Loyalty: To Instructor, School, or Style?

[Ceicei]

I was talking about this with another martial artist the reasons why people stay or leave certain styles/schools/instructors. Of course, this is a simplistic view, but I'm curious to how strong your sense of loyalty is within the martial arts world. Hypothetically, how would you deal with the following scenarios?

Are you loyal to your instructor, even if the instructor leaves? Would you follow if that instructor set up a new (same style) school?

Are you loyal to your instructor, even if the instructor decides to switch to a different style?

Are you loyal to your style, regardless of instructor? Would you leave the school and look for another similar style school if the original school chose to change styles?

Would you stay with the school, regardless of style changes or whether instructors leave?

- Ceicei

 

[dubljay]

I am loyal to my instructor. Simply because he has put at least as much effort into my training as I have, probably more so. The countless times he has stayed after class to help me nail down a kata or techniques he deserves atleast loyalty. Though I currently train with with Mr. Liles now (due to a transfer in schools), I will still continue to test under my oringinal instructor, which Mr. Liles agrees with.

I am loyal to my style, however this doesn't mean that I will not incorperate new ideas to my style hopefully making it better.

 

[Sin]

Now my style is only taught by one guy so I am loyal to his teachings

 

[Feisty Mouse]

I think my experience of the instructor colors how I perceive the art. I love what I'm learning now, but that's in part because of the great people who teach me. If I had to pick, I guess instructor/school.

 

[ThatWasAKick]

<points up> What Dublejay said.

My instructor is a good friend for whom I have great respect. Also, I owe him for the energy he's put into me.
I would follow him regardless of style because I trust his judgement in knowing what I need to learn, and he's a born teacher.

That said, I have no problem with cross-training, and neither does he.

 

[ghostdog2]

Perhaps I don't understand what you mean by "loyalty" and don't see how such a lofty concept would apply here. I am loyal to my wife, family and country. I wasn't conflicted @ my high school coaches and I wouldn't be conflicted @ my MA instructor or any particular style either. As they say, the map is not the territory.
As an aside: such a "conflict" could arise only if and when your instructor or school made the decision to change. He/she/they did what was best for them without worrying @ the effect on you; so do the same. Do what suits you. You joined a dojo not a church.

 

[MichiganTKD]

I am forever loyal to my Instructor, although it would be inconceivable that he would switch styles. Not because I feel bound to, but because all he has done for me I couldn't imagine practicing Tae Kwon Do with someone else.
MMA people who consider their Instructor as the one who shows them how to inflict pain in the ring just don't get it.

 

[Ronin Moose]

I'm loyal to my instructor. I cannot imagine where I would have been (in progression) without his caring and attention. Since he's been teaching Kenpo for well over 30 years, I don't see him changing styles, so it looks like I'm safe there. He is, without a doubt, one of the finest men I have known in my life!

 

[terryl965]

A true MA'er is true to there roots no matter what happens for they brought life to your Art... GOD BLESS AMERICA

 

[TChase]

I think it is more important to be loyal to yourself and to your path in life. If your teacher isn't on the same page as you or does not posses the qualities you seek then you will never be happy. Someone can't teach what they themselves don't know. It took me quite a while to find where I belong. I completely started over from scratch 3 times.

I first started out in Villari/Cerio Kenpo. After getting my 2nd Brown I finally admitted to myself that this just doesn't work. Although it was something I knew for a long time, but loyalty to my instructor kept me there. It wasn't what I was looking for so I said my goodbyes and went on my way.

After a little time off I knew Ed Parker American Kenpo was what I wanted. I started all over again training at an IKKA school. After a while I started getting the same feelings again. I had questions that couldn't be answered by my teacher. I knew the way I was being taught did not work and would not hold up in reality. I saw the way Parker moved and this wasn't it. I tried all the various AK videos and books to supplement my training but I was just prolonging what had to be done. My standards for black belt where much higher than my teachers and the IKKA's, so about 2 months before my black belt test I made up my mind to leave and find the Kenpo I was looking for.

After a little searching I found the person who would be my my teacher and friend for the rest of my life. After 10 mins I knew that was exactly where I belonged. Every concern and every question I ever had was answered and I knew what he was teaching without a doubt works. There are at least 10 Kenpo schools in my immediate area and I drive an hour and a half every week to go train because that is my path.

I know I didn't really answer your specific questions but my point is you should never compomise your path in life. Don't let blind loyalty stand in the way of what you know is right for you.

 

[MA-Caver]

<snip> I know I didn't really answer your specific questions but my point is you should never compomise your path in life. Don't let blind loyalty stand in the way of what you know is right for you.

Well it sounds like you're becoming (not right at the moment) more loyal to your current instructor. So is that your path in life then? Hmm, I think finding the "right" instructor is very important... because if you canna click with them you canna learn from them.
I know that I couldn't deal learning from some anal-retentive, because my personality is far too loose and informal for such nonsense. But having someone who is disciplined with their art and ensuring that I will be the same way... I'll go for.
TChase, I hope you do find the path you seek. It isn't difficult but at the same time it isn't easy.
:asian:

 

[TChase]

Well it sounds like you're becoming (not right at the moment) more loyal to your current instructor. So is that your path in life then? Hmm, I think finding the "right" instructor is very important... because if you canna click with them you canna learn from them.
I know that I couldn't deal learning from some anal-retentive, because my personality is far too loose and informal for such nonsense. But having someone who is disciplined with their art and ensuring that I will be the same way... I'll go for.
TChase, I hope you do find the path you seek. It isn't difficult but at the same time it isn't easy.
:asian:

I'm absolutely loyal to my current teacher. I have been for many years now. But it's not blind loyalty. I've seen just about everything that is out there in the world of Kenpo and I have everything I wanted and more. I wasted many valuable years with instructors that I wasn't happy with because I wanted to be loyal to them. The problem was I wasn't being loyal to myself.

 

[loki09789]

None of the categories above really fit my take on this but here it goes:

I am loyal to my values and principles.

Style? I wouldn't say I am loyal to a style but that I have found a style that fits my goals and intent as an artist. If I can cross train (even to the point of ranking highly) in another style because it also fits my goals and intent then cool. By focusing on my goals and intent, I leave myself open to the quality of any system/style instead of carrying such a strong bias that I won't even give other arts a chance (not saying that those who don't agree with me do that btw)

Instructor? Yes, but not because of the style thing or the 'art' thing so much as the comradery/friendship thing. We may associate because of the common goal of martial arts but the bond is not 'martial arts' but friendship.

Honestly, in most MA programs, it is a voluntarily thing, an 'escape from the real world' thing and if I don't like the crew, the instructor or the environment because they/it don't fit my values and principles as well as goals, why should I stay? I joined the military and swore oaths and all that...this ain't that.

 

[Andrew Green]

I am loyal to myself, and respect anyone that can teach me. I am loyal to anyone worth being loyal too. Instructor or not, but by that I do not mean learning from them, only them, and not deviating or ever leaving. I have a lot of respect for my original instructors, wouldn't be where I am without them. But what I am doing now looks nothing like what i learnt from them.

But shouldn't a good instructor who really cares about your development be willing... even suggest where you should go if you need something he cannot for whatever reason provide?

As long as by "loyal" you don't mean "follow blindly" then you got something. But some people become so obsessed with style and lineage that they forget what is really important.

SOme instructors feed on this by talking about loyalty to a master or a style, quoting little zen stories which basically mean give your money to me, and only me for the rest of your life....

 

[loki09789]

I am loyal to myself, and respect anyone that can teach me. I am loyal to anyone worth being loyal too. Instructor or not, but by that I do not mean learning from them, only them, and not deviating or ever leaving. I have a lot of respect for my original instructors, wouldn't be where I am without them. But what I am doing now looks nothing like what i learnt from them.

But shouldn't a good instructor who really cares about your development be willing... even suggest where you should go if you need something he cannot for whatever reason provide?

As long as by "loyal" you don't mean "follow blindly" then you got something. But some people become so obsessed with style and lineage that they forget what is really important.

SOme instructors feed on this by talking about loyalty to a master or a style, quoting little zen stories which basically mean give your money to me, and only me for the rest of your life....

Well said.

 

[8253]

I am loyal to my own sense of direction/purpose. Though my Instructor, School, and Style has helped to create that sense of direction/purpose it must still come first or I wouldnt be living my own life. Besides, i chose Kenpo because it is what works for me. However if i find something in another art that is usefull then i will use it. It really shouldnt be about loyalty anyway's, it should be about learning properly.

 

[OC Kid]

I recievedmy B/B and moved away. I was training with another instructor of the same style in the new state I moved to . the instructor in the state I moved to broke away from the system. there is a new master in which noether of us like or really respect . I was loyal to my instructor. but since He retired I broke away and joined the instructor who helped take me from B/B on. (If all this babbling makes sense???)

 

[SMP]

I am very loyal to my Sifu - In fact I dropped a job and moved to study under him again. But within that loyalty lies a responsibility to follow the path that is right for me. I would do him a disservice if I did not strive to be the best martial artist I can be. If that means I have to study other places so be it. He has always encouraged me to learn what I can from other arts and artists.

 

[shesulsa]

Hopefully I voted correctly (darn chads!!!). I am loyal to my teacher and would stick with him if he changed styles. I voted loyal to instructor/switch style.

 

[sifu nick]

Our style is that of a combined system. My master's instructor took his own traditional tae kwon do instruction and added aikido, judo, ju-jitsu, and some jkd concepts. Our style is unique in that Grand Master Jack Moscato passed this knowledge onto our Master Instructor Mike Conroy and although he had other black belts the style was passed on to Master Conroy. He is currently the only one teaching it. So my loyalty is to both him and the style since they go hand in hand. Our school will not be bought out at anytime and this isn't even a worry/consideration for me.