Federal Agents Investigate Mosque Arson

[elder999]

If that's the case, then I could point to Obama's attending of a church for 20 years who's core philosophy was driven by a pastor who espoused racist views, and say that he is racist..

I'd be interested in seeing an overtly racist quote of Jeremiah Wright. Granted, he said some controversial and-for some-disturbing things-as well as some things that prove him to be nuttier than Beck, even.....but, well-show us a "racist view" he espoused.

 

[5-0 Kenpo]

I'd be interested in seeing an overtly racist quote of Jeremiah Wright. Granted, he said some controversial and-for some-disturbing things-as well as some things that prove him to be nuttier than Beck, even.....but, well-show us a "racist view" he espoused.

I would, but that would take context....

 

[elder999]

I would, but that would take context....

Go for it. Really....the worst things he said weren't racist-they were lunacy, like "AIDS was created to kill black people" (a more widely held belief than you'd guess) and inflammatory, like "God Damn America!," but not necessarily racist.

In fact, I defy you to post a racist quote of Jeremiah Wright's in any context, save that of calling white people.....white.

 

[Blade96]

I believe my previous statement covers it. "However, I do believe that they are equally deserving of legal protection, to the extent that they do not infringe anyone else's rights."

I support the model that intrudes least into the rights of the family and into freedom of religion. However, when one's life is in danger, that is a clear violation of that person's civil rights. I feel the same way about parents who refuse to allow their child to receive medical care when it becomes a life-threatening emergency and so on.

I do not hate government. I believe that the government governs best which governs least, to a large extent. Government is necessary for society to exist, and I enjoy the benefits of society. Freedom, though unnecessary for life or society, is a condition which I prefer. Individual liberties are the foundation of freedom. I prefer as little intrusion onto individual liberties as possible.

Okey dokey :angel:

I disagree but then I am not a conservative. But - whatever floats your boat =]

 

[Bill Mattocks]

Shots fired in vicinity of Sufi Mosque, teens arrested...

http://www.13wham.com/news/local/st...rime-1-for-Felony/sYCVTQdg0k2S5qhOQhLfeA.cspx

According to Jacob Zimmerman, member of the World Sufi Foundation, Monday night during evening prayers, cars drove by the mosque with people yelling obscenities and squealing tires—and gunshots were fired.

...

One of those person was arrested on felony charges of illegal possession of a weapon.

This is apparently breaking news, I'm sure we'll hear more as events unfold.

 

[WC_lun]

Go for it. Really....the worst things he said weren't racist-they were lunacy, like "AIDS was created to kill black people" (a more widely held belief than you'd guess) and inflammatory, like "God Damn America!," but not necessarily racist.

In fact, I defy you to post a racist quote of Jeremiah Wright's in any context, save that of calling white people.....white.

The stuff I've read of him and seen on TV indicate a person who has seen a lot of racism and prejudice. It has influenced his outlook to an unhealthy degree where he believes many things to be a racist plot against people of color that just aren't...such as the Aids belief. I can understand that reaction and it makes me feel sorry for the guy. I've never seen or heard comments by him that in themselves are racist. The racist thing was attributed to him pretty quickly by a certain news organization.

 

[Marginal]

Once again you totally miss the point.

No one said that those racist Democrats who entered the party stopped being racist.

You claim that they had no influence on GOP strategy at all. This isn't reflected by historical fact.

Don keeps wheeling out an irrelevant fact. (I think it's supposed to prove that the Democratic party is racist to this day somehow. I'm not sure.) When someone points out that the same elements crossed over into his party of choice, those elements suddenly cease to exist and it's somehow hugely unfair and "dirty pool" to mention racist tendencies of the GOP then exhibited after that party shift.

If that's the case, then I could point to Obama's attending of a church for 20 years who's core philosophy was driven by a pastor who espoused racist views, and say that he is racist.

I'm pretty sure people have done this already.

Or could it be that he attended it because it was the politically advantageous thing to do?

Just as long as he never attended church for the sake of attending church, or any of the other people at that church.

As far as the Southern Stategy goes, everything ends up being "code word" for something. Yeah, ok. And we call Glenn Beck a nutter.

Pretending it didn't happen? Classy.

 

[Bruno@MT]

Just as long as he never attended church for the sake of attending church, or any of the other people at that church.

Everyone knows that if you want to make it big in US politics, you have to be very religious, or at least pretend you are. Americans love that sort of thing and you can't possibly be a good enough person and win the elections if you don't play along.

 

[5-0 Kenpo]

Go for it. Really....the worst things he said weren't racist-they were lunacy, like "AIDS was created to kill black people" (a more widely held belief than you'd guess) and inflammatory, like "God Damn America!," but not necessarily racist.

In fact, I defy you to post a racist quote of Jeremiah Wright's in any context, save that of calling white people.....white.

On June 9, 2009, in an interview with the Daily Press of Newport News, Wright indicated that he hadn't had contact with Obama up to that point because "Them Jews aren't going to let him talk to me. I told my baby daughter, that he'll talk to me in five years when he's a lame duck, or in eight years when he's out of office." Wright also suggested that Obama did not send a delegation to the Durban Review Conference in Geneva on racism because of Zionist pressure saying: "[T]he Jewish vote, the A-I-P-A-C vote, that’s controlling him, that would not let him send representation to the Darfur Review Conference, that’s talking this craziness on this trip, cause they’re Zionists, they would not let him talk to someone who calls a spade what it is."

To make it plain, several Jewish organizations spoke out against him, saying what he said was anti-semitic. Not only that, but he later apologized, and attempted clarification.

Now you may try to explain this away, but alotof people believed that, in the simple meaning of his words, without any further context, they were racist.

 

[elder999]

To make it plain, several Jewish organizations spoke out against him, saying what he said was anti-semitic. Not only that, but he later apologized, and attempted clarification.

Now you may try to explain this away, but alotof people believed that, in the simple meaning of his words, without any further context, they were racist.

Actually, I'd forgotten that, and it was pretty plainly anti-Semitic.

 

[Carol]

“In the 21st century, white America got a wake-up call after 9/11/01. White America and the western world came to realize that people of color had not gone away, faded into the woodwork or just ‘disappeared’ as the Great White West kept on its merry way of ignoring black concerns.”

“Racism is how this country was founded and how this country is still run!…We [in the U.S.] believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God.”

"We started the AIDS virus . . . We are only able to maintain our level of living by making sure that Third World people live in grinding poverty"

"We believe God sanctioned the rape and robbery of an entire continent, we believe God ordained African slavery, we believe God makes Europeans superior to Africans and superior to everyone else"

 

[elder999]

“In the 21st century, white America got a wake-up call after 9/11/01. White America and the western world came to realize that people of color had not gone away, faded into the woodwork or just ‘disappeared’ as the Great White West kept on its merry way of ignoring black concerns.”

“Racism is how this country was founded and how this country is still run!…We [in the U.S.] believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God.”

"We started the AIDS virus . . . We are only able to maintain our level of living by making sure that Third World people live in grinding poverty"

"We believe God sanctioned the rape and robbery of an entire continent, we believe God ordained African slavery, we believe God makes Europeans superior to Africans and superior to everyone else"

Those are the things I was thinking of as not racist.

 

[Blade96]

“In the 21st century, white America got a wake-up call after 9/11/01. White America and the western world came to realize that people of color had not gone away, faded into the woodwork or just ‘disappeared’ as the Great White West kept on its merry way of ignoring black concerns.”

“Racism is how this country was founded and how this country is still run!…We [in the U.S.] believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God.”

"We started the AIDS virus . . . We are only able to maintain our level of living by making sure that Third World people live in grinding poverty"

"We believe God sanctioned the rape and robbery of an entire continent, we believe God ordained African slavery, we believe God makes Europeans superior to Africans and superior to everyone else"

Geesh. Who said that?

 

[5-0 Kenpo]

You claim that they had no influence on GOP strategy at all. This isn't reflected by historical fact.

Once again. Wow!

Not only can you not see the forest for the trees, but you must put words into people's mouths in order to support a weak argument.

Point me to where I said that those Democratic racists who moved to the Republican Party had no influence.

What I said was that I find it highly improbable that even several racist Democratic politicians who moved to the Republican Party could cause tens of millions of non-racist Republicans to all of a sudden hate minorities.

And I find it highly improbable that tens of millions of racist Democrats would all of a sudden become happy-feely integrationists.

And if you posit that all of those people merely switched parties, show me the proof of that.


And, as I intimated with the reply on the Southern Stategy, show me the proof. And show me in other then some convoluted "code word" way.

But let's not forget, Robert Byrd was not only a racist, but a member of the Ku Klux Klan. Not only was he a member of the Ku Klux Klan, but he was a leader in the group, founding a new chapter of the organization.

But we can forgive him, but Strom Thurmond can never be.
Just as long as he never attended church for the sake of attending church, or any of the other people at that church.

[QUOTE
]Just as long as he never attended church for the sake of attending church, or any of the other people at that church.
[/QUOTE]

He may have, but I point it out as a viable alternative. Politicians do many strange things.

But it's interesting that you would excuse Obama as a politician, especially one now holding what is considered the highest office in the country, for attending a church to worship God for 20 years where his self-admitted mentor would say such things as "God damn America", hold anti-semitic, if not anti-white, views, and be what the majority of Americans would call a conspiracy nut (AIDS was created to kill Black people).

If he attended out of a sence of legitimate worship, then we have a lot more to worry about then you think.

Pretending it didn't happen? Classy.

Once again, you insist on putting words into someone else's mouth. Who's pretending that it didn't happen. There are a lot of political strategies in existence in the United States. The Democrats trot them out (based on fear and anger), and so do the Republicans (based on fear and anger).

Just to make it clear: I have no doubt that the Southern Strategy exist(s/ed). But it was just that, a strategy. In no way does it necessarily mean that everyone in the Republican Party all of a sudden became a racist.

But these types of different political stategies exist. Why? Because in modern day America, no one relies on facts or principles. The only way to get the American public to vote is in such a manner as elicits an emotional response.

Just as you do in insisting that one must be a racist (or any other x-ist) in order to be a Republican.

I'll tell you, as a Black man, that I find the Democratic insistence that I need a hand-out, extra protection under the law, and Affirmative Action in order to succeed in life, much more denigrating and insulting then anything I have seen the Republicans say or do.

 

[Marginal]

Point me to where I said that those Democratic racists who moved to the Republican Party had no influence.

Yeah, 'cause if you can't see it the first time, you'll see it the second time around no problem.

What I said was that I find it highly improbable that even several racist Democratic politicians who moved to the Republican Party could cause tens of millions of non-racist Republicans to all of a sudden hate minorities.

Putting aside the whole part where it's iffy to assume that every Republican was not racist just 'cause of Lincoln... Nonetheless, you do witness a very blatant party shift. The party's policies change, and in a very short period of time, what the party represents changes as well.

And I find it highly improbable that tens of millions of racist Democrats would all of a sudden become happy-feely integrationists.

It's kinda funny that you're unwilling to believe that the GOP started appealing to racists, (who would in turn migrate their support to a platform most compatible with their views) but you're willing to believe that the Democratic party was comprised entirely of racists.

Not only can you not see the forest for the trees, but you must put words into people's mouths in order to support a weak argument.

 

[5-0 Kenpo]

Yeah, 'cause if you can't see it the first time, you'll see it the second time around no problem.

Didn't see it the first time because I never said it.

Nice try.

Putting aside the whole part where it's iffy to assume that every Republican was not racist just 'cause of Lincoln...

Never said that there were no racist Republicans. However, a large part of the party platform for decades was anti-slavery, and giving Blacks more of an opportunity within the larger society.

Nonetheless, you do witness a very blatant party shift. The party's policies change, and in a very short period of time, what the party represents changes as well.

Have you ever read any of the Republican Party planks from before the 1950's? I have. They are actually quite similar to what they were AFTER the civil rights movement.

I'll give you an example. Somehow, the concept that the Republican's came up with "state's rights" as a code word for racism developed after the civil rights movement.

Well, here is a portion of the Republican Party plank from 1860:

That the maintenance inviolate of the rights of the states, and especially the right of each state, to order and control its own domestic institutions according to its own judgment exclusively, is essential to that balance of power on which the perfection and endurance of our political fabric depends, and we denounce the lawless invasion by armed force of the soil of any state or territory, no matter under what pretext, as among the gravest of crimes.

So, despite what a lot of people think, the Republicans have been talking about state's rights, well, since forever.

It's kinda funny that you're unwilling to believe that the GOP started appealing to racists, (who would in turn migrate their support to a platform most compatible with their views) but you're willing to believe that the Democratic party was comprised entirely of racists.

Once again, I never said that the Republican Party didn't appeal to racist. In fact, I said the opposite. I'm sure that they appealed to everyone who they thought would vote for them, in a manner that would most appeal to those voting blocks.

Doesn't make them racist. It makes them, well, politicians.

Not only can you not see the forest for the trees, but you must put words into people's mouths in order to support a weak argument.

I put no words into anyone's mouth. I just use people's own words against them. Deal with it.