jasonbrinn
Purple Belt
I have my opinion but I want to know yours. Please give the reasons why you feel the way you do as well. Thank you in advance for the responses.
Pepper Spray for Self Defense?
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Hello Jason,
IMO, I think that it has its pros and its cons.
The pros:
Its a small, compact weapon.
It can pretty much be carried anywhere, of course with the exception of certain areas, ie: airports.
It has a good effect on the person its used against.
It can be deployed from a distance.
The cons:
Its possible that it may not have the desired effect on every single person.
Unless you already have it in your hand, if you have to fumble thru a purse or pocket to get it, it may be too late to deploy.
If its windy, it may not be the best tool to use.
If the person using it, isn't used to the effects, and its very possible that they too can be exposed to it, it will possibly hinder their escape as well.
Thats all that comes to mind at the moment.
Better than nothing, but requires some level of practice or training that most people who own it never get or do.
Unreliable and ineffective. It often doesn't work on the people you most need it to; they're drunk or high or just angry as all get out and don't really feel the effects until later. It MAY be a distraction, if you're lucky. And, generally, it's not carried in a way that makes it accessible or usable under pressure.
I dont believe in it. Not only do You need to get the stuff whilst Mr Man punches Your silly face, but You then need to accurately get His eyes. Furthermore, it isnt KO juice. Its "OW YOU ****** GET OVER HERE, ****!" spray. I have never seen someone act submissively to Pepper Spray, especially not at first. It just hinders them. IF You can produce it in time.
It depends. A person who has no training, and is passive and unorganized by nature, is screwed. A person who is just the opposite could be a different story.
To me, the biggest factor in carrying pepper spray, isn't practical. That is - to get sprayed in the face with said pepper spray so you know what the heck you're dealing with. (and please don't give me the "you don't have to get shot to know guns are good".)
Pepper spray doesn't usually work the way a person hoped it might work - if it works at all. If a person can get to it in time, which I doubt, and that is less likely to happen the longer it's carried with never being deployed, conditions need to be perfect, which they never are. (wind, the grip and direction of the canister grabbed in a time of severe stress, and the determination of the aggressor.) So, in the hands of a person who has no combat skills, I wouldn't bet the farm on it.
To me, the biggest factor in carrying pepper spray, isn't practical. That is - to get sprayed in the face with said pepper spray so you know what the heck you're dealing with. (and please don't give me the "you don't have to get shot to know guns are good".)
Pepper spray doesn't usually work the way a person hoped it might work - if it works at all. If a person can get to it in time, which I doubt, and that is less likely to happen the longer it's carried with never being deployed, conditions need to be perfect, which they never are. (wind, the grip and direction of the canister grabbed in a time of severe stress, and the determination of the aggressor.) So, in the hands of a person who has no combat skills, I wouldn't bet the farm on it.
One thing: Why the hell would a Passive and Unorganised Person be trying to Attack You?
Indagator
Blue Belt
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When I was in the security industry we tended to avoid it. Our company preferred to use those flick-out extendable batons, and tbh I never actually had to use it. The "top two inches" method seemed to work for me, and I was doing security patrol and alarm repsonse in some of the worst neighbourhoods in that particular city at the time...
But I have used OC spray before (and made it once, just for the fun of DIYing something! I would advise against it...
LMAO) and personally I think it can be okay if used in a similar application to metsubishi, as it shares many many principles in common.
I would hazard that its ideal usage in a real self defence type encounter is to spray the heck outta the other guys eyes, to create an opportunity to run like hell to a safer location.
But I have used OC spray before (and made it once, just for the fun of DIYing something! I would advise against it...
LMAO) and personally I think it can be okay if used in a similar application to metsubishi, as it shares many many principles in common.I would hazard that its ideal usage in a real self defence type encounter is to spray the heck outta the other guys eyes, to create an opportunity to run like hell to a safer location.
Sorry I wasn't clearer, I meant a passive and unorganized person carrying pepper spray.
ballen0351
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I think it has its place. It is effective on alot of people but not all so you have to understand that before you ever use it and already have a plan B ready when it does not work. I have used its it many times and I would say its effective 80% of the time Ive used it. I dont like it because it makes a mess and then you have to hear the person cry for the next 2 hours so I try not to use it. It really has no effect on my it burns and makes my eyes water but I can still fully function with it. Ive always found it hurt more later in the shower then when Im actually sprayed.
One of our officers is damn near immune to the stuff, in FLETC they turned her head red after repeatedly spraying her and basically it made her eyes water a bit and gave her a runny nose.
ballen0351
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Yeah I had a Lt that would put in on crackers and eat it. All he would say was "It stings a little coming out" :fart:
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+1 on the above.
I will add that I've used O.C. numerous times, more than I can remember. I've had it drop a full grown man to his kness where he cried like a baby. This man was actively engaged in a violent fight. I've also had a EDP (emotionally disturbed person) take a full hit to the eyes where he wiped it out of his eyes, grinned and growled, "Come in here and get me". And of course...I was the guy who had to go in there and 'get him'.
So it 'can' worked wonderfully fantastic. It can also not work at all. And sometimes it will work, but not immediately. I would suggest NOT using 10% O.C. This is a marketing gimmick (straight from the mouth of the guy that invented the modern O.C. spray). 10% is in a water base. Oil and water don't mix so actually the pepper can be prevented from immediately getting into the pores and membranes. 5% or 5.5% is usually in a carrier that is non-flammable but also disapates very quickly, which leave ALL the pepper on the face/membranes. It works better.
Keep in mind that you need to spray and MOVE!!!! Don't spray and stand there marveling at how well you painted him or waiting to see if it worked. It isn't magic. Even if it works well, they can still possibly continue the attack. Spray and move in a direction that is out of their path if at all possible.
KSD is obviously a LEO or a CO. Either way you've had a first hand run with OC. The state of West Virginia requires you get sprayed during certification to use oc. And yes it hurts like he!!. I have very little tolerance for the stuff, but as KSD stated I've seen guys that it has little effect on. And in the Bureau we us some heavy duty stuff. If your going to use it for self defense like I tell the women in class who bring it up. If your going to us it keep it accessible and be ready to take a hit from it yourself. Getting sprayed is no fun and we as LEOs and COs do it so we can learn you can fight through it. Personally I'd like to see some regulation put on it. Like a conceal and carry coarse.
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Thank you for bringing up this point. It is important for the carrier to know that if by chance they take a hit themselves (wind blew it back in your face, Murphy's law etc) that you can fight through it and survive. It is part of the mindset needed to adapt and overcome any situation.
I got hit with 5.5% in the instructors course and incidental exposures over the years (try tackling a guy drenched in the stuff!) and yeah, it sucks. But it only sucks for a short while.
Oh, and here's a tip; if you get a hit of the stuff in the face be careful later on when you're taking a shower. Make sure you lean over so the run off water isn't going downhill to more...uh...sensitive areas of your person. It is a self-correcting error you'll only do once!
:uhyeah:
oaktree
Master of Arts
As others have pointed out not the best tool.
In my opinion if you want something to get the eye
Use a finger jab. Its quick can cause damage and
if nothing else causes someone to blink and maybe
flinch while you follow through with a more higher
impact weapon.
In my opinion if you want something to get the eye
Use a finger jab. Its quick can cause damage and
if nothing else causes someone to blink and maybe
flinch while you follow through with a more higher
impact weapon.
thegatekeeper
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I know there are many woman that carry one around. I wouldn't do it if I was comfortable with my skills thou.. too much baggage
I remember back in the academy for Corrections. A few of the instructors, who of course were wearing masks...lol...shot off a bunch of OC inside of a shed. Groups of us, probably something like 6 or 7, I dont recall the exact number, all had to go in, single file. Once in, we waited, then had to recite certain things. Nobody could leave until everyone was done. Figures, I was the last in line...LOL.
This wasn't a direct hit, but it sucked nonetheless! LOL! I'd never seen so many teary eyes, runny noses and people coughing in my life...LOL.
Oaktree, eye jabs are not really an acceptable option for a lot of people. One reason many people, especially many women, look to things like pepper spray for self defense is that they want a quick fix that doesn't involve really addressing the issue of physical confrontation. I know people who carry spray precisely because they cannot come to terms with having to do real damage and "really hurt" another person. They probably imagine that the pepper spray they are carrying is going to be something like a Star-Trek "phaser" set to "stun".
Another thing, a lot of the ladies carrying that stuff have never thought about some of the things brought up in this thread, like what happens if you get that stuff in your own face... or even in the air around you. Where I used to work in adult ed., a teacher and her students came stampeding out of a small room, coughing and wheezing. I asked her what happened and she just said "...bad smell, but I left my purse in there. Can you please go get it!".
Well, I should have asked more questions, but she was cute and blond, and like an idiot I walked right in and grabbed her purse... which erupting with a mist from her ruptured can or pepper spray! Man it was nasty, but I don't think it affected me nearly as badly as it did the woman the purse belonged to. And she wasn't even holding it when it blew up. Honestly, I doubt that she could ever use the stuff to defend herself without being just as incapacitated as the person she used it on!
Another thing, a lot of the ladies carrying that stuff have never thought about some of the things brought up in this thread, like what happens if you get that stuff in your own face... or even in the air around you. Where I used to work in adult ed., a teacher and her students came stampeding out of a small room, coughing and wheezing. I asked her what happened and she just said "...bad smell, but I left my purse in there. Can you please go get it!".
Well, I should have asked more questions, but she was cute and blond, and like an idiot I walked right in and grabbed her purse... which erupting with a mist from her ruptured can or pepper spray! Man it was nasty, but I don't think it affected me nearly as badly as it did the woman the purse belonged to. And she wasn't even holding it when it blew up. Honestly, I doubt that she could ever use the stuff to defend herself without being just as incapacitated as the person she used it on!
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