Is bjj original

[jayoliver00]

A lot of this is not true. "All failed"?

This is why you should read more.

And maybe tone down the BJJ worship a little? Just some friendly advice, it's kind of obnoxious.

You can't even make any arguments and are now just crying.

And calm down, I don't even like BJJ that much. They're my main competition for new students.

 

[Oily Dragon]

You posted pictures of Chinese people.

Actually they are drawings.

It's clear that you don't have a higher understanding of BJJ and these specific techniques so you're just broad brushing with a canned answer.

Why can't you show me similar pics of these Chinese people executing the Berimbolo?

Maybe they're in there. I honestly don't know, it's a massive compendium on multiple volumes. It describes wrestling and grappling techniques for training imperial soldiers, as well as instruction for everyone from medicine to poison, before you even get to the volumes on Beer Pong Crossbow X guard.

People have been locking legs 99% longer on this earth than the Gracie family has been alive bro. Just because they put their name on it doesn't mean they own it.

 

[Oily Dragon]

You can't even make any arguments and are now just crying.

And calm down, I don't even like BJJ that much. They're my main competition for new students.

I'm making a pretty strong one right now.

Also, I'm pretty sure some of the drawings were Japanese people. Just try to picture them as Portuguese or something.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Dude, all of those other styles that remained mostly to pure TMA's, continued to lose *MOST* of the time for the next 30 years straight in the UFC and other MMA promotions.

What made UFC 1-4 incredibly interesting was that it put standup strikers vs. grapplers. Nobody wanted to see Karate vs. Karate, or KF vs Karate, etc. these joints have been done ad nauseam. I remember renting VHS tapes and wanting my style of TKD to win vs. Gracie. I was even hoping that Karate would beat him, failed. Was so happy to see Kimo (TKD) hurt him. But then I went to train BJJ. Kimo trained BJJ.

The first 3 years or so were the best time for any TMA style to prove themselves & dominate the MA world, but they all failed miserably (esp. when the Wrestlers started appearing). This is why MMA is so real; b/c real Fighters adjusted....even the Wrestlers & BJJ'ers started training Boxing & Muay Thai, etc.

The tone of your first sentence sounds like you're contradicting me, but I don't see any contradiction.

 

[gerardfoy50]

I think the innovation and openness is what defines BJJ (and MMA gyms), more than anything else. Those of us who enjoy more traditional styles like the closed system and the challenge it creates, but that means we don't evolve quickly (or sometimes at all).

If that’s what the secret of bjj success is then fair enough, the Roman army became the best because it borrowed the best techniques and weapons from others, however they should not claim to be the inventors of such.

 

[Oily Dragon]

If that’s what the secret of bjj success is then fair enough, the Roman army became the best because it borrowed the best techniques and weapons from others, however they should not claim to be the inventors of such.

Google "suplay". You won't get an easy answer, but it's basically French for "supple" (shout out to my Rou Quan/Yao Kuen bros) and a core Greco-Roman concept.

Sprechen Die Wrasslin'? The Suplex

The history of the suplex

www.cagesideseats.com

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Google "suplay". You won't get an easy answer, but it's basically French for "supple" (shout out to my Rou Quan/Yao Kuen bros) and a core Greco-Roman concept.

Sprechen Die Wrasslin'? The Suplex

The history of the suplex

www.cagesideseats.com

I think the word you're looking for is <<souple>> (no "ay" sound on the end). Unless it's something in older French.

 

[Jimmythebull]

Just go look those techniques up on youtube since I doubt you train.

Man..calm down

 

[Jimmythebull]

And calm down,

You say this to others but the only person having a meltdown on this thread is you. 🤣

 

[Oily Dragon]

I think the word you're looking for is <<souple>> (no "ay" sound on the end). Unless it's something in older French.

There's a fine line.

Suplay is the old English approximation of the French verb assouplir.

We are talking about action, after all.

 

[Alan0354]

A lot of the reason the Gracies won early in that, was that they were training to beat other styles, while many other styles were training only against (and for) themselves. It wasn't superiority of the techniques, but of the model.

And is very effective!!!

Question is whether TMA is open enough to learn to improve now that they know and known for 30 years. I like to see them get into the Octagon and win some fights. I am Chinese, I would LOVE to see CMA beating people in the octagon. I will be cheering them on. I am just waiting.

 

[Alan0354]

Guys, calm down. This thread is about BJJ that is originated from Judo. All the comments I have here ONLY compare BJJ to Judo. Not against other style.

It is a FACT Royce Gracie KILLED all the striking MA at the very beginning of UFC, don't try to deny that. People can make all the excuses in the world, that's the FACT. But then he got KILLED within like 10 years or so!!!!

In the past 50 years since Bruce Lee, then Royce Gracie, MA is evolving constantly. People open their eyes instead of blindly follow one style. Those that can be flexible and learn improve. Those who cannot got left behind. Look at Royce Gracie got KILLED by Matt Huges in the 2000s, it's pitiful, lasted like 2 minutes and they had to stopped the fight. Then Huges got beat within months.

Just by watching the UFC fights, I can pretty much tell what era the fight was in. You can see the improvement. It's a different world now with videos, there nowhere to hide, no more BS. Just go win.

I tend to like BJJ personally NOT because it's still the best. I have been training in TKD and Kick Boxing for a few years, those are all striking, BJJ is mostly grappling and very effective in that. BJJ will benefit me the most to combine striking with grappling. MMA for me might not be as efficient as I already learn the striking part. If I were to go to learn, BJJ would be on the top of my list, then MMA. This is just for my situation.

This is where I come from.

 

[Oily Dragon]

Guys, calm down. This thread is about BJJ that is originated from Judo. All the comments I have here ONLY compare BJJ to Judo. Not against other style.

It is a FACT Royce Gracie KILLED all the striking MA at the very beginning of UFC, don't try to deny that. People can make all the excuses in the world, that's the FACT. But then he got KILLED within like 10 years or so!!!!

In the past 50 years since Bruce Lee, then Royce Gracie, MA is evolving constantly. People open their eyes instead of blindly follow one style. Those that can be flexible and learn improve. Those who cannot got left behind. Look at Royce Gracie got KILLED by Matt Huges in the 2000s, it's pitiful, lasted like 2 minutes and they had to stopped the fight. Then Huges got beat within months.

Just by watching the UFC fights, I can pretty much tell what era the fight was in. You can see the improvement. It's a different world now with videos, there nowhere to hide, no more BS. Just go win.

I tend to like BJJ personally NOT because it's still the best. I have been training in TKD and Kick Boxing for a few years, those are all striking, BJJ is mostly grappling and very effective in that. BJJ will benefit me the most to combine striking with grappling. MMA for me might not be as efficient as I already learn the striking part. If I were to go to learn, BJJ would be on the top of my list, then MMA. This is just for my situation.

This is where I come from.

Royce Gracie smoking all the striking MA? Na bro.

He lucked out for a little while (not much competition), and then got his face smashed with Muay Thai. So he went and learned that.

There was some very impressive striking TMA in the first UFCs.

 

[Alan0354]

Royce Gracie smoking all the striking MA? Na bro.

He lucked out for a little while (not much competition), and then got his face smashed with Muay Thai. So he went and learned that.

There was some very impressive striking TMA in the first UFCs.

Gracie won in the first two UFC, injured in the 3rd and then he disappeared. You call luck or whatever, he did win. That's the reason BJJ became so popular whether people like it or not. You see BJJ school all over the country, it's big business. I even have one within one miles.

Remember, I said Gracie was KILLED by Matt Huges not long after that, that was pitiful too, lasted less than 2 minutes. That's how it is, constantly improving. AND I paid like $30 for the pay per view!!!!

Muy Thai is very good. If I were to do it again at the time before MMA stuffs exist. I would not go to TKD and kick boxing, I would go to Muy Thai.

MMA basically is the combination of Muy Thai, boxing, TKD kicks, BJJ and some Wrestling. They also take in one or two things from other style that proofed to work. Like the front leg step kick to the knee from Wing Chung. They just incorporate anything that works and eliminate all the ones that doesn't.

Like I repeat, I favorite BJJ for myself ONLY because I had a few years in TKD and Kick Boxing, what I need more than anything else is grappling and BJJ will fit perfectly FOR ME. JUST ME. No one style is good enough anymore, people have to learn multiple styles or go to MMA.

 

[drop bear]

If that’s what the secret of bjj success is then fair enough, the Roman army became the best because it borrowed the best techniques and weapons from others, however they should not claim to be the inventors of such.

They did though.

 

[jayoliver00]

You say this to others but the only person having a meltdown on this thread is you. 🤣

You said calm down to Alan and now you're crying b/c I said it to you? See the hypocrisy + irony?

Calm down and make an argument.

 

[jayoliver00]

The tone of your first sentence sounds like you're contradicting me, but I don't see any contradiction.

I think you're right. I re-read what you said and I read it somewhat, wrong.

 

[jayoliver00]

I'm making a pretty strong one right now.

Also, I'm pretty sure some of the drawings were Japanese people. Just try to picture them as Portuguese or something.

You still ignorant of those BJJ techniques that I argued; so until you know what they are, then you can't really make an argument as those pics you posted aren't even close.

Do you even train BJJ? If yes, then are you a White belt?

 

[Oily Dragon]

You still ignorant of those BJJ techniques that I argued; so until you know what they are, then you can't really make an argument as those pics you posted aren't even close.

Do you even train BJJ? If yes, then are you a White belt?

What is it with you and "making an argument". You sound like Stephen Molyneux.

I've trained with plenty of BJJ players, and can talk about BJJ all weekend with you if you want. I've been a grappler for over 20 years. Don't start throwing down over belt colors dude, or you are not going to make many friends.

It's truly mazing you think any of those 4 BJJ guards/techs are advanced, or innovative.

And I think it's really weird you're harping on the Bubishi, a manual that most certainly heavily influenced Judo, the source of BJJ.

Do you really think people just invented certain ways to pull a jacket here or there, or certain ways to hook legs inside or out?

 

[Oily Dragon]

I can't believe I just got DYETB'd.