Sakki test with live blade

[Kreth]

And that's retribution from Oni and Tengu (Demons), so I'll take my chances with Heaven...

Bring 'em on, I know onikudaki. :lol:

 

[Chris Parker]

now people are dodging bullets?

Okay, might be getting a tad literal. But speak with combat veterans. Even if they haven't developed the skill themselves, they often know of someone in the group that, if they suddenly get under cover, so does everyone else. And the way the bullets are dodged is by moving before they are fired... again, look to stories of someone who "just moved", then a bullet ricochets past where their head was moments ago.

But this is just one application. And it is just a modern military interpretation. Not definitive by any means. And if you don't believe these skills, that's fine. I'm not here to convince you, I've heard of many high ranking and experienced Martial Artist who don't. And if you do, that's fine as well.

And good luck with your Onikudaki, Kreth. Just hope they don't know the Kaeshi waza for it!

 

[Aiki Lee]

now people are dodging bullets?

you mean you don't?

Oh and Kreth, that was pretty funny. Kudos.

 

[Bruno@MT]

I suddenly have this image in my head of Neo doing the sakki test

 

[redantstyle]

Okay, might be getting a tad literal. But speak with combat veterans. Even if they haven't developed the skill themselves, they often know of someone in the group that, if they suddenly get under cover, so does everyone else. And the way the bullets are dodged is by moving before they are fired... again, look to stories of someone who "just moved", then a bullet ricochets past where their head was moments ago.

But this is just one application. And it is just a modern military interpretation. Not definitive by any means. And if you don't believe these skills, that's fine. I'm not here to convince you, I've heard of many high ranking and experienced Martial Artist who don't. And if you do, that's fine as well

fair enough.

i do think that people can exhibit or experience some rather odd states when confronted with a life and death situation. one 'thing' that i know can occur is a 'slowing' of subjective time. it's not the same matter that is being discussed here, but in the same realm, i think.

as a general rule, i dont think you can 'display' those types of skills, though.

regards.

 

[Cryozombie]

Well, I've experienced this sort of thing on my Motorcycle, got "the creeps and suddenly slowed way down, gone around a corner and found deer in the road...

The Deer dont have killiing intent, but they were there... is it Sakki, Magic Power, Psychic phenominon, or just coincidence?

*shrug*

I didnt hit any deer, and in the end thats all I care about.

 

[Troy Wideman]

Hello,

My name is Troy Wideman and I am ranked Genbukan Ninpo 6th Dan and I am the Shibu Cho for Canada. The Shihan have passed the sakki test with a live blade. The test is comprised of two cuts, one straight down and the other either left to right or right to left.


Respectfully,

Troy Wideman

 

[arnisador]

What happens whens someone fails the test?

 

[Chris Parker]

I think, simply, they don't get to take it again...

But, really, the test isn't just administered to anyone who wants it. It must be established that you will pass before, otherwise there's not much positive that could be said about it.

 

[Troy Wideman]

Hello,

I have asked the question myself, hahaha, mainly because there are a few of us to be taking it next. There have been some close calls. So I've been told. The idea of the test is to throw away your life for one moment, and to be in the moment. It is really not that much different than the Kyoshi test, only that the stakes are higher if you fail. However, I believe Sensei has a good idea if you are ready to pass it and would not let you sit if he felt you were not ready.

Kind Regards,

Troy Wideman

 

[Cryozombie]

However, I believe Sensei has a good idea if you are ready to pass it and would not let you sit if he felt you were not ready.

Kind Regards,

Troy Wideman

Its gonna suck to be him when he's wrong. ;P

 

[JadecloudAlchemist]

Do you have to sign a waiver so if you do get cut or killed you or your family does not sue?

 

[redantstyle]

when's the last time anybody got cut?

 

[Bruno@MT]

Its gonna suck to be him when he's wrong. ;P

In case you were refering to Tanemura sensei, I'd say no. It will suck worse for the one taking the test, assuming that he didn't have a career as headless horseman in mind.

But all joking aside, Tanemura sensei probably has enough control to stop a killing stroke even after it was initiated.

 

[ElfTengu]

Well, I've experienced this sort of thing on my Motorcycle, got "the creeps and suddenly slowed way down, gone around a corner and found deer in the road...

The Deer dont have killiing intent, but they were there... is it Sakki, Magic Power, Psychic phenominon, or just coincidence?

*shrug*

I didnt hit any deer, and in the end thats all I care about.

Bingo, fellow biker-dude.

I think we make too much of the sakki aspect in the Bujinkan. A scaffold pole falling towards your head with gravity being the only force behind it is going to kill you just as surely as a sword being aimed with murderous intent and yet many people who consciously or subconsciously hone their senses through dedicated taijutsu or similar training will dodge the pole.

An antler through the aorta can be nasty as well!

My brother has had very little MA training but had a similar motorcyling experience when he felt the need to change lane and in the lane he had just been in a car slammed into the car in front and he would have been sandwiched at high speed if he hadn't moved. I have had similar less dramatic experiences myself and believe that motorcycling is a good vehicle (if you pardon the pun) for developing a heightened state of spatial awareness and spidey-sense.

I do believe that a shinken is used for the test though, and not just a mogito, and also that, like any other test, a driving test or academic exam etc, it is unlikely that someone is entered for the test before they are more than ready for it (except the driving test perhaps, now that I think about it).

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

I would agree that it is much about nothing in the end.

 

[ElfTengu]

I would agree that it is much about nothing in the end.

Ah yes, the old Mu cow!

 

[arnisador]

What happens whens someone fails the test?

I think, simply, they don't get to take it again...

Because they're dead or maimed?

It isn't really a 'test' if 100% of the people pass it, is it? At that point it's more of a ceremony.

 

[Troy Wideman]

It would be interesting to see, how many people would actually take the test if the Bujinkan used a real sword for the test. People come up and take the test without a thought when they have nothing to loose. I did not say that no one has failed the test. I am sure that sensei has the skill to stop a killing cut but the threat of the possibility of something happening is very real. If you have witnessed a Genbukan Sakki test, the cut is right to the floor with no holding back. When I first joined the Genbukan back in 1993, I truly had doubts about the sakki test because I had witnessed other tests in other places that I thought were a joke. That was until I had the priviledge of watching Shihan James Wrights test in Japan. I have done alot of force on force training and there was just no way with the speed of Sensei's cut that even if Shihan had heard it, would have escaped. Sensei, broke the fukuro shinai on the ground he cut so hard and fast. That was the point that I started to believe the test was possible and real. Now it really does not matter if your believe me or not, it is something that has to be seen and felt.
Inrelation to the merit of the test and its purpose. Anyone in the military field or policing knows that this is talked about in all the military and police manuals. They mainly refer to it as your gut feeling etc. All human beings have the ability, it is just another thing when someone tells you to sit and calm yourself and feel it at that instant. If you speak to anyone that has been in active combat they will talk about it. There are other martial arts that do similar types of things, ie; philipino martial arts, indian etc. I have many friends in other martial arts that have told me of similar stories of when they have been fighting.
I once taught a young boy that was deaf in both ears and I tried the test on him with a ball being thrown at his back as his father watched. It was amazing to watch him avoid the ball without a thought.
We all hope that no matter what art we train in that we can attain a level of avoiding danger before it happens.
I wish everyone on this board luck in their training no matter what art or organization and that if they are training in a Ninpo art, when you take the test, sit with your back straight and loose all thought. Accept the cut and trust in your teacher, hopefully this will help you to pass. You will not have the gates of heaven open up, only the feeling of "Get the hell out of the way".

Kind Regards,

Troy Wideman

 

[Bruno@MT]

It would be interesting to see, how many people would actually take the test if the Bujinkan used a real sword for the test. People come up and take the test without a thought when they have nothing to loose.

+1 on this. If you don't feel confident that you could do this, you should not take the test lightly in the safe knowledge that nothing bad can happen.

If you have witnessed a Genbukan Sakki test, the cut is right to the floor with no holding back. When I first joined the Genbukan back in 1993, I truly had doubts about the sakki test because I had witnessed other tests in other places that I thought were a joke. That was until I had the priviledge of watching Shihan James Wrights test in Japan. I have done alot of force on force training and there was just no way with the speed of Sensei's cut that even if Shihan had heard it, would have escaped. Sensei, broke the fukuro shinai on the ground he cut so hard and fast. That was the point that I started to believe the test was possible and real. Now it really does not matter if your believe me or not, it is something that has to be seen and felt.

Thanks for sharing.

I wish everyone on this board luck in their training no matter what art or organization and that if they are training in a Ninpo art, when you take the test, sit with your back straight and loose all thought. Accept the cut and trust in your teacher, hopefully this will help you to pass. You will not have the gates of heaven open up, only the feeling of "Get the hell out of the way".

Thanks for your advice.
It is unlikely in the extreme that I ever get to a point where I can sit for the sakki test. If I do, then it is by no means a given that I will take the test. But I will keep your advice in mind.