did." I can provide explanations on demand as necessary.
(2) A lot of the knife and stick work is FMA plain and simple, yes it fits in with Kenpo's hand work well. It usually does, ask any of 'Huk" Planas' guys about that. FMA and Kenpo integrate almost seemlessly. So for someone experienced with escrima/kali to state that it works right in with the empty hand stuff is quite plausible. From my experience with FMA it always does so that does not detract from the statement that it is FMA. It's not so much DEVELOPED as it is INTEGRATED.
(3) With my knowledge of the EQUATION FORMULA and EPAK I'll paraphrase Mr. Planas 'I defy anybody to show me a new technique, all they are going to show me is a new ending somebody made up and I'll show them 5 endings they've never seen' 'Flashing Swords' - Start delayed sword, delete kick, suffix middle sequence of Bow-of-compulsion extension with adjusted angles. 'Swords of Fury' - Start sword of destruction, delete kick and chop, suffix last tree hand strikes from Five Swords w/ the extension, delete the ending kick of extension. Those are two examples and I'm not going any further due to respect for not spreading the AKKI knowledge I have with Non-AKKI members accessing this board. I don't like the 'politics' of that, but I took an oath and am a man of my word.
(4) The 'offensive techniques' are a "new way of TEACHING" what the freestyles should have taught if people actually taught them everywhere. There is also alot of Kung Fu/Wing Chun/Jeet Kune Do trapping integrated for the entries and counter-blows. Nothing wrong with that but it is what it is as they say. This stuff isn't just coming out of thin air as is often suggested. It isn't as much being DEVELOPED as it is being INTEGRATED from other systems. Nothing wrong with that but give credit where it's due.
(5) On the "Hockheim comment" I have only my friends' word and as such will be logged as 'rumor' and rightfully so. But see above statements on FMA and let the readers be the judges of their own opinions.
(6) Please tell me (this was not mentioned previous) where the grappling knowledge was DEVELOPED from. I will blatantly have to explain where the Ju-Jitsu/Wrestling is in there and that is it in fact INTEGRATED not DEVELOPED.

AMEN Kenpojujitsu !

Craig Dishmon
Kenpo-Parker/Planas Lineage
Pekiti-Tirsia- McGrath/Whitson Lineage
Remy Presas Arnis
THE DIRTY BOYZ

 

[Dark Kenpo Lord]

(1) A lot of the drills are nearly identical to drills from other systems I've studied. The timing drills I've been exposed to do exist in EPAK techniques already the way I learned them. Several have debated this point and I simply state "you must didn't learn the EPAK techniques in the manner I did." I can provide explanations on demand as necessary.
(2) A lot of the knife and stick work is FMA plain and simple, yes it fits in with Kenpo's hand work well. It usually does, ask any of 'Huk" Planas' guys about that. FMA and Kenpo integrate almost seemlessly. So for someone experienced with escrima/kali to state that it works right in with the empty hand stuff is quite plausible. From my experience with FMA it always does so that does not detract from the statement that it is FMA. It's not so much DEVELOPED as it is INTEGRATED.
(3) With my knowledge of the EQUATION FORMULA and EPAK I'll paraphrase Mr. Planas 'I defy anybody to show me a new technique, all they are going to show me is a new ending somebody made up and I'll show them 5 endings they've never seen' 'Flashing Swords' - Start delayed sword, delete kick, suffix middle sequence of Bow-of-compulsion extension with adjusted angles. 'Swords of Fury' - Start sword of destruction, delete kick and chop, suffix last tree hand strikes from Five Swords w/ the extension, delete the ending kick of extension. Those are two examples and I'm not going any further due to respect for not spreading the AKKI knowledge I have with Non-AKKI members accessing this board. I don't like the 'politics' of that, but I took an oath and am a man of my word.
(4) The 'offensive techniques' are a "new way of TEACHING" what the freestyles should have taught if people actually taught them everywhere. There is also alot of Kung Fu/Wing Chun/Jeet Kune Do trapping integrated for the entries and counter-blows. Nothing wrong with that but it is what it is as they say. This stuff isn't just coming out of thin air as is often suggested. It isn't as much being DEVELOPED as it is being INTEGRATED from other systems. Nothing wrong with that but give credit where it's due.
(5) On the "Hockheim comment" I have only my friends' word and as such will be logged as 'rumor' and rightfully so. But see above statements on FMA and let the readers be the judges of their own opinions.
(6) Please tell me (this was not mentioned previous) where the grappling knowledge was DEVELOPED from. I will blatantly have to explain where the Ju-Jitsu/Wrestling is in there and that is it in fact INTEGRATED not DEVELOPED.

AMEN Kenpojujitsu !

Craig Dishmon
Kenpo-Parker/Planas Lineage
Pekiti-Tirsia- McGrath/Whitson Lineage
Remy Presas Arnis
THE DIRTY BOYZ

And how long have I been saying this Craig LOL? Good to see you posting again.

DarK LorD

 

[lonekimono10]

I im BACK!! Hello , so i see the AKKI IS STILL THE FUTURE OF KENPO.
nothing changes

 

[pete]

stick around long enough and the future becomes the past and what's old becomes new again... pete.

 

[lonekimono10]

stick around long enough and the future becomes the past and what's old becomes new again... pete.

let me see if i can remember this line to a song.


"the north moves south, the south moves north, a star is born a star burns out, the only thing that stays the same is everything changes"

but i like what you said Pete.

 

[KenpoEMT]

Perhaps my conclusions here were not accurate. Perhaps this poll was flawed.

 

[Brother John]

From the get-go it was BOUND for little more than political turmoil....and nothing else.

Oh well...

Your Brother
John

 

[hongkongfooey]

Infighting in the Kenpo community? Say it isn't so.

 

[Franc0]

"Higher proficiency through innovation" ? With all due respect, the last word should be replaced with "Integration" or maybe even "Imitation".
(ducks for cover)

 

[Brian Jones]

"Higher proficiency through innovation" ? With all due respect, the last word should be replaced with "Integration" or maybe even "Imitation".
(ducks for cover)

Umm. Ok, you threw teh gauntlet, care to explain? I don't mind debating and perhaps even consceding a bit, but I am not sure where you are going.

Brian Jones

 

[Franc0]

Brian, no disrespect towards the AKKI at all. Some of my best friends are AKKI instructors, and I hold the highest regards for their skill. I've worked alongside Mr. Herman and Mr. Lannon doing security in Vegas I consider them,the best ever to watch my back when the s**t hit's the fan.
However, there are some elements that have been introduced that have not been credited towards the influence or integration into the AKKI curriculum. Like someone else said, theirs no longer any such "innovations" when it comes to martial arts/human movements. Unless you consider innovations as simply another way to put together the pieces of the puzzle, they're still the same pieces, and only so many ways they can be put together, which was figured out long ago. I've asked about this on the AKKI forum, and instead of at least crediting where certain influences came from, it was considered a "Mill's Innovation". I respect his abilities and consider him a martial artist of the highest caliber, but unless he's grown a 3rd arm, "innovations" could be better described as "realisations through integration". Sorry, I should have said that before, and I apologise for any disrespect that may have been felt.

 

[KenpoEMT]

I respect your opinion in this matter; however, I do find innovative concepts within the small amount of information that I know about the AKKI.

I find the concept of using rythmic timing/tempo patterns to govern the execution of techniques to be innovative.
I find the idea of moving with the d1/d2 flexion/extension patterns in order to "hardwire" the CNS to be innovative.
The concept of teaching multiple phases of a form is innovative. As skill evolves, the execution of the form evolves as well (obviously); however, within the AKKI, it seems the forms themselves evolve through phases as the practitioner's skill increases.
The little that I know of the three AKKI Orbital Considerations is absolutely fascinating (and quite innovative). The threes on the crest pique my curiosity as to what their equal opposites must be.

All in all, my earlier conclusions about Mr. Mills and the AKKI were clearly wrong. I think that there are many new and interesting things being implemented by the members of the AKKI. Innovation is clearly present.