Speed Vs Power

Fungus said:
I'm not a golfer but I while think its more than lenght (different angles of the clubface, different materials and weight) but apart from that, the principle of longer clubs is no different than "higher gear". It does work, but only if you have enough strenght or torque to reach as similar end angular velocity or rpm.

So longer clubs, or higher gears, longer limbs, may get you higher end speed, but only until the limiting factor is the torque, or muscle strength.

With a given engine power, higher gears offer potential higher top speed, but slower acceleration so there is still a balance required. So if you upgrade your gearbox, you should also upgrade the engine, and your tires etc.

so just growing long limbs alone, is not going to be good.
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Well from what little I do know about golf the clubs that are designed to hit the ball further are longer because that means more head speed when you swing it, provided as you point out that you're swinging it with enough strength. For a seasoned golfer though that would not be a problem.

If a golfer swings a 9 iron the head will be moving with a certain speed, if that same golfer were to swing a 3 iron which is a longer club, the head will be moving with a faster speed provided that the golfer is in good shape and as I mentioned, seasoned. By the same token, if you've got longer limbs, and you've got the strength behind the techniques, your hands and feet should be able to reach higher speeds, provided that, as you mention, you're got strength in proportion to your length. However that is just one type of speed, there are other types of speeds in the martial arts and the maximum speed your hands and feet reach in MPH is just one type.
 
So in this thread we were talking about how a taller person might be able to reach higher maximum speed with their hands and feet in MPH than a shorter person, provided that they've got enough strength in proportion to the length of their arms and legs, to generate such speed, but here is where I think a shorter person would have an advantage.

A shorter person would be better at getting off more hits in a given amount of time, for instance with kicks per minute a shorter person would probably beat a taller person. A shorter person has less distance to move to complete a technique, for instance when a shorter person throws a kick their foot would have less distance it would have to move to complete the kick as opposed to a taller person because they've got shorter legs and so they have less distance they have to cover to fully extend the kick. Therefore they will be able to get off more kicks per minute even if the taller person is able to reach higher maximum speeds with their feet, because the shorter person has less distance their foot has to move.
 
PhotonGuy said:
So in this thread we were talking about how a taller person might be able to reach higher maximum speed with their hands and feet in MPH than a shorter person, provided that they've got enough strength in proportion to the length of their arms and legs, to generate such speed, but here is where I think a shorter person would have an advantage.

A shorter person would be better at getting off more hits in a given amount of time, for instance with kicks per minute a shorter person would probably beat a taller person. A shorter person has less distance to move to complete a technique, for instance when a shorter person throws a kick their foot would have less distance it would have to move to complete the kick as opposed to a taller person because they've got shorter legs and so they have less distance they have to cover to fully extend the kick. Therefore they will be able to get off more kicks per minute even if the taller person is able to reach higher maximum speeds with their feet, because the shorter person has less distance their foot has to move.
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Okay, I would call this common knowledge. What is your point?
 
PhotonGuy said:
Just looking for feedback to see if Im correct with my assessment.
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Yes, with several exceptions. Looking at it from an academic viewpoint, you are spot on. Looking at it in real world application, there are just so many variables that negate the idea at or very near having zero consideration.
 
So when talking about speed I think it's important to indicate what kind of speed we're talking about as there's different types of speed in the martial arts.

When talking about different types of speed I think a good analogy would be a 9mm uzi vs a .270 caliber bolt action rifle. The uzi has a much faster rate of fire, you can get many more shots off per minute with the uzi than with the .270 but with the .270 the slugs go faster as the .270 has a much higher muzzle velocity. So when asking if the uzi or the .270 is faster it's important to indicate what kind of speed you're talking about, shots per minute or speed of the bullets as they leave the muzzle. Same thing with the martial arts.
 
PhotonGuy said:
So when talking about speed I think it's important to indicate what kind of speed we're talking about as there's different types of speed in the martial arts.

When talking about different types of speed I think a good analogy would be a 9mm uzi vs a .270 caliber bolt action rifle. The uzi has a much faster rate of fire, you can get many more shots off per minute with the uzi than with the .270 but with the .270 the slugs go faster as the .270 has a much higher muzzle velocity. So when asking if the uzi or the .270 is faster it's important to indicate what kind of speed you're talking about, shots per minute or speed of the bullets as they leave the muzzle. Same thing with the martial arts.
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That analogy makes absolutely NO sense.
 
PhotonGuy said:
So when talking about speed I think it's important to indicate what kind of speed we're talking about as there's different types of speed in the martial arts.

When talking about different types of speed I think a good analogy would be a 9mm uzi vs a .270 caliber bolt action rifle. The uzi has a much faster rate of fire, you can get many more shots off per minute with the uzi than with the .270 but with the .270 the slugs go faster as the .270 has a much higher muzzle velocity. So when asking if the uzi or the .270 is faster it's important to indicate what kind of speed you're talking about, shots per minute or speed of the bullets as they leave the muzzle. Same thing with the martial arts.
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Speed = distance/time. That is all

And shots per minute is not the same thing. That would be Shots per Minute = (Total Shots / Total Seconds) x 60
 
PhotonGuy said:
So in this thread we were talking about how a taller person might be able to reach higher maximum speed with their hands and feet in MPH than a shorter person, provided that they've got enough strength in proportion to the length of their arms and legs, to generate such speed, but here is where I think a shorter person would have an advantage.

A shorter person would be better at getting off more hits in a given amount of time, for instance with kicks per minute a shorter person would probably beat a taller person. A shorter person has less distance to move to complete a technique, for instance when a shorter person throws a kick their foot would have less distance it would have to move to complete the kick as opposed to a taller person because they've got shorter legs and so they have less distance they have to cover to fully extend the kick. Therefore they will be able to get off more kicks per minute even if the taller person is able to reach higher maximum speeds with their feet, because the shorter person has less distance their foot has to move.
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The problem with this is that larger people tend to have a poorer strength to weight ratio, and it's difficult to escape. This is why there are little skinny people in class who can do many more pushups than larger people, despite lifting a fraction of what the larger people would in a test of absolute strength. I mean, for the sake of argument (the only reason this thread persists after all) I accept what you're saying, IF we were in an idealised scenario where much the same forces are in play. The truth is though that in real life other things come into play and the effect you are describing does not take place.
 
Wing Woo Gar said:
I’ve seen this analogy used in the past by the OP.
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Well to understand the analogy you would have to understand the difference between an Uzi and a .270, not everybody might know that.
 
Prince_Alarming said:
The problem with this is that larger people tend to have a poorer strength to weight ratio, and it's difficult to escape.
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Well that's true in the animal world for sure. An ant for instance can lift hundreds even thousands of times its own body weight depending on the species whereas an elephant might be able to lift one time its body weight, but not much more. That might also be true with people but not to the same extent.
Prince_Alarming said:
This is why there are little skinny people in class who can do many more pushups than larger people, despite lifting a fraction of what the larger people would in a test of absolute strength.
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The little skinny people also have to lift much less weight than the larger people. When you do push-ups you're lifting your own body weight with your arms so a skinny person who weighs less is going to have less weight that they have to lift, that also has to be taken into account.
Prince_Alarming said:
I mean, for the sake of argument (the only reason this thread persists after all) I accept what you're saying, IF we were in an idealised scenario where much the same forces are in play. The truth is though that in real life other things come into play and the effect you are describing does not take place.
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Well this has been discussed in this thread before and people have even posted videos on it, there are different types of speed in the martial arts and to see how they work in real life they have to be applied to real life situations.
 
PhotonGuy said:
Well to understand the analogy you would have to understand the difference between an Uzi and a .270, not everybody might know that.
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Clearly, you are one of those that does not understand the difference.
 
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