Home Training Tips Please

[Spence]

I have always had a problem with training at home & I was hoping I might be able to get some tips.
When I do Sanshin & especially Kihon Happo, I can't seem to get the right feeling.
Should I concentrate on Sanshin & leave Kihon for the dojo?
Basics are the foundation & I like to do a few at home but as I said it just doesn't feel right.
Cheers

 

[Bigshadow]

Should I concentrate on Sanshin & leave Kihon for the dojo?

I would say exactly! Do sanshin at home and kihon at the dojo with a partner. In my opinion the Sanshin is to train proper body movement and is to be done solo. The Kihon Happo is the basic techniques and IMO cannot be practiced alone, they should be done with a human partner. The sanshin will help your movement. Just be sure you are doing sanshin the way your instructor showed you.

That is my opinion on it.

BTW, welcome to the forum!

 

[Andrew Green]

And you can always work on your conditioning

Run, skip, ab work, weights, heavy bag, etc. All good things to do at home

 

[mrhnau]

And you can always work on your conditioning

Run, skip, ab work, weights, heavy bag, etc. All good things to do at home

I thought one of the requirements of the bujinkan was to be flabby?

jk of course! *runs from the rush of attacking ninjas, but not too fast, since they will be winded*

hehehe

seriously though, thats a good point... lifting, cardio, etc is great for home, and I'll agree with Bigshadow. Sanshin is great for home

 

[Bigshadow]

And you can always work on your conditioning

Run, skip, ab work, weights, heavy bag, etc. All good things to do at home

Good tips Andrew! Definitely something I don't do enough of at home.

 

[rutherford]

The Kihon Happo is the basic techniques and IMO cannot be practiced alone, they should be done with a human partner.

Oh? You already know I disagree, but I'd appreciate if you'd go into the foundation of this opinion in a bit more detail. It's something I don't think we've discussed.

 

[Bigshadow]

Oh? You already know I disagree, but I'd appreciate if you'd go into the foundation of this opinion in a bit more detail. It's something I don't think we've discussed.

I knew you did, I know you and I had discussed this before. I will try and expand on the reasons for my opinions on the matter. Let's start with Sanshin.

As I stated before, in my opinion Sanshin is an exercise in proper body movement. Yes, it CAN be practiced with a partner. However, I believe the emphasis of Sanshin is movement not technique, therefore a partner is not required.

On the other hand, I believe the Kihon Happo is the basic techniques. To learn the proper tactics in applying the kihon techniques requires an uke. You simply cannot shadow box the kihon and learn how to apply them, but this does not apply to the sanshin because the sanshin isn't techniques, it is movement.

That is my opinion on the matter. I hope that helps give more information about where I am coming from with my opinions.

 

[Shuto]

I have only been practicing this for about a year so weigh what I say accordingly.

I have recently started working on various techniques using a straight-back chair as my uke. The chair's legs help me visualize my opponent's feet which has helped me get a better feel for the footwork involved with certain techniques. The back of the chair helps me to better visualize distance. Practicing with a real person would be superior but those oportunities are somewhat limited in my case. Practicing with a chair allows me to make better use of the time I get to practice with a person.

 

[rutherford]

Oh, I think we're very close to agreement.

On the other hand, I believe the Kihon Happo is the basic techniques. To learn the proper tactics in applying the kihon techniques requires an uke. You simply cannot shadow box the kihon and learn how to apply them, but this does not apply to the sanshin because the sanshin isn't techniques, it is movement.

That is my opinion on the matter. I hope that helps give more information about where I am coming from with my opinions.

In fact, I'll take your statement a bit further and say that I don't believe you can learn to apply anything by practicing without a partner.

But I wonder if the technique is really the heart of Kihon Happo. It's all movement.

 

[Bigshadow]

But I wonder if the technique is really the heart of Kihon Happo. It's all movement.

Well one has to move to do the techniques right, if that is what you mean. However, one can have the best techniques in the world, but if they have poor tactics they will not do very well at all.

Another note... I have been told more than a few times "Do techniques half assed".

 

[rutherford]

Well one has to move to do the techniques right, if that is what you mean. However, one can have the best techniques in the world, but if they have poor tactics they will not do very well at all.

Another note... I have been told more than a few times "Do techniques half assed".

Or, to put it another way, "Do not be unskillfully attached to any particular technique."

Good tactics are continually in flux to deal with the continuous and dynamic nature of engagements. This is why good movement is more important than any one particular technique. Human movement and the principles of Kamae are universal, and you'll almost never apply the no Kata version of any of the Kihon Happo.

But, to develop the intuition for what movement to make, when the perfect opening for technique is staring you in the face, and when your training will lead you to spontaneous generate the appropriate technique whose exact nature is specific to that moment . . . well, you'll only get that from training with a partner.

If combat is a story, then doing Kihon Happo alone is like working on your penmanship.

 

[Bigshadow]

Or, to put it another way, "Do not be unskillfully attached to any particular technique."

Good tactics are continually in flux to deal with the continuous and dynamic nature of engagements. This is why good movement is more important than any one particular technique. Human movement and the principles of Kamae are universal, and you'll almost never apply the no Kata version of any of the Kihon Happo.

But, to develop the intuition for what movement to make, when the perfect opening for technique is staring you in the face, and when your training will lead you to spontaneous generate the appropriate technique whose exact nature is specific to that moment . . . well, you'll only get that from training with a partner.

If combat is a story, then doing Kihon Happo alone is like working on your penmanship.

Well said!

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Ahhh this is fascinating conversation. I personally love doing the Sanshin by myself and even better with a partner. (not always so sure how my partner feels though :erg Both provide a means of growth. Now the Kihon Happo is trickier to do by yourself and yet the growth when you do so can be even more so than with a partner. Now I would be the first to say that you cannot learn the Kihon Happo without a partner but when you have been practicing it for a long time then doing it in the air with visualization can bring lots of growth as you will be noticing your own unique movement's. Just my rambling on the matter.

 

[Bigshadow]

but when you have been practicing it for a long time then doing it in the air with visualization can bring lots of growth as you will be noticing your own unique movement's. Just my rambling on the matter.

Although, I don't do that, it certainly sounds plausible. I think that is much like the way videos are more meaningful after having enough experience than as a beginner who has never trained or has just began their training.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Although, I don't do that, it certainly sounds plausible. I think that is much like the way videos are more meaningful after having enough experience than as a beginner who has never trained or has just began their training.

Hey Dave we are all beginners in this art.

That is what makes it so much fun.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Spence as to your origional questions practice your Sanshin and also work all of your striking techniques seperately by themselves against a makiwara, tree, heavy bag, etc. Also I would work on my ukemi skills dilligently. (this also really helps to train the legs as well) Take the little things from class that you are comfortable with and practice them individually. Good luck.

PS
I also recommend like Andrew said above
working on your cardiovascular and strength
training. Push ups, crunches, wind sprints,
running, rope skipping all of these things
are great.

 

[Boondoggleyou]

I honestly hope I make no enemies from saying my opinion on this matter.

I'm sure many of you know Manaka Sensei (x student of Hatsumi Sensei) and I must say Manaka Sensei has very good movement, but for many years he had to train alone. This is because he went into the Military and could not practice or learn from/with Hatsumi Sensei. He has stated in the past he would work continuously on Kihon Happo, Sanshin, Ukemi, and other basic techniques by himself. This is where he developed his skill, by training alone with lots of sweat and blood, nothing else.

Now of course you can hit targets and other such things, but please dont tell yourself that you must have a living opponet with you in order to practice Kihon happo, Sanshin, even Ryu Kata, thats just being lazy. And what about the few people who cannot practice every week?

Now yes there are few things that are difficult to practice alone, such as grappling techniques. This requires a very good understanding of how a human body works in order to practice alone, but it can be done.

It seems many of you are very focused on practicing the feeling of the techniques, now I am not part of the Bujinkan (though I have absolute respect for it) so I dont know your thoughts on this matter, but maybe before worrying so much about the feeling of the Kata, you should perfect each Kata to the best of your ability (low, precise, correct timing, distancing) "picture perfect" in a sense. Once you have done this, then you can add the feeling of that perticular Kata, only now you do not need to worry about the movement and doing it wrong, you only need to focous on the feeling, and if you wish, variations.

In my opinion, Kamae, Ukemi, and Kihon/Sanshin are the absolute most important things you can practice.
And if your one of the few who feel they must test themselves against other arts such as Bjj, MMA, etc. Then those 3 things, will decide the victor, not some advanced variation to some Togakure Ryu technique, or having a super deadly intent.

I apologize for my rant, but it is something I feel strongly about.
Please dont flame me to harshly, I came here to make friends and meet other people with the same interest.

Please forgive me for all my typos as well.

 

[Bigshadow]

I honestly hope I make no enemies from saying my opinion on this matter.

No worries! It is always interesting to hear other points of view.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

I honestly hope I make no enemies from saying my opinion on this matter.

I'm sure many of you know Manaka Sensei (x student of Hatsumi Sensei) and I must say Manaka Sensei has very good movement, but for many years he had to train alone. This is because he went into the Military and could not practice or learn from/with Hatsumi Sensei. He has stated in the past he would work continuously on Kihon Happo, Sanshin, Ukemi, and other basic techniques by himself. This is where he developed his skill, by training alone with lots of sweat and blood, nothing else.

Now of course you can hit targets and other such things, but please dont tell yourself that you must have a living opponet with you in order to practice Kihon happo, Sanshin, even Ryu Kata, thats just being lazy. And what about the few people who cannot practice every week?

Now yes there are few things that are difficult to practice alone, such as grappling techniques. This requires a very good understanding of how a human body works in order to practice alone, but it can be done.

It seems many of you are very focused on practicing the feeling of the techniques, now I am not part of the Bujinkan (though I have absolute respect for it) so I dont know your thoughts on this matter, but maybe before worrying so much about the feeling of the Kata, you should perfect each Kata to the best of your ability (low, precise, correct timing, distancing) "picture perfect" in a sense. Once you have done this, then you can add the feeling of that perticular Kata, only now you do not need to worry about the movement and doing it wrong, you only need to focous on the feeling, and if you wish, variations.

In my opinion, Kamae, Ukemi, and Kihon/Sanshin are the absolute most important things you can practice.
And if your one of the few who feel they must test themselves against other arts such as Bjj, MMA, etc. Then those 3 things, will decide the victor, not some advanced variation to some Togakure Ryu technique, or having a super deadly intent.

I apologize for my rant, but it is something I feel strongly about.
Please dont flame me to harshly, I came here to make friends and meet other people with the same interest.

Please forgive me for all my typos as well.

We are always interested in hearing from other people regarding their training and how they perceive things.

 

[Bigshadow]

but maybe before worrying so much about the feeling of the Kata, you should perfect each Kata to the best of your ability (low, precise, correct timing, distancing) "picture perfect" in a sense. Once you have done this, then you can add the feeling of that perticular Kata, only now you do not need to worry about the movement and doing it wrong, you only need to focous on the feeling, and if you wish, variations.

Here is another point of view... It doesn't matter how nice and powerful a weapon I have, if my tactics are terrible, the person with the trivial weapon and good tactics are going to get me. For instance, who has the advantage, the combatant in the middle of the wide open street with the automatic rifle, or the pistol weilding combatant behind the nearby wall, taking aim?

My point is one can have picture perfect technique and still be "wrong", because it didn't hold water when it came to tactics. Likewise, someone can have crappy technique and good tactics and be "right". Furthermore, I believe this tactical aspect of training to be important and inseparable from the technique training. For this is why I highly recommend a partner for Kihon.

In my opinion, Kamae, Ukemi, and Kihon/Sanshin are the absolute most important things you can practice.

Most definitely!