Brian Jones
Blue Belt
Joe Lewis and Mike Stone, maybe Bill Wallace. It's not the belt or the time, it's the person
Should a black belt be given out after only one year of training?
- Thread starter Harald
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Joe Lewis and Mike Stone, maybe Bill Wallace. It's not the belt or the time, it's the person
Brandon Fisher
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Ok lets look at this mathmatically for a second we all say 4 - 5 years of training. But how many hours per week is that.
Lets say the average is 3 hours per week:
52weeks x 3 hours per week = 156 hours
52 weeks x 6 hours = 312 hours
52 weeks x 9 hours = 468 hours
4 years is 208 weeks x 3 hours per week = 624 hours
Think about it if someone trains 3 hours per week for 4 years who is going to have the advantage the guy who trained for 6 hours a week for a year or the 4 year person. Not even considering this way gives you time to allow for your body to heal properly and for the information to settle in. Even the person training 9 hours a week 1.5 per day 6 days a week doesn't have the same amount of hours and training time in a year.
Honestly a year is way to fast in my opinion I don't care how much someone trains.
Lets say the average is 3 hours per week:
52weeks x 3 hours per week = 156 hours
52 weeks x 6 hours = 312 hours
52 weeks x 9 hours = 468 hours
4 years is 208 weeks x 3 hours per week = 624 hours
Think about it if someone trains 3 hours per week for 4 years who is going to have the advantage the guy who trained for 6 hours a week for a year or the 4 year person. Not even considering this way gives you time to allow for your body to heal properly and for the information to settle in. Even the person training 9 hours a week 1.5 per day 6 days a week doesn't have the same amount of hours and training time in a year.
Honestly a year is way to fast in my opinion I don't care how much someone trains.
As has been said, the interpretation of blackbelt used to be the starting point after movement attainment for further study, and is now transformed into the final product somehow, generaly speaking ofcourse, as it varies from club to club as you all would know.
Its like its grown as a "business".. Some of the prices for training out there are truly shocking. The word Franchise now appears LOL.
In my opinion, gradings could be carried out by simply informing someone during class that they have reached the next level for egsample.
We are kind of paying twice for the same thing yeah, like class fees to get to that point of skill, and then a substantial grading fee for the same point of skill attainment..
Whatever takes place at a grading should not be unique to any given training session right, or what is it we are paying for during the years of training? Perhaps leaving the blackbelt grading for the assoc. seniors to judge before a panel etc is warranted but a yellow belt having to pay to recognise that they can perform a few stances with movement and basic self-defence applications is somewhat pointless other than a nice profit..
Kind of like paying a weekly fee for car registration/insurance and then being expected to also pay a yearly fee for the very same car registration/insurance isnt it?
Perhaps im just a money miser!, Ive been training since the early nineties, and in that time ive seen it all, and in the end it is viewed as a business manouver most of the time LOL...
Its like its grown as a "business".. Some of the prices for training out there are truly shocking. The word Franchise now appears LOL.
In my opinion, gradings could be carried out by simply informing someone during class that they have reached the next level for egsample.
We are kind of paying twice for the same thing yeah, like class fees to get to that point of skill, and then a substantial grading fee for the same point of skill attainment..
Whatever takes place at a grading should not be unique to any given training session right, or what is it we are paying for during the years of training? Perhaps leaving the blackbelt grading for the assoc. seniors to judge before a panel etc is warranted but a yellow belt having to pay to recognise that they can perform a few stances with movement and basic self-defence applications is somewhat pointless other than a nice profit..
Kind of like paying a weekly fee for car registration/insurance and then being expected to also pay a yearly fee for the very same car registration/insurance isnt it?
Perhaps im just a money miser!, Ive been training since the early nineties, and in that time ive seen it all, and in the end it is viewed as a business manouver most of the time LOL...
To start...the kanji for sho dan is a knife and a piece of cloth. The idea being that a shodan is a piece of cloth that has been cut into its basic shape but has not yet been formed into a garment by a tailor....hence a raw beginner but with the basic form there.
As for the Senshusei program in Japan, the goal isn't to get a black belt but to get in-depth knowledge of the art, and yourself. This program is basically a large-scale uchi deshi program. As far as my aikido training goes...I learned more in 8 months as an uchi deshi attending class full time and being apprenticed to a teacher than I did the previous 6 years training 4-5 times a week. Training like that consists of around 30-45 hours of training a week, not including seminars or private lessons you assist your teacher in giving. For the completion of the Senshusei program, a black belt is the equivalent of a graduation certificate. Those people could care less about a black belt at the shodan level. Heck, when I was uchi deshi I was told I'm not allowed to comment/have an opinion on someone else's technique until I've been training for 10 years...regardless of rank (unless directed to do so). I would say my 12 years of karate training is about the equivalent of my 8 months of intense aikido training as far as knowledge of the art goes.
As for the Senshusei program in Japan, the goal isn't to get a black belt but to get in-depth knowledge of the art, and yourself. This program is basically a large-scale uchi deshi program. As far as my aikido training goes...I learned more in 8 months as an uchi deshi attending class full time and being apprenticed to a teacher than I did the previous 6 years training 4-5 times a week. Training like that consists of around 30-45 hours of training a week, not including seminars or private lessons you assist your teacher in giving. For the completion of the Senshusei program, a black belt is the equivalent of a graduation certificate. Those people could care less about a black belt at the shodan level. Heck, when I was uchi deshi I was told I'm not allowed to comment/have an opinion on someone else's technique until I've been training for 10 years...regardless of rank (unless directed to do so). I would say my 12 years of karate training is about the equivalent of my 8 months of intense aikido training as far as knowledge of the art goes.
dbell
Blue Belt
To me a first dan black belt is a person that has received, and remembers the majority (all that is taught to that point) of the content of that art. IF a person has received all the content, remembers it and can perform it in a year, then, yes, (s)he can achieve a black belt in a year.
A second dan black belt that has retained that knowledge, has received some new knowledge, has come to understand the "old" knowledge better, and is starting to fully internalize that content, including the new content provided. They are able to start, especially in the early content, showing the content to others in such a way that the "new person" can learn it.
A third dan black belt is a person that has received all of the content (in most arts anyway) has really started to internalize the content, and is able to teach to art in it's fullest.
Second and third dan can take years, and I would not expect someone to reach those stages in less than several years. (5+ from first dan for second dan, and another five to ten years for third dan from second dan.)
(This is based on a art that new teachings end upon reaching third dan, and in which the student is granted permission to start teaching on their own, and not under supervision.)
That said, when I see someone, say at tournaments or seminars, wearing a first dan belt, I look at them as someone that should be able to perform the majority of what that art has. I don't always expect them to have that knowledge internalized, and I expect to see mistakes at times. When I see a second dan, I expect a much better showing of the art, and I expect to see a person that is able to get into more detail as to the reasons behind what they are doing. If I see a third dan or higher, I expect some that is proficient in the art to the level of being able to pass it on to others, IS passing it on to others (or was when younger if retired), and who has internalized the art within themselves in such a way that they are living the art.
So, short story, yes, a person can reach first dan in a year, if they have had the time and instruction to receive the content of that art to the requirements of that art for first dan. Does that mean that person is 100% good at that art? To me, no. Just means they can demonstrate the content with at least some skill from beginning to first dan content, know the language up to that point, and, against someone in the system art, be able to at least hold their own for the most part against someone that has trained to that level.
A second dan black belt that has retained that knowledge, has received some new knowledge, has come to understand the "old" knowledge better, and is starting to fully internalize that content, including the new content provided. They are able to start, especially in the early content, showing the content to others in such a way that the "new person" can learn it.
A third dan black belt is a person that has received all of the content (in most arts anyway) has really started to internalize the content, and is able to teach to art in it's fullest.
Second and third dan can take years, and I would not expect someone to reach those stages in less than several years. (5+ from first dan for second dan, and another five to ten years for third dan from second dan.)
(This is based on a art that new teachings end upon reaching third dan, and in which the student is granted permission to start teaching on their own, and not under supervision.)
That said, when I see someone, say at tournaments or seminars, wearing a first dan belt, I look at them as someone that should be able to perform the majority of what that art has. I don't always expect them to have that knowledge internalized, and I expect to see mistakes at times. When I see a second dan, I expect a much better showing of the art, and I expect to see a person that is able to get into more detail as to the reasons behind what they are doing. If I see a third dan or higher, I expect some that is proficient in the art to the level of being able to pass it on to others, IS passing it on to others (or was when younger if retired), and who has internalized the art within themselves in such a way that they are living the art.
So, short story, yes, a person can reach first dan in a year, if they have had the time and instruction to receive the content of that art to the requirements of that art for first dan. Does that mean that person is 100% good at that art? To me, no. Just means they can demonstrate the content with at least some skill from beginning to first dan content, know the language up to that point, and, against someone in the system art, be able to at least hold their own for the most part against someone that has trained to that level.
Sorry to me it is no again and this is why.
If a person goes twice a week for 1.5 hours in a year he has train about 100 hours on actual materials. Most people take breaks and warm up and warm down exorcises so they may only get a 1 instead of the 1.5. At a place of employment you would still be on a learning curve for only having two and a half weeks od employment, so how can anybody be proficent with obly two and a half weeks of actual training in.... Rest my case.
If a person goes twice a week for 1.5 hours in a year he has train about 100 hours on actual materials. Most people take breaks and warm up and warm down exorcises so they may only get a 1 instead of the 1.5. At a place of employment you would still be on a learning curve for only having two and a half weeks od employment, so how can anybody be proficent with obly two and a half weeks of actual training in.... Rest my case.
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Lots of factors to consider.
Has the person trained before? If so, in what system, how long, and how advanced were they? Any of three things can help increase the rate at which someone progresses, but each of them also need to be analyzed.
What system - At our dojo, we teach Shotokan Karate. If someone came in from a Wado Ryu school, then they would certainly have a higher base level of knowledge that's closely related to Shotokan Karate, than, say, someone who has trained in Wushu Kung Fu. There's absolutely nothing wrong with Wushu; it's just that it's significantly more different.
Thus, I would expect someone with experience in a closely related system, to progress more rapidly. However, someone with training in a significantly different system would still progress faster than someone who had no experience at all, since good body mechanics are still good body mechanics, no matter what system you may be from, and there are only so many ways for a human body to operate correctly.
What does the shodan ranking mean? - This is very important, since in most schools, shodan means that you have a good proficiency with the fundamentals, and have demonstrated that you're ready to take on the more advanced material. Some schools. In this case, doing it in one year isn't necessarily a red flag. However, at a school where shodan means you're an advanced instructor, then that might raise a few eyebrows.
How long / How advanced - Assuming that someone came from a closely related system, from a good dojo, trained for years, and made it to black belt already, then I wouldn't have any qualms about fast tracking them to black belt. Much of requirements are already known, and it doesn't taken nearly that much time to hammer in the correct fundamentals. In these cases, I see no problem in having someone make it to shodan in under a year, since they were already much of the way up the mountain as it was.
If they're physically and mentally ready to handle the rigors of being a yudansha, and have demonstrated the proficiencies, then there's no reason to hold them back.
On the other hand, if someone trained for maybe a few months, or under poor quality instruction, then it's going to take a good bit of time to build things up.
Learning capabilities - Some people learn things faster than others. It's only natural, and will happen.
Work ethic - Those who correctly train harder should make it quicker than others.
In the end, though, to answer the original question, if a neophyte with no experience can make it to a legit shodan in under a year? My answer is this:
Yes, but this is very, very rare.
Let's say your neophyte is a highly talented individual, with a great capacity for learning, and good phyiscal shape. Now, let's suppose that he's in the dojo training 10 hours a week. If a student has that unusual combination of things, then consider yourself (and the student) blessed. Yes, I've seen it happen, and the person who earned the said rank, was very much deserving of it.
However, people who can do the above, are exceptionally rare, indeed.
They're so rare, that you probably don't have to worry about what to do with them, since they're essentially going to motivate themselves. All you have to do is point the way.
Now, what if I saw a school where they were churning out black belts after a year, yet the instruction was terrible, the students undisciplined, etc.? If that's what they want their black belts to represent, then so be it. That's their choice, but I'm not going to hold them in high regards at all...
Has the person trained before? If so, in what system, how long, and how advanced were they? Any of three things can help increase the rate at which someone progresses, but each of them also need to be analyzed.
What system - At our dojo, we teach Shotokan Karate. If someone came in from a Wado Ryu school, then they would certainly have a higher base level of knowledge that's closely related to Shotokan Karate, than, say, someone who has trained in Wushu Kung Fu. There's absolutely nothing wrong with Wushu; it's just that it's significantly more different.
Thus, I would expect someone with experience in a closely related system, to progress more rapidly. However, someone with training in a significantly different system would still progress faster than someone who had no experience at all, since good body mechanics are still good body mechanics, no matter what system you may be from, and there are only so many ways for a human body to operate correctly.
What does the shodan ranking mean? - This is very important, since in most schools, shodan means that you have a good proficiency with the fundamentals, and have demonstrated that you're ready to take on the more advanced material. Some schools. In this case, doing it in one year isn't necessarily a red flag. However, at a school where shodan means you're an advanced instructor, then that might raise a few eyebrows.
How long / How advanced - Assuming that someone came from a closely related system, from a good dojo, trained for years, and made it to black belt already, then I wouldn't have any qualms about fast tracking them to black belt. Much of requirements are already known, and it doesn't taken nearly that much time to hammer in the correct fundamentals. In these cases, I see no problem in having someone make it to shodan in under a year, since they were already much of the way up the mountain as it was.
If they're physically and mentally ready to handle the rigors of being a yudansha, and have demonstrated the proficiencies, then there's no reason to hold them back.
On the other hand, if someone trained for maybe a few months, or under poor quality instruction, then it's going to take a good bit of time to build things up.
Learning capabilities - Some people learn things faster than others. It's only natural, and will happen.
Work ethic - Those who correctly train harder should make it quicker than others.
In the end, though, to answer the original question, if a neophyte with no experience can make it to a legit shodan in under a year? My answer is this:
Yes, but this is very, very rare.
Let's say your neophyte is a highly talented individual, with a great capacity for learning, and good phyiscal shape. Now, let's suppose that he's in the dojo training 10 hours a week. If a student has that unusual combination of things, then consider yourself (and the student) blessed. Yes, I've seen it happen, and the person who earned the said rank, was very much deserving of it.
However, people who can do the above, are exceptionally rare, indeed.
They're so rare, that you probably don't have to worry about what to do with them, since they're essentially going to motivate themselves. All you have to do is point the way.
Now, what if I saw a school where they were churning out black belts after a year, yet the instruction was terrible, the students undisciplined, etc.? If that's what they want their black belts to represent, then so be it. That's their choice, but I'm not going to hold them in high regards at all...
Brandon Fisher
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Shodan equates to a understanding of the basics not really depth.
Explorer
Blue Belt
Short answer. No.
The speaker may have learned the "form" of the system but could not have internalized the substance.
This may say quite a bit about a school that would even consider giving a black belt to someone who has only put in enough time to get to 7th or 6th kyu.
The speaker may have learned the "form" of the system but could not have internalized the substance.
This may say quite a bit about a school that would even consider giving a black belt to someone who has only put in enough time to get to 7th or 6th kyu.
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Well, I dunno.
They could, as some said, be doing intensive study-in Japan, or Korea-it's not that uncommon. Or, they could be a prodigy: I've already posted once about Shokei Matsui, of kyokushin. He started studying karate at 13, and achieved shodan at 14-hardly typical, even in Japan, but no one doubts or has any business doubting his achievement.
Also, one has to recognize that often rank is awarded in Japan with the expectation that the student will grow into it; this was probably the case for many who returned from overseas service with rank, though it's also likely that just as many may as well have purchased their rank.
Lastly, of course, shodan means, as others have pointed out, "first step." While it's a passage, it's one that's made far too much of here.....
They could, as some said, be doing intensive study-in Japan, or Korea-it's not that uncommon. Or, they could be a prodigy: I've already posted once about Shokei Matsui, of kyokushin. He started studying karate at 13, and achieved shodan at 14-hardly typical, even in Japan, but no one doubts or has any business doubting his achievement.
Also, one has to recognize that often rank is awarded in Japan with the expectation that the student will grow into it; this was probably the case for many who returned from overseas service with rank, though it's also likely that just as many may as well have purchased their rank.
Lastly, of course, shodan means, as others have pointed out, "first step." While it's a passage, it's one that's made far too much of here.....
Black Belt in one year? No!
With that said, there are exceptions to every rule. If an instructor/school, awards a black belt to a motivational speaker that has proven himself and furthermore would like to serve as an example that things CAN be achieved, then YES, there's the exception. Specially if the student will continue with regular training.
There are a lot of factors that we don't know here, money, hours, previous training, etc.
Taking long to get a black belt for just the sake of taking long, does not make a black belt better. I've seen students take 2-3-4 months off at a time, habitually! and then earn their 5-year "training" Black Belt .
Now is that better, than someone who spent 2-3 years working their butts off with regular training? Not to mention if you're like me, where you're thinking about martial arts constantly, looking at videos, reading magazines, finding ways to improve yourself outside the dojo.
With that said, there are exceptions to every rule. If an instructor/school, awards a black belt to a motivational speaker that has proven himself and furthermore would like to serve as an example that things CAN be achieved, then YES, there's the exception. Specially if the student will continue with regular training.
There are a lot of factors that we don't know here, money, hours, previous training, etc.
Taking long to get a black belt for just the sake of taking long, does not make a black belt better. I've seen students take 2-3-4 months off at a time, habitually! and then earn their 5-year "training" Black Belt .
Now is that better, than someone who spent 2-3 years working their butts off with regular training? Not to mention if you're like me, where you're thinking about martial arts constantly, looking at videos, reading magazines, finding ways to improve yourself outside the dojo.
goldwarrior
Yellow Belt
NO! That is highly inaccurate! I don't know of any Bujinkan instructors who have given out Black Belts that quickly.
Where have you heard this? People on this board or personal experience?
Bruno@MT
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It's been mentioned by several Bujinkan people here on board, and a friend of mine on another discussion board mentioned that he had his Bujinkan shodan after just over 2 years.
In the Bujinkan it seems to depends heavily on your teacher, but between 2 - 4 years is not that uncommon apparently.
Victor Smith
Blue Belt
Historically in Karate it was Funakoshi Ginchin who started using the belt program after viewing Kano's Judo in Japan. After his first year in Japan he was awarding Sho dan rank. I'm sure it's how you grow a program from nothing. We know as time passed and his art became the JKA it developed different standards. He never awarded anyone beyond 5th dan, then after he died the JKA developed a new rank structure and instant 8th dans.
Funkaoshi, Miyagi and others did acquire teaching certificates from the ruling Japanese martial arts organization. Miyagi was awarded Hanshi I believe and Funakoshi received Kyoshi (just from memory).
Miyagi never awarded anyone a black belt and didn't believe anyone except the king of Okinawa should have that authority. After his death the Goju groups in Okinawa adopted Dan rank and handed them out.
Actually it was in the mid 50's the other Okinawan groups adopted black belts and dan rank, they chose to decide which standard they followed. Isshinryu's founder, never having been in a rank situation, awarded his American students sho dan after 1 1/2 years, made some of them senior rank to oversee Isshinryu development in the states and gave futurerank certificates to many others (many of who assumed that future rank when they returned home.
Look there were no standards, true karate didn't use rank, but when the Okinawan's realized they were going back to Japanese control in 1972, they decided to follow the Japanese approach, even though it had no historical relevance.
As there are no standards, except those an organization/instructor chooses to follow, all rank then becomes a closed house issue, irrelevant to what others do or think.
If rank moves an organization or a person forward, it serves a purpose. If it is used to instantly know what it represents to any outsider, they are fools (and I mean everyone who cares, because they're not in that organization.
I've seen programs with 1 year standards, and everything else. It's not how many years or hours, it's what the training really represents.
I use no time standard, sho dan is just a performance issue, nothing else. Simply perform the correct basics, 15 kata, basic self defense execution with skill. No application studies, they begin after black belt when the person's movement is to a level they can insert their technique into an attack with aplomb.
The probable adult time might be 4 years or shorter or much longer.
I don't find anyone reaching our average of performance before 10 years of training, so you can guage what we consider sho-dan's relevance. It's a step.
I've never looked for students, never charge, and am willing to accept those with other training, even serious times in other training, but the key to what we work is the movement potential, not kata knowledge so even advanced dan who are interested start at the beginning of the program (they keep their belt, but...)
The youth program works out to about 7 to 9 years study to reach sho-dan.
Beginning instructor qualifications are a mininmu of 15 continuous years training under the instructor before beginning mentorship, and that is regardless of previous training.
But I support the existence of programs that don't follow my approach, I really do. If people want 1 or 2 year black belts, good for them, I'd even help find them a school. Then my students don't have to worry about them. Always a good idea.
pleasantly,
Funkaoshi, Miyagi and others did acquire teaching certificates from the ruling Japanese martial arts organization. Miyagi was awarded Hanshi I believe and Funakoshi received Kyoshi (just from memory).
Miyagi never awarded anyone a black belt and didn't believe anyone except the king of Okinawa should have that authority. After his death the Goju groups in Okinawa adopted Dan rank and handed them out.
Actually it was in the mid 50's the other Okinawan groups adopted black belts and dan rank, they chose to decide which standard they followed. Isshinryu's founder, never having been in a rank situation, awarded his American students sho dan after 1 1/2 years, made some of them senior rank to oversee Isshinryu development in the states and gave futurerank certificates to many others (many of who assumed that future rank when they returned home.
Look there were no standards, true karate didn't use rank, but when the Okinawan's realized they were going back to Japanese control in 1972, they decided to follow the Japanese approach, even though it had no historical relevance.
As there are no standards, except those an organization/instructor chooses to follow, all rank then becomes a closed house issue, irrelevant to what others do or think.
If rank moves an organization or a person forward, it serves a purpose. If it is used to instantly know what it represents to any outsider, they are fools (and I mean everyone who cares, because they're not in that organization.
I've seen programs with 1 year standards, and everything else. It's not how many years or hours, it's what the training really represents.
I use no time standard, sho dan is just a performance issue, nothing else. Simply perform the correct basics, 15 kata, basic self defense execution with skill. No application studies, they begin after black belt when the person's movement is to a level they can insert their technique into an attack with aplomb.
The probable adult time might be 4 years or shorter or much longer.
I don't find anyone reaching our average of performance before 10 years of training, so you can guage what we consider sho-dan's relevance. It's a step.
I've never looked for students, never charge, and am willing to accept those with other training, even serious times in other training, but the key to what we work is the movement potential, not kata knowledge so even advanced dan who are interested start at the beginning of the program (they keep their belt, but...)
The youth program works out to about 7 to 9 years study to reach sho-dan.
Beginning instructor qualifications are a mininmu of 15 continuous years training under the instructor before beginning mentorship, and that is regardless of previous training.
But I support the existence of programs that don't follow my approach, I really do. If people want 1 or 2 year black belts, good for them, I'd even help find them a school. Then my students don't have to worry about them. Always a good idea.
pleasantly,
Haze
Blue Belt
Traditionaly there were no belts. Many Americans who trained in Okinawa recieved Black Belts in 12-18 months. Shodan means "sho=beginning, dan=level, so black belt is just a starting point for real study to begin. You should have a solid foundation and understanding of the basic concepts of your art to be awarded a BB.
So could you recieve a BB in 12 months? Yes. All rank is relevant where it came from. He is a BB at the place he recieved it at but that is realy all it means or what any rank means.
I had a BB come to our dojo to see if he wanted to train with us (he was new to the area) and he moved like he had never been on the floor before. Had another guy from the same style as us (Okinawan Goju) say he was a BB and he did have some great fighting ability but just couldn't remember any of the goju kata.
I know BB's that have memorized 25 kata but can not explain any of the applications from them, or very little from them. I know other BB's that only know 5 kata but have a very deep understanding of them.
Fiendlover
Black Belt
No, I don't think it's legit. When I trained in Japanese karate, I was there for 5 years and I was just getting my brown belt and I was there three to four days of the week and I practiced non-stop. I had to leave for family reasons but if I continued it would have still taken maybe another year before I hit black.
Now I'm taking Soo Bahk Do and even though many of the things are similar to what I did at my previous karate, I've been there for a little over a year and I'm taking my first belt test for green belt this Saturday. I've also been coming to class three days a week since I started except for this week where I will be there everyday until I test Saturday. And I'm not even sure I'm ready for that.
So no, I do not think a black belt should be given after a year of training no matter what art it is.
My daughter got hers @ 18 months. She had been watching my son do TKD for about 4 years. She pretty much new her forms 1 through 8 after 1 month. She was a natural @ sparing. They put her on the sparing team the first day. She started out training 5 to 6 days per week. She never lost a fight as a color belt. She won Nationals as a green belt about 8 months after she started. They moved he to red belt she continued to beat everyone she fought. She started fighting Black belt at about 1 year into her training before she had tested. @ about 18 months the master tested he for black belt. She had to pass the Black Belt test with everyone else. It was an all day test it started off with a 5 mile run. To pass this portion you had to run 5 miles in under 45 min. She finished @ 35.14 and beat everyone who was testing. That year she won a silver medal @ AAU Nationals Sparing and finished 3rd in forms. She has been training for 5 years and will be testing for her second degree this month. Clearly she was fast tracked because of her athletic ability and dedication to training.
We always worry about time requirements and such for black belt. It has different meanings to different people and different styles. The history of belt ranking has been gone over here, so I won't do it again. For all those who say a black belt in one year sounds like a McDojo though, take a gander at the Kodokan's website. They offer the opportunity to receive your black belt in a single year. The requirements are quite stiff though. I don't remember the exact amount of time training, but you have to win all of your matches at every shiai to qualify. That's no easy task. There are very few cases, but there are a few of people being promoted to shodan in Judo through batsugun (sp?), after short times, in one story a single day, because of their skill at throwing people. They defeated black belt level competitors at shiai, which qualifies them to be a black belt. In Korea, it seems like everyone I run into on the street has a chodan in Taekwondo. They get it when they're kids after a year or two. It's just the way the system works here. I'm not going to question it. Belt ranks are really for politics, I say leave the politics out of it unless you plan on being head cheese one day, and just train. Leave worries about rank to the Hombu if you have one, or to whoever is higher than you. If you're already the head cheese, then congratulations, you get to tell everyone who is under you what's up.
Just like the original poster I have always believed that one who recieves a black belt should have achieved a certain level of mastery. The hours of training, natural talents, dedication and such things play a very important role, but there are lots of fine points regarding MA that it takes quite a long time to understand. Therefore, imho it's very unlikely that someone who gets a black belt in one year actually deserves it.
LuckyKBoxer
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I can give someone a tenth degree black belt after 6 months of training, its legit.
I can give someone a yellow belt after 30 years of training, its not legit.
It all depends ont he person giving the belt and recieving the belt really.
I know alot of tenth degree grandmasters in martial arts, I am pretty sure I could smash every single one of them in a fight. So if I base the legitimacy of rank by how well the can fight me then alot of people have illegitimate rank.
I know of some incredibly smart, photographic memory people who are intermediate underbelt ranks, who can remember, explain, and recite theory, concepts and principles better then I can. so If I based legitimacy on that then I would probalby have an illegitimate rank compared to them..
You can make thousands of comparisons.
In the end it is going to come down to the person who accepts that rank, the person who awards the rank, and those that acknowledge it. Nobody else matters.
I dont have to train or pay money to someone I feel is an illegitimate belt rank.
I choose who I acknowledge, and if I think a tenth degree blackbelt is illegitimate, or a first degree is illegitimate, but they have students who acknowledge it who am I to judge them?
Don't get me wrong... I still judge them, because im a judgemental bastard.. But my opinions are worthless to them and their students in most cases...
just saying its all perception.
