Wanna be a rock star?

[jks9199]

Turns out, writing a rock song ain't as hard as you think:

[yt]qHBVnMf2t7w[/yt]

(Thanks to Steve Perry -- not the guy from Journey, nor the recently deceased tv writer -- who deserves the occasional mention in these parts! If you don't know why... follow the link.)

 

[Omar B]

We use a 12 tone system so of course when it comes to chord progressions of simple major and minor chords there's nothing new. Simple 3 chord progressions sung in a calm soothing voice even more common, then take into account the limited vocal range of the average human and you get most pop songs written in the keys of A or E. So exactly how many simple 3 chord progressions built upon A or E, even if you take into account some of those will be minor rather than major.

This is why I don't listen to the radio, I couldn't name one current pop song to save my life either. Death metal or atonal is the way to go, breaking boundaries there.

 

[Touch Of Death]

We use a 12 tone system so of course when it comes to chord progressions of simple major and minor chords there's nothing new. Simple 3 chord progressions sung in a calm soothing voice even more common, then take into account the limited vocal range of the average human and you get most pop songs written in the keys of A or E. So exactly how many simple 3 chord progressions built upon A or E, even if you take into account some of those will be minor rather than major.

This is why I don't listen to the radio, I couldn't name one current pop song to save my life either. Death metal or atonal is the way to go, breaking boundaries there.

Death Metal? Seriously?
Sean

 

[Omar B]

Any other genre of music make use of obscure scales, modes, voicings? Any other genre's use odd time signatures, irregular subdivisions within a regular meter, hemolas, relative tonality, playing outside? The real high tech(nique) playing is going on in death metal now. Bands like Atheist, Cynic, Death, Pestilence, etc are the only ones who are playing around with music theory in ways not seen since Schnittke and Penderecki.

Because it's played with distortion, aggression and pretty fast most people who don't have an ear just hear a cacophony but it's pretty hairy stuff being played. But then again, it's like explaining technical prowess to people who don't know theory as. You either know it or don't.

Atheist - Brains -

Listen for the meter changes, key changes, use of changing tonality, tonality, find how the melodic line is implied throughout but only explicitly stated at 1.45

 

[Touch Of Death]

Any other genre of music make use of obscure scales, modes, voicings? Any other genre's use odd time signatures, irregular subdivisions within a regular meter, hemolas, relative tonality, playing outside? The real high tech(nique) playing is going on in death metal now. Bands like Atheist, Cynic, Death, Pestilence, etc are the only ones who are playing around with music theory in ways not seen since Schnittke and Penderecki.

Because it's played with distortion, aggression and pretty fast most people who don't have an ear just hear a cacophony but it's pretty hairy stuff being played. But then again, it's like explaining technical prowess to people who don't know theory as. You either know it or don't.

Atheist - Brains -

Listen for the meter changes, key changes, use of changing tonality, tonality, find how the melodic line is implied throughout but only explicitly stated at 1.45

Cynic...? I really loved Cynic, when they were called Yes. LOL
Sean

 

[Omar B]

I guess that's what passes for humor now? I can't stand Yes, Steve Howe's tone bothers the crap out of me. Something about how a hollow-body guitar resonates really gets me angry.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

After hearing some death metal via my son I have to admit they are pushing the limits on many, many levels.

 

[Sukerkin]

I guess that's what passes for humor now? I can't stand Yes, Steve Howe's tone bothers the crap out of me. Something about how a hollow-body guitar resonates really gets me angry.

Mate, with that one statement, we just lost any musical credability with each other.

If you don't think "Yes" had talent and you love Death Metal then we shall never agree.

You'll be saying you don't like "Rush" next :lol:.

 

[Omar B]

Mate, with that one statement, we just lost any musical credability with each other.
If you don't think "Yes" had talent and you love Death Metal then we shall never agree.
You'll be saying you don't like "Rush" next :lol:.

I didn't say that Yes didn't have talent. If you go back and read what I said, my problem with them is tone. Steve Howe's hollow-body sound, or even the guitar player who they got after who leaned way too much on the phaser effect (prime example is the Owner Of A Lonely Heart solo). Phaser to me has always been a useless and pretty annoying tone to want to have in your signal chain.

 

[Touch Of Death]

Mate, with that one statement, we just lost any musical credability with each other.

If you don't think "Yes" had talent and you love Death Metal then we shall never agree.

You'll be saying you don't like "Rush" next :lol:.

Rush's "Caress Of Steel" rocked the house, but I wonder about all the rest of it. Its OK I suppose.

 

[Touch Of Death]

I didn't say that Yes didn't have talent. If you go back and read what I said, my problem with them is tone. Steve Howe's hollow-body sound, or even the guitar player who they got after who leaned way too much on the phaser effect (prime example is the Owner Of A Lonely Heart solo). Phaser to me has always been a useless and pretty annoying tone to want to have in your signal chain.

Steve Howe didn't play on the "Owner of a Lonely Heart" Song.... so you were saying?
Sean

 

[Omar B]

Try to follow and reread what I wrote. My problem with steve Howe's tone is his hollow-body, I said it was the other guitar player after who used the phazer which continued my problem with their tone. I know Steve Howe didnt play on that song, it was Trevor Rabin who uses the phaser.

I will quote myself to illustrate "Steve Howe's hollow-body sound, or even the guitar player who they got after who leaned way too much on the phaser effect (prime example is the Owner Of A Lonely Heart solo)." See, now I've separated ideas into different colors so it's easier to follow.

 

[CoryKS]

I can't stand Yes or Rush, so I'm getting a kick. I agree with Omar about the Yes guitar tone, but what sets my teeth on edge with both bands is the singer. I don't like their voices. Different strokes, I guess.

 

[Jenna]

I can't stand Yes or Rush, so I'm getting a kick. I agree with Omar about the Yes guitar tone, but what sets my teeth on edge with both bands is the singer. I don't like their voices. Different strokes, I guess.

What u talkin bout Willis

 

[Omar B]

I never liked the singer for Yes' voice either. But I'm not really into singing, whole albums have gone by and I've not heard a single lyric. as a guitar player I'm more in tune to exactly what the guitar player and the rest of the band is doing. Rush I like too, but some of their albums Alex uses a hollow-boy guitar so some of them tone-wise bother me.

It's the way the sound leaves the guitar in relation to the pick attack on the strings (it's not immediate) and how the air in the instrument creates all these sympathetic frequencies that muddy the actual character of the note, plus all the air effectively rounds out the highs and mids that should be there creating a sound that sounds like a note with all the top and bottom parts of the frequency sand papered off. To me hollow bodies sound like listening to music under water.

Hollow bodied guitars are a relic from when electric guitars were just being developed and people thought that one should just simply ad pickups to an acoustic design. The weird thing is they didn't think that on an electric guitar the sound comes from the pickup, not the hollow body and sound-holes like an acoustic guitar, did not rethink the guitar at all. For some reason that bit madness has continued even to today.

Take a look at the Gibson ES (Electric Spanish guitar) 175. It's essentially an acoustic gutiar as you can see, huge body, neck joining the body at the 15th fret, effectively making frets 16 through 22 unplayable, sure it doesn't have a sound-hole ahead of the bridge, but it does have f-holes which are the same thing. The only difference is the 1(!) pickup thrown in at a tonal dead spot (not close enough to the neck, or not close enough to the bridge).

 

[Sukerkin]

Let me see ... consistent choices within Top Five for me since I learned to distinguish music from noise ...

Black Sabbath
Pink Floyd
Tangerine Dream
Rush
Yes

I don't think we're going to find much common ground here Cory and Omar :lol:.

Mind you, the real points about hollow-bodies and phaser's I don't actually have a bone to pick with, so perhaps there isn't too much to argue about after all .

 

[Omar B]

Non whatsoever man. I love Sabbath, in fact I can almost guarantee I've seen them live more than most people on this planet, I also love Rush. I'm one who goes for complexity and technique in music. Comes from being a musician and friends who are as well, I even got accepted to Berklee School Of Music but opted to go to a college closer to home. I've got good ears and things that bug me really bug me, just how it is.

Like how I love Dokken except I dislike their first 3 albums because they were all recorded slightly sharp. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but I can hear the same songs without my brain constantly going "something's wrong here" by listening to their later live albums like Live From The Sun with pretty much all that material.