Proud To Be An American

[terryl965]

My family has been in just about every war there has been here in America and I'll speak for my Father Master Drill Sargeant W.R. Stoker Sr U.S.M.C. veteran of World War Two and the Korean War.

When I was growing up all I even heard him say is for our county to be free we must fight those that try to bring us to our knees, we must never show wreakness for that is a sign for someone to attack. When we strike strike hard and fast and be humain enough to give compasion to those not at fault.

Stand behind our country for if we don't, no other country will either.
Right or wrong we must always show unity in the face of danger.

So sorry if some of you dis-agree with me and sorry if some of you do.
I will support what our county is doing at this present time, so do not get this confused with I agree what they are doing or even like what they are doing but I support what they are doing, if not what my Father, brothers and sister and cousins have gone though means nothing to this great land.

Terry

 

[heretic888]

Didnt you get that memo? Somthing about not questioning them or winding up in the secret prisons that dont exist?

I don't think a WASB like myself has much to worry about, Technopunk.

And, even if that does happen, it's a good thing our country always respects the ethical guidelines outlined in the Geneva Convent....

oh, crap.

 

[Elayna]

Ok let me get this out there.

As I put in a precious post I think it is pathetic what the government has to do the U.S. I dont think we should just do everything they say, no way. I mean it has gotten to where the criminals are rewarded and the victims are punished. WTF!!!
This is not right. But I dont see people standing together to stop this. I see people complaining about it and being like, oh well.

So let me rephrase this as well. I support the "IDEA" of the war. The idea of Freedom. I support the men and women fighting the war. I dont support any supposed hidden agendas. I dont support that at all. But i cant prove for 100 percent certainty that they exist. The probably do, but who really really knows.
I support the american people. I firmly believe in the consitution and the decleration of independance.
We should be able to say, think, do what we want to do within the law. The law should not favor those who do wrong like it does.
That is what we need to unite as a people for. Bettering this country for all the people. Not for the government, not for other countires or other people, but for OUR people. For american people. We need to make our country strong again before we worry about anyone else.

The reason why I Used the war is people complain so much about it. But I dont see them banning together and doing something. So there were a few riots, but now theve stopped. Oh yea thats conviction. LOL.
But I dont think it should be like that. We need to start with small things, then there will be a domino affect. We should UNITE together as a people to make THIS country better. To make the laws better, to make the security better. To care for our children more then those of other nations. We give more charity to other nations then to our own people. Whats wrong with that picture?? Why do we care more about other nations then our own???
So that is what Im trying to say. Care more about our nation from the start then other nations. Until our nation is the best nation in the whole feaking world. And I know it can be.
We are in Iraq because they provoked us. You may disagree fine. And I love you for it. At least you can think on your own. But instead of flaming me and hating me for it, how can we ban together to make THIS nation better??
What things do we agree on?
Stop thinking about the things we dont agree on and start thinking about the things we do. Thats the way the forefathers did it. What you think they didnt disagree on alot of things?? THEY DID. But they worked past it and made a wonderful country and document.
I have tried to make forums and groups to help with the situation, but instead of people concentrating on what we agree on , they attack you for what you disagree on. Nothing ever gets done that way. ONLY WAR.

Sooo...think, come up with something. Be apart of the solution instead of the problem.

 

[heretic888]

My family has been in just about every war there has been here in America and I'll speak for my Father Master Drill Sargeant W.R. Stoker Sr U.S.M.C. veteran of World War Two and the Korean War.

When I was growing up all I even heard him say is for our county to be free we must fight those that try to bring us to our knees, we must never show wreakness for that is a sign for someone to attack. When we strike strike hard and fast and be humain enough to give compasion to those not at fault.

Stand behind our country for if we don't, no other country will either.
Right or wrong we must always show unity in the face of danger.

So sorry if some of you dis-agree with me and sorry if some of you do.
I will support what our county is doing at this present time, so do not get this confused with I agree what they are doing or even like what they are doing but I support what they are doing, if not what my Father, brothers and sister and cousins have gone though means nothing to this great land.

Terry

Consider me one of the "some" that disagree with you.

I just cannot abide by the kind of rationale that says we should not question any policy or war that our government decides to get into until after the deed is done. This leads to the path toward self-destruction, in my opinion.

Our country is founded upon the principle of rational debate and compromise. The Founding Fathers would be rolling in their graves if they knew what was happening to us.

Laterz.

 

[heretic888]

Ok let me get this out there.

As I put in a precious post I think it is pathetic what the government has to do the U.S. I dont think we should just do everything they say, no way. I mean it has gotten to where the criminals are rewarded and the victims are punished. WTF!!!
This is not right. But I dont see people standing together to stop this. I see people complaining about it and being like, oh well.

So let me rephrase this as well. I support the "IDEA" of the war. The idea of Freedom. I support the men and women fighting the war. I dont support any supposed hidden agendas. I dont support that at all. But i cant prove for 100 percent certainty that they exist. The probably do, but who really really knows.
I support the american people. I firmly believe in the consitution and the decleration of independance.
We should be able to say, think, do what we want to do within the law. The law should not favor those who do wrong like it does.
That is what we need to unite as a people for. Bettering this country for all the people. Not for the government, not for other countires or other people, but for OUR people. For american people. We need to make our country strong again before we worry about anyone else.

The reason why I Used the war is people complain so much about it. But I dont see them banning together and doing something. So there were a few riots, but now theve stopped. Oh yea thats conviction. LOL.
But I dont think it should be like that. We need to start with small things, then there will be a domino affect. We should UNITE together as a people to make THIS country better. To make the laws better, to make the security better. To care for our children more then those of other nations. We give more charity to other nations then to our own people. Whats wrong with that picture?? Why do we care more about other nations then our own???
So that is what Im trying to say. Care more about our nation from the start then other nations. Until our nation is the best nation in the whole feaking world. And I know it can be.
We are in Iraq because they provoked us. You may disagree fine. And I love you for it. At least you can think on your own. But instead of flaming me and hating me for it, how can we ban together to make THIS nation better??
What things do we agree on?
Stop thinking about the things we dont agree on and start thinking about the things we do. Thats the way the forefathers did it. What you think they didnt disagree on alot of things?? THEY DID. But they worked past it and made a wonderful country and document.
I have tried to make forums and groups to help with the situation, but instead of people concentrating on what we agree on , they attack you for what you disagree on. Nothing ever gets done that way. ONLY WAR.

Sooo...think, come up with something. Be apart of the solution instead of the problem.

Well, it seems to me that the country is "uniting" in their opposition to the war and their opposition to President Bush's policies. Or is 70% of the public not good enough for you?? Or is that this "uniting" doesn't count because it's for a cause you disagree with??

In three weeks time, we'll see if the American people will "do something" about the mess we're in right now. I have faith that they will.

Have a good one.

 

[Elayna]

If It works wonderful. I will just be glad to see that people are voting. Bush cant be voted for again so that is a mute issue. As far as who will be president, I honestly dont know.
But I honestly believe that no matter who the president is will will still have the same issues. The war is only the tip of the iceberg and that is what I have been trying to say. It is more then the war that so many people flame about. So maybe having a different pres will make things better but I doubt it. Honestly I think that no matter what pres we have until the people decided to do something other the squabbiling it wont get better. I mean these are the issues that still have to be debated...

Criminal laws.
Child support.
Illegal immigration.
The enviroment.
Oil and Alaska.
And so many more....

We cant just make those go away by electing our pres that we want. And they wont be solved untill all the people agree on middle ground. That is what I am saying.
Voting is not all we can do. One letter to a congressmen is not going to do any good. But thousands will. Millions even better. Voting only happnes every 4 years people. So what do we do between those 4 years? Just sit back and say...oh well just wait in 4 years im not voting for you....So there. Come on.

Anyways....if my point hasnt been made, then my point has been made.
If we dont start agreeing on something...America wont last for long. I dont want that and I hope you dont either. Becuase I sure as hell dont want to live in the U.K. or china or under the United Nations rule. GOD NO.
So.....

 

[crushing]

No. As patriotic Americans, we have a DUTY to stand up and loudly and strongly oppose the policies of our government when it is wrong, and when it is enacting policies that are despicable both at home and abroad. That is what being an American is about. Not blind obedience to the government. It is terrifically important to speak up loud and clear when our government is doing things that we oppose.

Simply going along with our government, and thinking that that is what is means to be a patriotic American, is what allows our government to get away with horrible actions, and will lead to fascism. It is the DUTY of every patriotic American to hold our government in check, and demand that it remain answerable and accountable to the People who put it in power. It is not the other way around.

Exactly! You must have had other posts that I liked, because the system wouldn't let me give you a rep for this until I spread the wealth.

 

[terryl965]

Consider me one of the "some" that disagree with you.

I just cannot abide by the kind of rationale that says we should not question any policy or war that our government decides to get into until after the deed is done. This leads to the path toward self-destruction, in my opinion.

Our country is founded upon the principle of rational debate and compromise. The Founding Fathers would be rolling in their graves if they knew what was happening to us.

Laterz.

I never said do not question I said I would stand by my county decission PLEASE do not play word games with what I said. I do not like BUSH never had never will but he is the president of this county, question all you want but the fact remains the war is going on and our troops need to know this county stand behind them.

My cosin Frank was in the vietnam War and when he got home people called him a murderer all he did was do as ths county ask well September 11 2001 he died inside the Twin Towers masacre, the same people who called him a murderer years agoe know says he was a hero, how ironic is that.

Please do not lecture me about our politician or our President, my issue is wheather we are going to be here and support those troops that are at war. Who cares about them when all is said and done they get forgotten and this county does not.

LIKE I HAVE SAID BEFORE
GOD BLESS AMERICA
Terry

 

[heretic888]

If It works wonderful. I will just be glad to see that people are voting. Bush cant be voted for again so that is a mute issue. As far as who will be president, I honestly dont know.
But I honestly believe that no matter who the president is will will still have the same issues. The war is only the tip of the iceberg and that is what I have been trying to say. It is more then the war that so many people flame about. So maybe having a different pres will make things better but I doubt it. Honestly I think that no matter what pres we have until the people decided to do something other the squabbiling it wont get better. I mean these are the issues that still have to be debated...

Criminal laws.
Child support.
Illegal immigration.
The enviroment.
Oil and Alaska.
And so many more....

We cant just make those go away by electing our pres that we want. And they wont be solved untill all the people agree on middle ground. That is what I am saying.
Voting is not all we can do. One letter to a congressmen is not going to do any good. But thousands will. Millions even better. Voting only happnes every 4 years people. So what do we do between those 4 years? Just sit back and say...oh well just wait in 4 years im not voting for you....So there. Come on.

Anyways....if my point hasnt been made, then my point has been made.
If we dont start agreeing on something...America wont last for long. I dont want that and I hope you dont either. Becuase I sure as hell dont want to live in the U.K. or china or under the United Nations rule. GOD NO.
So.....

Elayna,

The midterm elections are three weeks from now. It can start by changing the balance of power in the Senate and the House of Representatives. That is absolutely essential.

The "culture wars" that you speak of (Right vs Left, Red vs Blue, etc) really began around the time President Bush came into office. It had always been there, in spades, but things really exploded when President Bush began implementing neo-conservative policies and his cohorts began their smear campaign against all who opposed them.

I believe Senator McCain could change things if he were president, but we will have to see in a year and a half as to how things go.

Laterz.

 

[heretic888]

I never said do not question I said I would stand by my county decission PLEASE do not play word games with what I said. I do not like BUSH never had never will but he is the president of this county, question all you want but the fact remains the war is going on and our troops need to know this county stand behind them.

My cosin Frank was in the vietnam War and when he got home people called him a murderer all he did was do as ths county ask well September 11 2001 he died inside the Twin Towers masacre, the same people who called him a murderer years agoe know says he was a hero, how ironic is that.

Please do not lecture me about our politician or our President, my issue is wheather we are going to be here and support those troops that are at war. Who cares about them when all is said and done they get forgotten and this county does not.

LIKE I HAVE SAID BEFORE
GOD BLESS AMERICA
Terry

Well, as far as that goes, I believe our military forces have done an admirable job in Iraq to date. They should all be commended for their efforts.

However, I think we have just about accomplished all we can using military channels. At this point, we seem to be doing more harm than good by having such large numbers of soldiers there.

The appropriate channels, at this point, seem to be humanitarian, economic, and diplomatic in nature.

Laterz.

 

[crushing]

Who invented the term neo-conservative and what is conservative about it? Doesn't something have to have something conservative about it before it can be 'new conservative'? Or is it just a devisive term to be used in an attempt to lump conservatives with the Bush administration in order to maintain the political duopoly? Us v. them, instead of Us v. them v. them and some of them?

 

[heretic888]

Who invented the term neo-conservative and what is conservative about it?

Neoconservatism

Doesn't something have to have something conservative about it before it can be 'new conservative'? Or is it just a devisive term to be used in an attempt to lump conservatives with the Bush administration in order to maintain the political duopoly? Us v. them, instead of Us v. them v. them and some of them?

"Neo-conservative" specifically refers to self-proclaimed "conservatives" that have abandoned the traditional conservative notions of fiscal responsibility and defensive foreign policy. In many ways, it combines the worst of both conservatism and liberalism.

Laterz.

 

[terryl965]

Well, as far as that goes, I believe our military forces have done an admirable job in Iraq to date. They should all be commended for their efforts.

However, I think we have just about accomplished all we can using military channels. At this point, we seem to be doing more harm than good by having such large numbers of soldiers there.

The appropriate channels, at this point, seem to be humanitarian, economic, and diplomatic in nature.

Laterz.

I agree our troops need to come home and as always we will build there county for them like always. I hate it when we re-build what we have to detroy.
Terry

 

[Flying Crane]

I really don't think anybody is blaming the troops, aside from some specific abuses that have taken place. But nobody blames the troops for the war or for what is going on in Iraq, in the larger picture.

What people do believe is that the war itself is wrong, we went to war based on lies and half-truths, and the true motives have little to do with the publicly stated motives. For that, we blame the politicians.

But the soldiers are simply being abused by the government. The US military is being misused to aggressively start wars, rather than in defense of our nation. Sure, they are just doing their job as they are expected and required to do. But the job they are being used for is wrong, plain and simple. It is the politicians who are at fault for this. I don't think anybody is calling our soldiers a bunch of murderers, like what happened after Vietnam.

 

[michaeledward]

I didnt support clinton because he .... was a cheating butthole. And well .... he was just dumb.

That statement speaks volumes, and tells us so much.

 

[crushing]

That statement speaks volumes, and tells us so much.

Well, at least he wasn't a 'repugnant', right? Personally, I didn't think he was dumb either.

 

[michaeledward]

Well, at least he wasn't a 'repugnant', right? Personally, I didn't think he was dumb either.

To me, to make that statement that Clinton was 'just dumb' is kind of like arguing the 'grass is blue'. But, I guess they do give out Rhodes Scholarships pretty easily these days, don't they?

 

[Carol]

kind of like arguing the 'grass is blue'.

Sorry Mike I couldn't resist

* ducking for cover *

 

[SFC JeffJ]

Support our troops, support freedom the world over.

Including freedom here in the U.S.

An administration that calls reporters and other people who disagree with their policies un-american should raise red flags. Remember McCarthyism.

That being said, we are in Iraq. We should finish the job there. The moment their own military and security forces are reasonably capable of fighting the insurgency, we should pull our own young men and women out of there. IMHO, if we just unilateraly pulled out without insuring the stability of Iraq, it would create more problems than it would solve.

I spent ten years in the U.S. Army. I saw combat on four continents and know how horrific it is. I don't want our soldiers, sailors, marines and airmen in the line of fire like I was. However, if we don't finish there now, we'll be there yet again a few years down the line.

However, I feel the administration chose Iraq over other, more important targets in the "War on Terror" for two reasons. One, the oil. Two, it was (and still is) an easier target than invading Iran and the areas of Pakistan that even their armed forces are afraid to go into.

Just my opinion,

Jeff

 

[michaeledward]

That being said, we are in Iraq. We should finish the job there.

Something that has been woefully lacking since this debacle began, was a clear, consice definition for the word 'job' - as used in your sentence.

The American people were told that the fight might last, 6 days, maybe 6 weeks, but probably not 6 months (SecDef Rumsfeld). We were told that Iraq was a country that could finance its own reconstruction (Wolfowitz). And now we find, the Secretary of Defense threatened to fire any planner who suggested a 'Phase 4' plan should be prepared (that's the plan for what happens after the pulling down the statue for the cameras).

Well - this past weekend, we were finally given a definition for what 'Victory' will look like; how we will know the 'job' is done.

Victory in Iraq will be a situation in which there is a viable government representative of the people of Iraq... It'll be an Iraq that is not a threat to the United States in terms of being a safe haven for terrorists.

It'll be an Iraq where al-Qaeda has been pretty well eliminated, where in fact the Iraqis are able to govern and deal with the difficult political situations, obviously, that exist inside Iraq, given their history. Those are all things that need to happen, and I think we're well on the way to doing it.

Fellow citizens --- please, please, please, --- read those few sentences carefully.

Do you honestly think we are "well on the way" to achieving what the Vice President describes?

Do you know the Kurdish flag is now flying over the government buildings in Northern Iraq, with the approval of the Iraqi President, and against the wishes of the Iraqi Prime Minister? A viable government for the people of the country. - We are moving further away from that.

But, that is the measure behind the mindless 'Road to Victory' signs; the 'As they stand up, we'll stand down' comments.

Iraq is more than a 'safe haven' for terrorists who wish to do America harm. It has proven to be a training ground. Watch the tactics developed and perfected in Iraq move to Afghanistan. But it not al Qaeda that is developing those tactics. al Qaeda represents a tiny portion of belligerents in Iraq. But, al Qaeda is watching, and learning from the Sunni insurgents.

Our government - WE - have created the very thing we were trying to eliminate. It is called the "Law of Unintended Consequences".