Fasting and the Martial Arts Mindset

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DanT

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Being a practitioner of Shaolin, we preach moderation and balance in all things. It is a fundamental principle in Shaolin to care for one's body and be in peak condition. However, one cannot be in peak condition and be unbalanced, nor can they be in peak condition by following extremes. This is why we train 5 h a day, 5 days a week, not 8 hours a day everyday. This is why we eat healthy 95% of the time, focusing on vegetables as our main source of nutrients, but leave space for that slice of cake once a week. You're dealing in extremes and it will be hard to maintain. You did an amazing job losing excess weight. You should strive for a body fat % of around 8-12%, which is a very healthy, lean range to be in. Have your body fat calculated by your doctor, ask if it is safe to cut further, and tell them that you would like to be in that range. Don't deal in extremes. Your goal should be to be healthy.
 

pdg

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I keep fish, both in a pond and indoors in a tank.

We also have chickens and rabbits.


Doesn't stop me eating their distant relatives...
 

Tez3

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Why? I dive with all those things. Doesn't affect my appetite. Love me some ultra-fresh seafood. With a side of bacon. :)

Well they were looking as if they considered us as food! They were bigger than most of the girls so it wouldn't have been impossible.
 

pdg

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Well they were looking as if they considered us as food! They were bigger than most of the girls so it wouldn't have been impossible.

If I keeled over within reach, I'm quite sure all our pets would happily eat me.
 

Tez3

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The tunnel part where sharks and sting rays swam overhead as well as in the big tanks, the girls sleeping bags ready for bed ( not sleep that didn't happen for a while lol)

30714956_10156059752101539_3172676690694373376_n.jpg
 

Dirty Dog

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Well they were looking as if they considered us as food! They were bigger than most of the girls so it wouldn't have been impossible.

Nah... trust me on this. There is nothing in the ocean that looks at us and thinks "Mmmmm, yummy!"
Certainly not things like stingrays, which don't even have teeth.
 

Tez3

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If I keeled over within reach, I'm quite sure all our pets would happily eat me.


Death by chicken!

Our girls are a mixture of military and country/farming backgrounds, the farm ones will happily eat animals of course, it's quite disturbing sometimes how 5 year olds can tell you all about breeding programmes, bulls, rams, AI etc.
 

Tez3

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Nah... trust me on this. There is nothing in the ocean that looks at us and thinks "Mmmmm, yummy!"
Certainly not things like stingrays, which don't even have teeth.

When you are only five though you really aren't sure.:D

I eat kosher so no seafood and no fish that doesn't have scales for me. Fish and chips good though! the green is mushy peas (no don't like them) the bowl has tartare sauce.

 

Dirty Dog

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When you are only five though you really aren't sure.:D

I eat kosher so no seafood and no fish that doesn't have scales for me. Fish and chips good though! the green is mushy peas (no don't like them) the bowl has tartare sauce.

Mushy peas are baby food. I do like peas though, especially with ham (which is like bacon...). But fish IS seafood...
 

AngryHobbit

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It's easy to criticize. What have you done to eliminate starvation? How much of your money have you donated? Were you appalled at yourself for getting fat while people were literally starving to death? I would hate to think that you are a hypocrite. Yea Buddy. Keep up the good work.
I was just going to say - starving yourself helps absolutely no one. In fact, starving for show or for a fancy diet or just to see if you can do it is kind of insulting to people who are starving because they have no choice. Eat normally, make a few Kiva loans, or start a campaign with your friends to help out the Red Cross, WHO, and Doctors Without Borders to get food to people who need it. The whole "ooh, look at me - I am not eating out of solidarity with people of Sudan" is just bogus.
 

AngryHobbit

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i was just thinking about this today......i was thinking about the famine in southern sudan.....i was thinking that is a good reason to go on a hunger strike........i think i will write a letter to president trump and tell him that i think it is appalling that he is sitting there eating steak and caviar and getting fat with 100 billion dollars in his personal bank account while people are literally starving to death....

and at least 100,000, according to the UN, were in imminent danger of death by starvation.

2017 South Sudan famine - Wikipedia

now if that's not a good reason to go on a hunger strike i don't know what is.....maybe i'm on my own personal hunger strike against president trump......

When my family and I were food hunting in Ukraine or when I was starving as an exchange student living in a gritty neighborhood in the US, someone else going on a hunger strike just because I didn't have money to buy food would have helped me... not at all. It's one thing if you are a political prisoner going on a hunger strike to defy your jailers. Or going hungry because you are in the middle of Siege of Leningrad and you just gave your bread ration the size of a match box to a hungry child.

Starving to show off how noble you are is BS. There. I said it. Get it out of your head. Eat something. If you really want to help, go join Peace Corps or Doctors Without Borders. Organize a fund raising campaign to send food to Sudan. Your starving helps nobody and comes across ridiculous and pompous.

alleged? i lost 130 lbs.

And do you know what the long-term effect of such a radical weight loss is? You underwent detailed physical and psychological tests by qualified medical professionals to establish that the weight loss and the on-going up and down weight shift had no long-term effects on you? Losing weight by itself is just that - losing weight. It has to be considered within the scope of your unique physical, physiological, and psychological makeup. As people here said several times - we are all different. Is it possible losing 130 lb is a positive thing, good for you all-around? Sure. But it is also possible it is not. You can't say with certainty until you have talked to your doctor and had your tests done.

Oh, and while we are at it? Eliminating fat entirely from your body and from your diet is not a good thing either. That much has been established. Look it up. When it comes to what we eat, certain essential minerals and vitamins contained in vegetables are ONLY soluble in fat. So, you are better off having a salad with a low-fat dressing or a drizzle of olive oil than with a fat free dressing, because in the latter case, you are deriving no benefit from the vitamins in the salad.

Study after study demonstrates dietary extremes might yield short-term results, but eliminating entire groups of foods or ingredients is, ultimately, not a great idea, unless there is an allergy involved.
 

Tez3

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I think Dr Monty Pyton did a documentary on them...


sounds likely!

One thing that was stressed at The Deep is the variety of fish we should be eating and the fish we shouldn't because they are being fished to extinction these include eels, marlin ( Blue and Atlantic), prawns ( that was a surprise to me), rays, seabass ( one of my favourites but will have to think twice now) skate, tuna ( another one I like), Atlantic wild salmon, skate, sturgeon ( caviar). They give a huge list of sustainable but I think in the UK as least we tend not to go for what is considered 'exotic' fish but we have to consider eating different ones or else we'll run out of the old favourites.
 

jobo

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Another 600 calorie day. Now starting 36 hour fast.

I think diet and Martial Arts go hand in hand. I think no serious student of the Martial Arts would not include diet as part of their training program.

pdg says "I do think you have a body self image problem - but hey, so do I."

Ok well I can take that. No problem with that pdg. Whoever you are. Good job with your program.

Regarding "fasting for more than a day gives me a headache ".

Running for more that 100 miles per week probably makes every inch of your body hurt like hell, but these guys keep running.

Regarding "I like the food I like - I like burgers, I like pizza."

Ok now we're talking!

Regarding "I had a ~4,000cal day and a ~6,000cal day".

I don't count calories on my eat days, A large, 14-inch hand-tossed pepperoni pizza from Domino's has 2,370 calories. Village Inn - Ultimate Skillet W/turkey Sausage, Bacon, 3 Small Pancakes and maple syrup 2,000 calories. One bag of Nestle Toll House butterscotch morsels 1,700 calories. 1/2 gallon milk 900 calories. Can of Coca-Cola 150 calories. I'd say 6,000 calories is a pretty good day. I probably get close and maybe even go over that on my eat days. But I don't count calories on my eat days and have no desire to count calories on my eat days.

On my eat days I just eat. I don't count. And I don't weigh-in. I only weigh-in on damage check day after I am done eating and ready to get back on the program.

I think focussing purely on weight and calories is the best answer for me. I have no time or desire to look at any other numbers. I'll let my Doctor look at all of my other numbers and I won't bother looking at them unless my Doctor tells me they are off. Last visit they said my cholesterol was high. But I weighed 286 lbs at the time. I will be interested to see what they say on my next visit 5/2.

My bet is Doc will tell me that all of my numbers are excellent and great job on losing all of that weight.

jobo says "I also suspect that you don't look aesthetical pleasing, very tall very thin middle aged people generally dont."

Well I'm sure I'm not as good looking as you are jobo. From your profile pic it is obvious that you are movie star material.

jobo or whoever he/she is says "what is your motivation for your diet régime?"

I have many motivations. Marshall Ulrich ran ultra marathons because his wife died of cancer. I've got my reasons too.

In Running on Empty he shares the gritty backstory of his run and the excruciating punishments he endured on the road. Ulrich also reaches back nearly thirty years to when the death of his first wife drove him to run from his pain.

https://www.amazon.com/Running-Empty-Ultramarathoner’s-Record-Setting-Across/dp/1583334904


Gerry, thanks for the reasoned commentary and feedback.

Regarding "You are using extreme athletes as an excuse for bingeing.."

Maybe so.

Martial D says, "this guy hasn't the first clue about martial arts".

I am here to learn. Tell me what martial arts is about.

I think martial arts is about learning. About keeping in good physical condition. Which for many means working on their diet. I think it's about a lot of things. It probably is even a religion to some. But just like in any religion, members claiming the same religion will argue among themselves.

CB, thanks for the feedback and good job with the videos, keep up the good work.

Regarding, "from 25 years old to last year(40 years), I was 6'2" 200 lbs with an athletic build"

Yea I could eat anything and everything and not gain a pound until I was about 45 years old. Roy at work is 35 years old 6' 2' tall and 130 lbs. He says he can't gain weight no matter what he does. I tell him man go out and get yourself a double cheeseburger and he says "I'm just not hungry." LOL. Everybody has their own circumstances. Andrew at work is 400 lbs and he sits at his desk eating buckets of fried chicken and Honey Buns like there's no tomorrow without a care in the world. They had to get a special chair that was big enough for him to sit in.

Regarding, "200 lbs to me is my ideal weight." Hope your knee gets better. Get-R-Done.

Regarding, "In the past I only had to alter my diet to averaging under 2000 calories per day to lose weight."

Wow 2000 calories per day. I could just imagine what kind of meal plans I could put together on a 2,000 calorie per day budget. On my 600 calorie per day for 5 days then 36 hour fast program I lose 2 to 3 lbs per week usually. Weigh-in on Monday morning after the fast, eat all day Monday, then back on the program starting when alarm goes off Tuesday morning.

I'm contemplating skipping this Monday Feast and pushing it till next Friday.

Next Friday starts a one week Feast Cycle as I will be flying to Raleigh, North Carolina to take a test. Friday I'll pile up about 20 boxes worth of Little Debbies on the goodies table in the office, grab a half gallon of milk and get things started. I sit right close by the goodies table and all during my fasting days I have to sit there and watch them all bring in the goodies while I say no thank you. On Friday I will enjoy seeing them all squirming around the big pile of Little Debbies thinking to themselves oh I might have just one but it's going to ruin my diet. And then watching them give in and eat 5 or 6. Oh yea buddy that is fun times! And then I'll get up and grab about 5 or 6 more for myself and toss Andrew a Honey Bun from across the room so he doesn't have to get up.

Everything is going great here guys! Keep up the good work and thanks for the great forum!


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it will be interesting to see what your doc does say, using the bmi charts, you three pounds of being considered malnourishment and of having an eating disorder, so if you go in " fast" mode it should set of warning bells,as your blood sugar will be near zero, if you go in binge mode you will have a massive insulin spike, that will make him consider you as potentially diabetic.

the bmi calculations are potential very misleading, the taller you are the more skewed they are,

when I went, he told me I was five pounds over weight, I looked at him agog, I'm 6,1 just short of 200 lbs, I have a 34 waist and visible abs, I took my shirt off and said " where exactly is this alleged fat ?.year right he said, it reads high with tall people, which he should have really considered BEFORE telling me I was Fat
 

pdg

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You have carnivorous rabbits?

It's not unknown for rabbits to eat their own offspring, and if I laid still long enough without feeding them I reckon they'd have a nibble...

They're the only thing that isn't biologically at least partly carnivorous, and that includes the hamster.
 

AngryHobbit

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It's not unknown for rabbits to eat their own offspring, and if I laid still long enough without feeding them I reckon they'd have a nibble...

They're the only thing that isn't biologically at least partly carnivorous, and that includes the hamster.
Killer-Bunny--monty-python-and-the-holy-grail-590914_1008_566.jpg
 
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