Which drill can give you better "health" benefit?

oaktree

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I find this interesting but with the Chinese symbols and strange use of words, somewhat difficult to understand.

can you explain what is an external muscle and what's an internal muscle, I though all muscles were internal, as in, inside the body, or do you mean external muscles are in the arms and legs and internal are the core muscles. A horse stance is always going to require both to support its self.
Because I am talking about a Chinese art and especially one that is considered a Chinese internal art and in relation to health and long life(very daoist and central to Chinese thought, certain Chinese terms and ideas that are fundamental to the topic are used.) External use of muscle meant by contractions using more force of exertion, vs internal relaxation of the muscle using a released force it is a little difficult to describe this and must be felt.
 

jobo

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Because I am talking about a Chinese art and especially one that is considered a Chinese internal art and in relation to health and long life(very daoist and central to Chinese thought, certain Chinese terms and ideas that are fundamental to the topic are used.) External use of muscle meant by contractions using more force of exertion, vs internal relaxation of the muscle using a released force it is a little difficult to describe this and must be felt.

I'm not a sceptic, trying to trip you up, I'm trying to go down a similar line with developing my nervous system to be able to control ie contract/ relax at my command. The horses stance should be a relaxed rest position and not the excruciating agony it is now, have you a recommend reading link, at the moment any one i ask about it tells me to point at the moon, which isn't really helpful
 

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If you train this XingYi Pi Chuan drill 1,000 times daily vs. you train this long fist kick punch drill 1,000 times daily, which will give you better "health" benefit?

Your thought?


I'd think the kick-punch, because it appears to use a greater range of motion. And it looks like a lower impact (the "hard step" in the Xing Yi drill seems rough on the body for 1,000 repetitions).
 

Gerry Seymour

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The person who taught me

- XingYi passed away when he was 78.
- Long fist is 91 years old and still going strong today.

For "long life", this fact means a lot to me.
Don't get too caught up on those two data points. It might be that the XingYi instructor had awful genetics and the Long Fist instructor had great ones. With a small sample, correlation is not a dependable predictor.
 

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Again, I'm not sure which one is better:

- 3 miles running,
- 3 miles fast walking,
- 3 miles slow walking,
- 1,000 hip throws,
- 1,000 Pi Chuan drills,
- 1,000 kick-punch drills.

One kick-punch drill that I like is:

- right back fist
- left side kick
- double hands pull
- right front kick
- right palm strike
- right/left wrist lock
- right side kick
- left back kick
- right front kick
- right hammer fist
- right/left arm block
- right straight punch.

I just don't have enough energy to drill it 1,000 times.
So, don't. What's the importance of the 1,000 times? Practice it 50 times, or 100. I think doing any single motion 1,000 times a day (or even 1,000 times in a row, just once) has a possibility of presenting a repetitive strain injury. And that's not good for long-term mobility, so not good for longer living.
 

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Well a lot of things influence a person's health and long life from diet to genetics or from a Chinese medicine opinion the xingyiquan guy just had to much sex:D
So if some guy was 100 and smoked would you smoke too?
Which, really, is a tremendous argument for living to 78.
 

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I'll tell him that if he doesn't smoke, he may be able to live till 200. There is a good reason that old people all quite smoking and drinking.
Not all. There are several examples to be found of people living to 100 who had a drink (or more) every day of their adult lives. I've even seen some quoted as attributing their long life to that drink. Mind you, there's little evidence to support that, but it was their belief.
 

oaktree

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I'm not a sceptic, trying to trip you up, I'm trying to go down a similar line with developing my nervous system to be able to control ie contract/ relax at my command. The horses stance should be a relaxed rest position and not the excruciating agony it is now, have you a recommend reading link, at the moment any one i ask about it tells me to point at the moon, which isn't really helpful
I don't know any link you want to relax your muscles from top to bottom sinking rooting sinking more, sinking more and more, eventually the legs will feel like hot lava moving down the leg.
 
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So, don't. What's the importance of the 1,000 times? Practice it 50 times, or 100. I think doing any single motion 1,000 times a day (or even 1,000 times in a row, just once) has a possibility of presenting a repetitive strain injury. And that's not good for long-term mobility, so not good for longer living.
I have done the XingYi Pi Chuan on the beach for 1 miles non-stop.That's 5280 feet. Since 1 XIngYi Pi Chuan takes less than 5 feet distance. That 1 miles training can be more than 1,000 reps. I can't do the long fist kick-punch drill for that many reps.
 

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I can't believe this is a xingyiquan with out xue sheng. Speaking of long life and internal martial arts I believe me and xue sheng talked about this and had a chart of who lives the longest and average was the Baguazhang guys whixh I am proud to say is my main art:D
 

jobo

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I don't know any link you want to relax your muscles from top to bottom sinking rooting sinking more, sinking more and more, eventually the legs will feel like hot lava moving down the leg.
hot lava, that's a different take, I was trying to be water
 

oaktree

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hot lava, that's a different take, I was trying to be water
Hot lava is reference to the qi and pressure building up in the legs it will make your legs spring. Basically by using an extreme you take a different shape and get a different type of energy that is not found in most external style
 

jobo

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Hot lava is reference to the qi and pressure building up in the legs it will make your legs spring. Basically by using an extreme you take a different shape and get a different type of energy that is not found in most external style
that's the link m looking for that explains the underpinning philosophyOf internal arts that you keep eluding to in your post
 

oaktree

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that's the link m looking for that explains the underpinning philosophyOf internal arts that you keep eluding to in your post
I would say in the case of xingyiquan san ti shi yes, gao style Baguazhang yes, however could not say for other internal arts or families, I don't see this extreme in Chen taijiquan or so much in liang Baguazhang and from Wang shu jins line.
 

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Hot lava is reference to the qi and pressure building up in the legs it will make your legs spring. Basically by using an extreme you take a different shape and get a different type of energy that is not found in most external style

I'm not sure whether or not you've experienced traditional Wing Chun Kuen, it's usually considered a southern style of Chinese Boxing, but would you say it was internal or external? Or both? Baguazhang incorporates both internal and external power, or at least that's what I was told. Is this true? I understand the hot lava metaphor, that's why I ask.
 

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Here's my answer
yin-yang-symbol_318-83822.jpg

It's not that you do a drill 1000 times a day that is the benefit. It is the balance of exercise and rest that you do daily. Everything in life and health seeks a balance. The better the balance is the healthier you are. Being sick all the time isn't healthy, but being sick some of the time helps to strengthen the immune system. Finding that balance is what matters. All physical exercise all the time is not good. It's one of the things that I like about Tai Chi and other internal martial arts where this is more of an opportunity to find that balance.

With that said regardless of 1000 times a day, I'm pretty sure that the guys in the OP's video did more than just those exercises to stay healthy. If any of those systems are like Kung Fu in general then it's not one exercise that gives us the health benefit. It's the collection of exercises together that produce the health benefit.
 

JowGaWolf

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Don't count the repetitions. Just do it until you feel it is enough. Then do something else.
I actually train like that sometimes. I can tell when it's time to stop or change gears because the technique begins to feel less committed and I begin to feel like I'm at a greater risk for injury if I continue. By less committed, I mean that either my mind or body isn't on focus. Things like abnormal discomfort or weakness are good reasons to stop or switch up the exercises.
 

oaktree

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I'm not sure whether or not you've experienced traditional Wing Chun Kuen, it's usually considered a southern style of Chinese Boxing, but would you say it was internal or external? Or both? Baguazhang incorporates both internal and external power, or at least that's what I was told. Is this true? I understand the hot lava metaphor, that's why I ask.
Baguazhang is more focused on internal, the movement comes from the constant rotation of waist and spine. My sifu also trained in Wing chun under Lo Man Kam who thought of it as more internal but I never been interested in center line as Taijiquan and Xingyiquan deal with that. Baguazhang is more focused on off center line angling movement to basically get behind an opponent.
 

oaktree

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I'm not sure whether or not you've experienced traditional Wing Chun Kuen, it's usually considered a southern style of Chinese Boxing, but would you say it was internal or external? Or both? Baguazhang incorporates both internal and external power, or at least that's what I was told. Is this true? I understand the hot lava metaphor, that's why I ask.
Baguazhang is more focused on internal, the movement comes from the constant rotation of waist and spine. My sifu also trained in Wing chun under Lo Man Kam who thought of it as more internal but I never been interested in center line as Taijiquan and Xingyiquan deal with that. Baguazhang is more focused on off center line angling movement to basically get behind an opponent.
 
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