Ultimate Fighter Reality Show

Some would argue that an increasingly removed from application style of practicing martial arts in the name of character improvement or whatever else is just such a road.
 
Marginal said:
Some would argue that an increasingly removed from application style of practicing martial arts in the name of character improvement or whatever else is just such a road.
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But such a road can get you killed if you are not cautious and hap-hazard.
 
The idea that fighters are somehow corrupt martial artists or that martial artists that don't fight are somehow weaker than those that do, are two very divisive attitudes that ultimately accomplish very little if we're trying to have a dialog rather than a debate.

If I have a concern about sport fighting, it's that many people seem to be confused about the differences between self-protection, combat, and fighting. The line seems to be frequently blurred and I think this is very dangerous.

I'm interested in a certain kind of personal development that does not rely on competition with others as a central motivator; however this is one perspective among many, and while I understand the feelings of indignation toward sport fighting, I think it's important to recognize that we all follow our own path, and that there isn't a right or wrong answer here.
 
The idea that fighters are somehow corrupt martial artists or that martial artists that don't fight are somehow weaker than those that do, are two very divisive attitudes that ultimately accomplish very little if we're trying to have a dialog rather than a debate
Debate? I do not recall anything about sport fighters being corrupt. From my vp, I was just hacking on a name that seem surreal (Ultimate Fighting Reality Show-hmmn).

If I have a concern about sport fighting, it's that many people seem to be confused about the differences between self-protection, combat, and fighting. The line seems to be frequently blurred and I think this is very dangerous.
I like this, a great summary

I'm interested in a certain kind of personal development that does not rely on competition with others as a central motivator; however this is one perspective among many, and while I understand the feelings of indignation toward sport fighting, I think it's important to recognize that we all follow our own path, and that there isn't a right or wrong answer here.
I dont recall that sport fighting was not a type of martial art. And everyone is enttled to their opinion and or path-provided that it doesn't harm those that do not want to be harmed.

I did enjoy your post...

 
I don't know exactly what you are saying, but I think you are saying that Ultimate Fighting is not "real" fighting. In a sense that is true, but the modern UFC is not the same as when it first came to be.
Yes

Also you said you do not have to watch one in order to know. How can you base your opinion on something you have not seen?
No, in complete statement I said:The reality of UF is that it is not so UF! I do not need to watch it do know this. Meaning if it were, people will get locked away.

As to my question:
I think that it is over-hyped.
Yes...anything can be

And:
... can one be considered a true martial artist to particpate and spectate this event?
I was posting a general question for someone to respond. The question was not my opinion.

To which you had responded/answered:
....these fighters are probably the most well rounded Martial Artists out there. So yes they are true martial artist to participate in these events. Most train several hours a day in boxing, BJJ, Muai Thai
For which, I agree

Peace-:)
 
OMG! Leben is back!!! It's like a bad dream.

The fight tonight was decided before they ever stepped in the ring. Josh apologized to Dante, he came from a place of weakness. Dante showed thick face, black heart...check him out meditating int the thunderstorm.
 
It's total garbage that they let Leben back. If they want the guy to
win why bother with the show at all, don't waste my time and just give
him a UFC deal. He breaks all kinds of rules, LOSES A FIGHT and is still on
the show, that's pretty lame. Busting up the house, whizzing on a bed, and
didn't he leave the grounds early on (I missed the first few shows)? Any
one of the those is enough to boot the guy. If they were going to bring
someone back it should have been the decision of Dana White, with input
from Couture and Liddell, Quarry shouldn't have had any say. Bringing someone
back is a bad idea and that fighter being Leben makes it even dumber. Maybe
in the future (if they have more shows) they can have alternates waiting
to step in if someone gets hurt. Didn't Quarry say he wanted to pick someone
that would keep a level head in the house? Yeah, Leben's just the guy, he's
either busting the house up or crying, that's level-headed...
I'm pretty impressed with Deigo Sanchez. He might be the best fighter on
the show. I'd like to see him fight Leben, he'd probably make him cry again.
 
Leben coming back is not only good for ratings, but good for his team. He seems to be (how or why I dont know) a leader with those guys and a moral booster. I'm actually kind of glad he's back, with Bobby gone, Josh wont be so brave and it seems Leben is trying really hard to keep it civil. If he does what he said and just trains, shuts his mouth and fights who they say, it should be interesting. Who doesn't want to see Josh and Leben fight again? I do. Its not so unfair, the ankle injury sucks hardcore and he should be replaced, I do say its a little bit more about ratings, because Chris coming back will really help that department.

7sm
 
Leben lost, Josh beat him in a unanimous decision. Leben should be out, end of story. Why should the injured fighter get to pick his replacement. That should
be the job of the coach and Dana White. What sport allows injured players to pick who goes in for them? I guess I have nothing against Leben, but it's
annoying to watch this show and see the rules repeatedly broken and there be no consequences. Why should one fighter be allowed to lose a fight and
still be in the running? I would have rather seen Southworth come back (if they really had to bring anyone back) because his fight probably should have at least gone
to a 3rd round. Isn't it pretty unfair to all the other fighters that lost and have to stay eliminated? Is it fair to Liddell's team that they worked
hard, took out Leben (who is a leader) only to have him brought back? I think it's a little more "fair" for Team Couture than it is for Team Liddell.
I'd just rather see the show be a little more straight up about how things are going to go, that's all. Like I said there should be alternates in case of injury.
I've seen Koscheck beat Leben, I'd rather see Deigo Sanchez fight Leben. Diego looks to be the class of the field at this point. Neither fight was much
of a challenge for him. I think he wins the middleweight division.
 
Those are good points, its not neccessarily fair, but then nothing ever really is. It think its somewhat fair because it was in the case of an injury. If Team Liddell has an injury like that, they will be allowed the same thing. Plus, he got to pick from anyone, from either team. Its the same thing as most reality shows. Is it fair on Fear Factor that if only one person completes the first stunt they bring everyone back to compete for half the money? Its also a show that has to get ratings and continue for the length of the "season". Every fighter who has been eliminated was eledgable to return.

I can see your point however, and I do think Deigo has shown that he is a hell of a fighter.

7sm
 
I guess I'm in the minority for actually liking Leben. He's been painted as a sort of villain, but his antics don't really phase me a great deal. I'm actually glad he's back, and it never occured to me that rules were being broken.
 
It's not that I dislike Leben so much as I dislike the way the show is being handled. It is difficult to produce a show that is totally fair, but I think they could have done a little better job. I don't like the fact that Team Liddell has to give up his fighters because Team Couture was on a losing streak. I haven't thought much about a better plan, but I feel it's unfair to win a bunch of competions and fights and still lose fighters.
7sm, I see your point about Fear Factor, but at least they bring back everyone and the winners get something out of it. Even with that, I think if everyone but one fails the first event the winner should get all the money. When that guy fell into the fire on Survivor, he was off the show, they didn't bring back someone they had already voted out. That was OK by me. I think we can go back and forth forever and there is no perfect answer, I guess they'll have to do the best they can and I can watch or not...
 
Leben lost, Josh beat him in a unanimous decision. Leben should be out, end of story. Why should the injured fighter get to pick his replacement. That should
be the job of the coach and Dana White. What sport allows injured players to pick who goes in for them? I guess I have nothing against Leben, but it's
annoying to watch this show and see the rules repeatedly broken and there be no consequences. Why should one fighter be allowed to lose a fight and
still be in the running? I would have rather seen Southworth come back (if they really had to bring anyone back) because his fight probably should have at least gone
to a 3rd round. Isn't it pretty unfair to all the other fighters that lost and have to stay eliminated? Is it fair to Liddell's team that they worked
hard, took out Leben (who is a leader) only to have him brought back? I think it's a little more "fair" for Team Couture than it is for Team Liddell.
I'd just rather see the show be a little more straight up about how things are going to go, that's all. Like I said there should be alternates in case of injury.
I've seen Koscheck beat Leben, I'd rather see Deigo Sanchez fight Leben. Diego looks to be the class of the field at this point. Neither fight was much
of a challenge for him. I think he wins the middleweight division.
Click to expand...

I couldn't agree with you more. Everything you said here is pretty much what I was going to say. I really did think they would bring back a cut fighter instead of one that was eliminated in a match. Like I said earlier and as said above, they might as well just have Leban sign the contract right when they brought him back. How many chances can they give the guy? I admit I am not a Leban fan, but come on........

Deigo is real good, I has an excellent chance to win the middleweight contract, he looked better that Leban did. The final match will probably be Leban and Deigo. I also noticed the fight was over way before it went to the mat. You could see it in Josh's eyes that he didn't have it. Also you could tell he didn't really want to fight, despite what he said pre-fight, how about all the excuses he was giving when they were trying to decide who was going to fight. There are fighters like Forrest who are itching to fight, and that is how you should be. You should want to showcase your skills, after all that is what you are there for. I hope Forrest gets his chance next week, I like the guy, he looks like he should put on a good fight.

I guess we will have to see if there is a second season, if they learned from this season's setbacks. I really do hope there is a second season. I went on to Spike tv's website and told them how much I enjoy the show and hope they bring it back. I suggest if you like the show to let Spike know so there is a better chance at a second season.
 
Leben lost, Josh beat him in a unanimous decision. Leben should be out, end of story. Why should the injured fighter get to pick his replacement. That should
be the job of the coach and Dana White. What sport allows injured players to pick who goes in for them? I guess I have nothing against Leben, but it's
annoying to watch this show and see the rules repeatedly broken and there be no consequences. Why should one fighter be allowed to lose a fight and
still be in the running? I would have rather seen Southworth come back (if they really had to bring anyone back) because his fight probably should have at least gone
to a 3rd round. Isn't it pretty unfair to all the other fighters that lost and have to stay eliminated? Is it fair to Liddell's team that they worked
hard, took out Leben (who is a leader) only to have him brought back? I think it's a little more "fair" for Team Couture than it is for Team Liddell.
I'd just rather see the show be a little more straight up about how things are going to go, that's all. Like I said there should be alternates in case of injury.
I've seen Koscheck beat Leben, I'd rather see Deigo Sanchez fight Leben. Diego looks to be the class of the field at this point. Neither fight was much
of a challenge for him. I think he wins the middleweight division.
Click to expand...

I couldn't agree with you more. Everything you said here is pretty much what I was going to say. I really did think they would bring back a cut fighter instead of one that was eliminated in a match. Like I said earlier and as said above, they might as well just have Leban sign the contract right when they brought him back. How many chances can they give the guy? I admit I am not a Leban fan, but come on........

Deigo is real good, I has an excellent chance to win the middleweight contract, he looked better that Leban did. The final match will probably be Leban and Deigo. I also noticed the fight was over way before it went to the mat. You could see it in Josh's eyes that he didn't have it. Also you could tell he didn't really want to fight, despite what he said pre-fight, how about all the excuses he was giving when they were trying to decide who was going to fight. There are fighters like Forrest who are itching to fight, and that is how you should be. You should want to showcase your skills, after all that is what you are there for. I hope Forrest gets his chance next week, I like the guy, he looks like he should put on a good fight.

I guess we will have to see if there is a second season, if they learned from this season's setbacks. I really do hope there is a second season. I went on to Spike tv's website and told them how much I enjoy the show and hope they bring it back. I suggest if you like the show to let Spike know so there is a better chance at a second season.
 
My only problem with bringing back a cut fighter is that they haven't spent all the time and effort training like the other guys have. Grant it, Leben was eliminated but he has spent the time and effort training and doing challenges that the cut fighters wouldn't have done. Would it be fair to toss in a cut fighter in the middle of the show? These are the fighters that made the cut, did the works, and shed the blood (in leben's case :) ) so while it sucks to bring an eliminated fighter back, at least its one of the fighters that made the cut in the first place.

Like DSP said, we will watch or not, fair or not.

7sm
 
I'd be surprised if bringing Leben back changes the outcome anyway. Koscheck already beat him and showed that Leben isn't at his best on the ground. Diego Sanchez is crazy good on the ground and Kenny Florian is a black belt in BJJ so I would guess his ground fighting is pretty good. Leben will get beat by whichever fighter he goes against next. Leben actually seemed humbled when he came back. I got the impression he wanted no part of Koscheck again when he was talking at the meeting to set up the fight. And after the show Sanchez put on I can't see him being too hot to fight him either. Looked like Diego wanted everyone to see that if they call him out they are going to have a fight on their hands. He could have submitted Josh R. a lot sooner than he did if you ask me.
I only hope that no one from the blue team has to go to the green team now.
 
Yeah, I think the decision to bring back leben had to do more with TV than with fairness: he's the show's villian, without him there's no conflict, no conflict, no drama.

I agree that Dante is one hell of a fighter. Once he's in there, he's downright frightening. There's lots of others that we haven't seen yet, but right now he's my favorite to win. Wouldn't be surprised if it came down to Dante vs. Leben.

The southworth fight was disappointing. The new rules (timed rounds, judges decision) just plain suck. Lets face it, a judges decision is not a win for either side.
 
I watched a few minutes of the show a few nights ago. Saw a fight with Southworth and another guy(went to the other guy, which seemed to be contriversial) The fighting was sorta interesting but I also thought a bit boring (I don't know grappling so I can't see/appreciate the finer points of what all the hugging was about)

What really struck me about it was that it seemed very much like 'a soap opera guys don't have to be embarrased to watch'. Some awfully immature, childish attitudes there. Rather silly
 
InvisibleFist said:
I agree that Dante is one hell of a fighter. Once he's in there, he's downright frightening. There's lots of others that we haven't seen yet, but right now he's my favorite to win. Wouldn't be surprised if it came down to Dante vs. Leben.
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Who is Dante? Is that a nickname for one of the fighters? I think I'm missing something...
 
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