If.....
- Thread starter MJS
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J Ellis
Green Belt
The technical things that I would change, I DO change in my personal practice. I don't change the standard. I simply make the modifications and adjustments in my execution of it that I believe increase its efficacy. (The written material in the systems I study is only a starting point anyway. It tells you what to do but does not fully explain why or even begin to explore how.) I also supplement my Kenpo with crosstraining and prior training experiences. So these adjustments are not a matter of "if I could" but rather "what I do."
The things I would change all relate to organizational politics and rank.
Joel
The things I would change all relate to organizational politics and rank.
Joel
What's to change? Its different from school to school, and if you hang around long enough at least five things will change in the school you are in.
Sean
Sean
1) Put politics on the back seat. Worry about your own training, not what 10 others are doing. If you have no interest in training with any of those 10 groups, then no need to concern yourself with what they do.
2) Be more strict on rank promotions.
3) Don't be afraid to adapt and change with the times.
4) Encourage people to go out and look at other things on the 'menu.'
5) Learn the history of the art.
2) Be more strict on rank promotions.
3) Don't be afraid to adapt and change with the times.
4) Encourage people to go out and look at other things on the 'menu.'
5) Learn the history of the art.
True. Then again, some schools seem to want to advance and better themselves and the art, while others stay in the same pattern they've been in for years. How is anything to grow if that happens?
and if you hang around long enough at least five things will change in the school you are in.
Sean
True again. Of course, those changes may not always be for the better.
Its a business. I've seen yellow belts, that hardly show up, quit because their peers, that did show up, got promoted before them. That is to be expected, but people will stop training for a zillion reasons, and promotion is right at the top of the list.
Sean
1. Limit the limitless individual techniques. There's so many hand strikes for example, that stuff and movement gets redundant, and most will never get used. Stick to focussing on the tried and true, most used and useful.
2. Train with realistic combinations of the strikes like boxers do. (especially if being given a multitude of strikes) Make it all functional.
3. Make the dojo like fighting gyms again, not the "family friendly environment"
4. Stop the conveyor belt operations, where more focus is given to individual needs. The basics have to be proper and it takes time. No more "good enough" or "they'll get it later on" philosophy.
5. Accept groundfighting as necessary to learn, and stop referring to it or practitioners of other styles as "jokes." End the "patch mentality" once and for all.
2. Train with realistic combinations of the strikes like boxers do. (especially if being given a multitude of strikes) Make it all functional.
3. Make the dojo like fighting gyms again, not the "family friendly environment"
4. Stop the conveyor belt operations, where more focus is given to individual needs. The basics have to be proper and it takes time. No more "good enough" or "they'll get it later on" philosophy.
5. Accept groundfighting as necessary to learn, and stop referring to it or practitioners of other styles as "jokes." End the "patch mentality" once and for all.
1) I agree. Its safe to say we've done them all, but I agree...I have my favs that I prefer.
2) Good points. This actually gives me an idea for discussion.
3) Amen! Kajukenbo holds true to that.
4) Agreed 1,000%!!!! Probably one of my biggest pet peeves. Of course, I do find it funny when people come on here and actually try to defend this kind of garbage.
5) Preach it brother!! Then again, its supposedly 'all in there' and that may be the case, but I'd rather go to something with a proven history, rather than play games trying to 'find' things.
1. Add firearms safety and training
2. Eliminate homogenized programs for kids and adults. Adults don't shove each other in the lunchroom, kids don't need to crush another child's esophagus. Have a kids program address kids needs, then at a certain age, size, and/or maturity level, begin adult training.
3. Eliminate probationary/junior/honorary/kiddie/anything but adult-earned black belts. Show honor to those that deserve recognition through a letter of recommendation, a certificate that cannot be confused with rank or teaching ability, or by giving one's time and effort to assist the person of honor. Give kids something fun and colorful (they are kids, after all...), say a red-white-and-blue belt or a camo belt, or the novelty belt of their choice and let them know they will earn their black belt once they come of age.
4. More rigorous, and more defined requirements for each belt level, starting the student's first day of class...including fitness requirements for each rank and some sort of competitive measure, including alive training. Yeah, its going to hurt...but even those of us with professional jobs can tough out one heavy contact sparring event per belt level.
5. Ditch the white gi. Nao.
2. Eliminate homogenized programs for kids and adults. Adults don't shove each other in the lunchroom, kids don't need to crush another child's esophagus. Have a kids program address kids needs, then at a certain age, size, and/or maturity level, begin adult training.
3. Eliminate probationary/junior/honorary/kiddie/anything but adult-earned black belts. Show honor to those that deserve recognition through a letter of recommendation, a certificate that cannot be confused with rank or teaching ability, or by giving one's time and effort to assist the person of honor. Give kids something fun and colorful (they are kids, after all...), say a red-white-and-blue belt or a camo belt, or the novelty belt of their choice and let them know they will earn their black belt once they come of age.
4. More rigorous, and more defined requirements for each belt level, starting the student's first day of class...including fitness requirements for each rank and some sort of competitive measure, including alive training. Yeah, its going to hurt...but even those of us with professional jobs can tough out one heavy contact sparring event per belt level.
5. Ditch the white gi. Nao.
youngbraveheart
Green Belt
After ten years I still feel like a beginner and still have a long lifetime of learning to go. I don't believe anything needs to change in what we do. Why change anything William Chun Sr created, which William Chow blessed, which Bill Chun Jr teaches? I'm just happy to be a student under the Chow/Chun System.
Not meant to infuriate or challenge, just playing devil's advocate, but, All systems can be scrutinized and newer things added or learned. No one is above improvement. These systems were created decades ago, some centuries. Culture has changed through that time. These systems came during their changes to suit the needs then. Evolution can continue while still respecting and remembering the old ways. All of the founders continued to learn throughout their lifetimes.
Now, Bless you for admitting your status and your view. That is honorable. And if your are truly happy what you practice and learn- Bless that even more! Especially in this day and age!
Now, Bless you for admitting your status and your view. That is honorable. And if your are truly happy what you practice and learn- Bless that even more! Especially in this day and age!
Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
I've actually thought a bit about this thread and I've been tempted, yet reluctant to add my thoughts to it. I finally decided to do so, but they are not the thoughts I originally supposed I might add...
I certainly have my own complaints about the kenpo system that I study. It ain't perfect. I've got other influences that cause me to look at things differently, and I perceive things that to me, are problematic with it.
But I respect the system for what it is, and I respect my teachers and the lineage that they represent. They've given me a lot, opened my eyes, and shared with me the results of many decades of training. For that I am very very grateful and I have the utmost respect for them as people, friends, and teachers of kenpo.
for this reason, I am not able to publically state what I don't like about it and how I might change it, if I was King For A Day. I think it would just come across as disrespectful and maybe even sour grapes, and I'd hate for anyone to ever think I felt that way towards my teachers and what they have given me.
So for me, suffice it to say that I do not believe it is perfect, as I don't believe anything truly is. There are things I don't like about it. But there is a lot that I DO like about it, and I take it for what it is. That's really all I can say.
I certainly have my own complaints about the kenpo system that I study. It ain't perfect. I've got other influences that cause me to look at things differently, and I perceive things that to me, are problematic with it.
But I respect the system for what it is, and I respect my teachers and the lineage that they represent. They've given me a lot, opened my eyes, and shared with me the results of many decades of training. For that I am very very grateful and I have the utmost respect for them as people, friends, and teachers of kenpo.
for this reason, I am not able to publically state what I don't like about it and how I might change it, if I was King For A Day. I think it would just come across as disrespectful and maybe even sour grapes, and I'd hate for anyone to ever think I felt that way towards my teachers and what they have given me.
So for me, suffice it to say that I do not believe it is perfect, as I don't believe anything truly is. There are things I don't like about it. But there is a lot that I DO like about it, and I take it for what it is. That's really all I can say.
Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
Hi Carol,
I'll ask you this: why do you feel firearms training ought to specifically be part of kenpo?
seems to me that kenpo is a specialized method of unarmed combat. Personally, I think firearms training simply falls outside the scope of kenpo, and outside the scope of expertise that most kenpo instructors have. If you desire that kind of training, then I think the best solution would be to find a competent instructor and get it from that source. But I don't see a reason to believe firearms ought to become a mandatory or standard part of kenpo training. Lord knows, there's enough incompetent kenpo instructors out there already. I'd hate to think about those folks offering firearms training on top of it.
Personally, my instructor is ex-vietnam era military, and ex-law enforcement, and is very skilled with firearms. He maintains his enthusiasms for the topic, and would be willing to work with anyone in our group who has the desire. He is someone who I feel would definitely be a competent instructor in the topic. Personally, I'm not interested, and if someone sort of tried to say it was mandatory, I'd probably leave the club. I joined to train in an unarmed method. I'd join a gun club if that was what I was interested in.
Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
personally, I'd ditch all gis. I just don't care for them, regardless of color.
bushidomartialarts
Senior Master
1. Stop the ceaseless bickering between various branches and families of kenpo.
2. Cut the number of techniques in half, or even a third, while spending the same amount of time in training. Focus on understanding rather than rote memorization.
3. Adapt the weapon disarms to the fact that modern attackers are more sophisticated (for example, who thrusts with a knife anymore?).
4. Add enough ground game that a kenpo guy who gets knocked down by some MMA thug can fight back to his feet and continue the fight standing up.
5. Include more fitness in our workouts and among our seniors. It's a sad fact of life that my "baby weight" from this year's new addition has several of my friends commenting that I look like I'm ready for promotion.
2. Cut the number of techniques in half, or even a third, while spending the same amount of time in training. Focus on understanding rather than rote memorization.
3. Adapt the weapon disarms to the fact that modern attackers are more sophisticated (for example, who thrusts with a knife anymore?).
4. Add enough ground game that a kenpo guy who gets knocked down by some MMA thug can fight back to his feet and continue the fight standing up.
5. Include more fitness in our workouts and among our seniors. It's a sad fact of life that my "baby weight" from this year's new addition has several of my friends commenting that I look like I'm ready for promotion.
The Kenpo that I study is pretty open ended. If I haven't gotten to something yet, I will eventually if I keep training enough. And I know a lot of other people train this way too.
But Kenpo in general could use more spontaneous drills, more of an understanding of physiology, a lot more of an emphasis on basics, more and better knife information both offensively and defensive, and a real dedicated study of ground work. It could also use less bs, fewer internet tough guys, and a lot fewer “experts.” Add in a little less hero worship and a little more sparring and I think you'd really have yourself a martial art there.
-Rob
But Kenpo in general could use more spontaneous drills, more of an understanding of physiology, a lot more of an emphasis on basics, more and better knife information both offensively and defensive, and a real dedicated study of ground work. It could also use less bs, fewer internet tough guys, and a lot fewer “experts.” Add in a little less hero worship and a little more sparring and I think you'd really have yourself a martial art there.
-Rob
I'm not Carol, but I'll toss in my .02 on this. IMHO, I think that anytime a weapon is taught, it should be explained how that weapon functions. Make the student familiar with it, so in the event they are faced with one, they'll know what they're up against. The same can be said about a blade. The same can be said about a choke, a take down, anything. Its easy to say to someone, "This is how you defend against a gun to your chest."
So if that Kenpo teacher can't give that, because its outside of the Kenpo scope, then bring someone in who can teach it. I never said that we had to go out, get a pistol permit and join the local NRA, but become familiar with how it functions.
I'll use the choke as another example. If its a 2 handed choke or a RNC, IMO, I think its a good idea to talk about the effects of the choke, whether or not its targetting the airflow or blood flow, how to apply these types of chokes, etc. Whats the sense of learning to defend against something that you dont even know how to do yourself?
Just my .02
Thankfully my teachers are all open minded as well.
Spontaneous drills: I love these! My inst. and I do them all the time, and I do them in the classes that I teach. I agree...they should be done more often. I have a few different ways that I teach them. Every time I do them, I always get positive feedback.
Knife and ground work: This is why I cross train in Arnis and BJJ. IMHO, you gotta go to the source if you really want to understand these types of things.
Is all this stuff already there? It may be. But I look at it like this...if it was there, and taught the way it should be, then why isnt it as big of a household name, as the katas and techs.? I mean, in every Parker school, we pretty much see the same katas and techs taught. Where is that solid ground and knife work?
Bad guys don't care. The more one knows about a weapon, the more effective one's defense will be against it -- including decreasing the likelihood of injuring other people.
Logically that does not follow, and reasons such as this underscores the need for firearms training. Some decent training does a lot to show what firearms can, and cannot do.
OK.
