What does it mean if someone "can fight" or "can't fight"?

[Kung Fu Wang]

Those make a point about skill, but they do miss three of the other factors folks have mentioned:

• ability to do damage
• willingness to do damage
• ability to not panic in a confrontation

My teacher told me something happened when he was young.

Many people beat up a guy badly. The guy said, "Do you guys have ebough?" Next day that guy got an axe and broke into the attacker's houses and killed every family members in that house.

Could that guy fight? He might not show "willingness to do damage" during the fight, but ...

 

[Gyakuto]

If you are looking up from the floor at your opponent, they can fight and you can’t fight (as well as them)!

 

[JowGaWolf]

If you are looking up from the floor at your opponent, they can fight and you can’t fight (as well as them)!

Does that apply to BJJ?

 

[Gyakuto]

Does that apply to BJJ?

Hmmm…never thought of that…🤔

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Does that apply to BJJ?

How will you fight this guy?

http://img.izismile.com/img/img6/20131007/1000/daily_gifdump_470_15.gif

 

[windwalker099]

How will you fight this guy?

http://img.izismile.com/img/img6/20131007/1000/daily_gifdump_470_15.gif

😂 had someone try this with me talking about Chinese martial arts in an empty bar.. asking what would I do 🤔

Picked up a chair, 😳.

He asked “what are you doing,”
I said “I’m attacking you “.

Worked pretty good 🙂

 

[wab25]

Re-reading this thread... I think people are answering different questions.

The question asked was "What does it mean if a person can or can't fight?"

Some of the answers here are for "When should a person fight?" Or "What results does the person get when they fight?" Or "Can the person do well in a combat sport?"

Note that these are separate, and distinct questions. If a person can fight... then he needs to decide when he should fight. If he can't fight.... then he can't really make that decision.... Results from sport competition are just that.... competition results. You can have all the skill in the world... but the first time you go up against someone who is truly trying to hurt you.... it becomes a different game right there. Not everyone that can do well in a sport... is ready to deal with someone that is really intending to severely injure them, or worse. Doing well in the sport and having all the skills, gives you a great tool box, and lots of options. But being willing to use those options to injure another person, one who is trying to injure you is a different thing.

Having the intention to hurt the other guy, no matter what.... can overcome a lot of skill differential, and size/strength differential, if the other guy is not intending the same level of violence. One of the rules of a gun fight is to decide to be deadly enough soon enough. Size, skill, competition experience.... can all be over come, by someone who gets deadly enough fast enough.

Even if the guy loses.... he can still fight. Just because he ran into someone better than him, does not take away his ability to flip that switch.

I heard a story from my first sensei.... A big guy and a little guy were going to fight to the death. The big guy picks up the little guy, over his head and says "I win... I am going to throw you down so hard it will kill you." The little guy replies "Great, then I win, because on the way down I will kick you in the head and kill you."

 

[JowGaWolf]

How will you fight this guy?

http://img.izismile.com/img/img6/20131007/1000/daily_gifdump_470_15.gif

Lots of options if striking was allowed lol

 

[geezer]

Lots of options if striking was allowed lol

Even more options if weapons were allowed! ...Like the chair Windwalker mentioned above.

Heck, keeping distance and smashing his feet, ankles and shins with a stick, brick or rock ...or, inside a bar, using a stool, cue, billard ball, salt shaker, beer mug or a glass would discourage that tactic.

...or better yet, just keep backing around tables until he gasses out without ever touching you. Or break some glass on the floor just for fun!

 

[geezer]

Whoops. Double post.

 

[wab25]

Heck, keeping distance and smashing his feet, ankles and shins with a stick, brick or rock ...or, inside a bar, using a stool, cue, billard ball, salt shaker, beer mug or a glass would discourage that tactic.

I can see a great place to put the cue stick, that would certainly give you a handle on the situation....

 

[windwalker099]

The question asked was "What does it mean if a person can or can't fight?"

Some of the answers here are for "When should a person fight?" Or "What results does the person get when they fight?" Or "Can the person do well in a combat sport?"

"Pucker factor "

some of you may know what this means,,,some may not. 🤔
Every one has one, they may not know it yet 😐

"a military slang phrase used to describe the level of stress and/or adrenaline response to danger or a crisis situation.

The term refers to the tightening of the sphincter caused by extreme fear.

The term applies only to an individual's response in a crisis situation;
[1] it does not pertain to an individual's stress levels outside of a crisis context."

 

[Steve]

It sounds like you have a lot of different, very specific ideas about what these words mean. I was speaking more generally, and suggesting that all of these terms are roughly synonymous. But you ask some really interesting questions. I'll give it some more thought, but I'll share my initial reaction.

Fighting spirit. What if I don't want to fight and I do everything to try to Descartes. What if I come to the conclusion that it's better to take a few kicks and punches than to fight back. The human version of animals playing dead instead of fighting. Does that mean the human can't fight or was that the better option?

If you're not fighting, then you're not in a position to evaluate whether the person can fight. They may have fighting spirit/gameness/toughness. They may have technical ability. They may have physical traits that lend themselves to fighting.

But if they aren't fighting, whether by choice or not, they just simply aren't fighting, and so you can't evaluate whether or not they CAN fight. So, maybe?

What if you have fighting spirit but no toughness? Is fighting spirit the same as self preservation?

The best example I can think of to illustrate this is a few years ago, I read a news article about a person who was training for the American Ninja Warrior competition. She was attacked, and if I remember correctly, the bad guy had a knife to her throat and attempted to sexually assault her. She fought back and kicked the dude's ***, and then ran away. She had no formal martial training.
So, in this example, I'd say her physical strength and overall fitness combined with her fighting spirit demonstrated pretty clearly that she could fight.

A person can do excellent in striking but horrible with fighting on the ground. I personally don't think I have alot of fighting spirit especially when I put a lot of focus on turning off my emotions in aggressive situations.

Could be that you don't, and if so, then I'd say if you're in a situation where you need to fight, you would have to rely more heavily on your technique and your physical traits (strength, athleticism, etc).

The only time I use the term fighting spirit is when I train forms. For me fighting spirit only exists outside of fighting.

Makes sense, I guess. I'm not sure how you're defining fighting spirit, but I don't think it means the same thing to you as it does to me.

 

[Steve]

I read this and got to wondering which little pony is the best fighter. Most folks would bet on Applejack, although some might back Twilight Sparkle. But fighting spirit is hard to assess ...and it is fluid depending on the situation or context. I'm thinking of factors like determination.

Given the right context and motivation, even Pinkie Pie might prove a fierce contender.

View attachment 29455

 

[Steve]

The best way to tell if someone can fight is to fight them. Whether they are good at it or not, whether they can beat you or not, you will know that the person can or cannot fight. I don't believe it has anything much to do with strength, skill, or even courage or willingness. They put up their dukes, wade in, and get to work. It's all and none of the those attributes. They can fight. You know it. So does everyone else who sees it. It's just a characteristic. How wet is rain? It's just rain, wet is a characteristic. If weather doesn't possess that characteristic, it's just wind.

I will say that I've seen people change over time and with training, from someone who absolutely could not fight to someone who could. We've noticed it. We talk about it. It's a simple acknowledgement. "Remember that guy so-and-so?" "Yeah, I remember that dude. He could fight."

Well, I mean, technically, rain isn't wet at all. It makes other things wet.

...



...


I'll see myself out.

 

[windwalker099]

🤔

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Lots of options if striking was allowed lol

Kick to his head seems to be the best option. There is no way that he can defend your kick.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

It sounds like you have a lot of different, very specific ideas about what these words mean. I was speaking more generally, and suggesting that all of these terms are roughly synonymous. But you ask some really interesting questions. I'll give it some more thought, but I'll share my initial reaction.



If you're not fighting, then you're not in a position to evaluate whether the person can fight. They may have fighting spirit/gameness/toughness. They may have technical ability. They may have physical traits that lend themselves to fighting.

But if they aren't fighting, whether by choice or not, they just simply aren't fighting, and so you can't evaluate whether or not they CAN fight. So, maybe?


The best example I can think of to illustrate this is a few years ago, I read a news article about a person who was training for the American Ninja Warrior competition. She was attacked, and if I remember correctly, the bad guy had a knife to her throat and attempted to sexually assault her. She fought back and kicked the dude's ***, and then ran away. She had no formal martial training.
So, in this example, I'd say her physical strength and overall fitness combined with her fighting spirit demonstrated pretty clearly that she could fight.


Could be that you don't, and if so, then I'd say if you're in a situation where you need to fight, you would have to rely more heavily on your technique and your physical traits (strength, athleticism, etc).


Makes sense, I guess. I'm not sure how you're defining fighting spirit, but I don't think it means the same thing to you as it does to me.

Accidental quote by Benny, my dog.

 

[geezer]

Accidental quote by Benny, my dog.

He can quote, but can Benny fight?

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I'm not sure how you're defining fighting spirit,

In Chinese wrestling, the fighting spirit is to "act like a tiger and trying to eat your opponent alive".

Chinese wrestling

- encourages "attack and lose".
- doesn't encourage "defend and win".

My teacher liked this long hair student a lot because he had the right fighting spirit (he tried to create opportunity).

Compare to this less fighting spirit guy (he waits for opportunity), you can see big difference.