smile ;)

[ghostdog2]

Project Hillary = Humor

Political Correctness = Not Funny

Was it the funniest joke I've ever "herd"? Nope. But it was kind of cute.
Really, feelings on sleeves and all.....

p.s. Don't desire to offend anyone and MM doesn't need help, but does anyone really think the PH joke was an attack on women? If so, you'll have to break the code for me and, I suspect, a few others.

 

[rmcrobertson]

Jokes like that are always interesting. They reflect (as elsewhere mentioned) what Neil Hertz calls, "male anxiety under political pressure."

Why political? Well, oddly enough, even though Margaret Thatcher regularly got told, "Sit down, you cow," when she addressed Parliament, right-wing women--even truly monumentally crazy ones, like say Ann Coulter or Nancy reagan--never draw this sort of comment from right-wing men. One suspects that they become a combination of attractive dominatrix and mommy, but who knows?

With Senator Clinton, the political offense is most typicalloy turned toward an accusation--and it is always an accusation--of lesbianism. (As in, "How did Bill and Hillary meet? They were dating the same woman in college.") Of course, the real attack's on her feminism--but that can't be admitted, because that brings up the idea that it's a political disagreement that's at stake, and if we did that, then we can't express our hostility towards uppity women nearly as glibly and unconsciously. And anyway, the logic goes, all feminists are lesbians anyway.

Another way to put it is the stuff Freud talks about in, "The Uncanny," in "Jokes and Their Relation to the Unconscious," and in, "Psychopathology of Everyday Life." Women, being the Other, are a focus for the guy's fear and attraction--so, jokes help articulate both of these at once. Then there's this whole thing about castration anxiety--the beleaguered male subject goes back to early childhood fantasy, in which girls were seen as castrated boys, and if it can happen to them...see Freud's, "Little Hans," case study.

Jokes are also nice because they provide an alibi: anybody says anything about male anxiety/politics being connected, and you can always shoot back a) don't you have a sense of humor? b) it's just a joke, c) you libs always read too much into things...

 

[RandomPhantom700]

rmcrobertson:

Simply put, which jokes are acceptable to you, then? Or to put it less critically, what type of jokes are face-value just meant to be funny?

 

[rmcrobertson]

Nobody said anything about some jokes being unacceptable, or acceptable either for that matter. One merely commented on why jokes are funny....and was kinda kidding. Whatsa matter? No sense of humor?

In fact, the jokes about Senator Clinton--except for maybe the college dating one--aren't particularly funny at all. They're simply expressions of politically-based hostility.

The curious thing is, none of these people have ever met the woman. She hasn't done anything to them; there're no stories, in fact, about her even having been rude to anybody. There're lots of stories about her being smart, educated and assertive--so that must be the offense, eh?

On the other hand, we have--if we just want to get into the question of political women--Ann Coulter (who lies like crazy in easily demonstrable ways, and who acts like a nutcase on speed in a fashion unseen since Camille Paglia went out of style); Nancy Reagan (notorious for hiring a White House astrologer, and being what more than one guy who had to work with her idenfied as...unpleasant); Condoleeza Rice (known for being high-handed, patronizing, and dismissive of disagreements...oh yes, and wrong in some pretty important ways)...and a buncha others.

But no funnies about them, huh?

 

[ghostdog2]

Bill Clinton is walking on the beach when he finds a bottle with a Genii in it. Gets two (2) wishes. Okay, he says as he pulls out a map: I want Peace in the Middle East and fair national boundaries drawn out on this map;
Genie says: You must be nuts. That's impossible even for me; what else can I do for you?
Well, says Bill, as he pulls out a family portrait, I'd like you to make my wife Hillary and daughter Chelsea, beautiful, intelligent and well respected.
DAMN, said the Genie, let me see that map again......

 

[Melissa426]

Project Hillary = Humor

Political Correctness = Not Funny

Was it the funniest joke I've ever "herd"? Nope. But it was kind of cute.
Really, feelings on sleeves and all.....

p.s. Don't desire to offend anyone and MM doesn't need help, but does anyone really think the PH joke was an attack on women? If so, you'll have to break the code for me and, I suspect, a few others.

I have no issue with people making jokes. I have issues with people pretending they don't know why their joke might be offensive to some.

If MM wasn't pretending, then I see a problem.

Peace,
Melissa

 

[MisterMike]

Mooooooo.

 

[Cryozombie]

It's an on-going practice, it seems, to repeatedly take shots at women in this particular case

Oh I see...

Its ok to make fun of MALE Political figures

but Not Female ones.

GOT IT NOW.

 

[PeachMonkey]

Oh I see...

Its ok to make fun of MALE Political figures

but Not Female ones.

GOT IT NOW.

Actually, her point was more that, as Robert has already clearly shown, the mocking of female political figures seems entirely focused on sexist insults ("cows", "ugliness", "moo"). If the mocking of male political figures were based on solely an equally sexist basis, you'd get a bit more sympathy.

 

[shesulsa]

Thanks for the defense, PeachMonkey, and you are precisely correct.

I don't know if the other ladies where intimating the same idea, but that is my opinion and I'm stickin' to it.

Techno, check your PMs.

 

[heretic888]

Another way to put it is the stuff Freud talks about in, "The Uncanny," in "Jokes and Their Relation to the Unconscious," and in, "Psychopathology of Everyday Life." Women, being the Other, are a focus for the guy's fear and attraction--so, jokes help articulate both of these at once. Then there's this whole thing about castration anxiety--the beleaguered male subject goes back to early childhood fantasy, in which girls were seen as castrated boys, and if it can happen to them...see Freud's, "Little Hans," case study.

Kind of ironic for a guy that come up with ideas like 'penis envy' and the 'Elektra complex' --- then again, it was his friends' kids he was diagnosing.

Personally, if you're coming from the psychoanalystic school, I prefer the likes of Erik Erikson and Anna Freud (Freud's daughter). But, that's just me.

 

[heretic888]

TEN COMMANDMENTS
The real reason that we can't have the Ten Commandments in a Courthouse! You cannot post "Thou Shalt Not Steal," "Thou Shalt Not Commit Adultery" and "Thou Shall Not Lie" in a building full of lawyers, judges and politicians! It creates a hostile work environment!

Yup. Don't suppose it doesn't have anything at all to do with that "Thou Shalt Have No Other God Before Me" one or anything.

 

[Cryozombie]

Actually, her point was more that, as Robert has already clearly shown, the mocking of female political figures seems entirely focused on sexist insults ("cows", "ugliness", "moo"). If the mocking of male political figures were based on solely an equally sexist basis, you'd get a bit more sympathy.

Ok... so...

All the compairsons of Bush looking like a Monkey... such as:

http://www.bushorchimp.com/

Is Differnet than Saying Hillary looks like a Cow.

Man = Animal = Not Sexist
Woman = Animal = Sexist

Right. I get it.

 

[Tgace]

Whats good for the goose...er.. cow....er.. monkey...ahh forget it.

 

[shesulsa]

Ok... so...

All the compairsons of Bush looking like a Monkey... such as:

http://www.bushorchimp.com/

Is Differnet than Saying Hillary looks like a Cow.

Man = Animal = Not Sexist
Woman = Animal = Sexist

Right. I get it.

Can someone find that thread? I could swear it was posted by ... hmmm... lessee ... a man?

Honestly, John. My comments were not directed at you nor have I made any sexist statements. Can you honestly point to any female here who has made a sexist statement on this thread?

 

[Tgace]

Oh lighten up you guys er...people.

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20630&highlight=men
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=19202&highlight=men
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7874&highlight=men

Is this about the joke, or the person in the joke?

 

[rmcrobertson]

Wow, are guys ever....sensitive. A couple little posts explaining how jokes work and why misogyny's connected to politics, and whoof, there suddenly appears all sorts of weird claims.

 

[heretic888]

Meh. All jokes are just unconscious puns about samsara anyway...

 

[Cryozombie]

Can someone find that thread? I could swear it was posted by ... hmmm... lessee ... a man?

Honestly, John. My comments were not directed at you nor have I made any sexist statements. Can you honestly point to any female here who has made a sexist statement on this thread?

THIS thread? No. But the subject of male sexism was brought up IN THIS THREAD becayse someone compared Hillary to a Cow. I still dont see how thats different than calling Bush a Chimp.

And I am TELLIN YA...I wasnt singling you out. I know the ones you make were jokes. Probably like other posters, But whatever.

 

[heretic888]

I don't suppose anyone would come to the rather balanced, and accurate, acnknowledgement that there's a fair amount of sexism on both sides?? :idunno: