Does WT commonly use circular attacks?

[Kwan Sau]

I will say thought that instructors seem to break off from the Leung Ting lineage more often than from other lineages. I don't have data, except my own observation and 2nd hand experiences.

I've observed that as well. Don't know why...but just noticed that it mostly occurs with LT's higher/more advanced students / disciples.
A curiosity we may never unravel...

 

[Lestat83]

Yes, probably right... To unravel this is quite likely impossible

 

[geezer]

I will say thought that instructors seem to break off from the Leung Ting lineage more often than from other lineages. I don't have data, except my own observation and 2nd hand experiences.

From what I've seen, it's quite common for martial arts organizations to have splits and break into splinter groups. My kid's TKD school split from it's parent organization for similar reasons. And IMO it is a great school. Now if LT has had more than his share of "rebels", I'd attribute that to issues of personality, pricing, and his business practices in general. I will always respect the man's skill. But, I train with a group of the aforementioned "rebels". And, yes I was one of his first "disciples" in the US, although to be honest, my skills are quite mediocre within our group.

 

[ShortBridge]

I'm not suggesting why and I'm not second guessing anyone's ability or legitimacy, it just seems like roughly 1/2 of the LT people I meet are affiliated and 1/2 are not.

It doesn't seem to be as common in other lineages of Yip Man Wing Chun, though I suppose I do know of one or two here and there across all other lineages.

 

[Lestat83]

He says why he broke off here in fact...

http://www.autodefence.com/nick-mai.pdf

Skip to...

"MAI why the spelling Wing Tchun"

And is he talking about LT's organisation here?

"MAI what are your goals for the organisation?"

 

[Jake104]

I was simply quoting the OP. And I could be wrong, but the way he stated it leads me to believe he meant the western boxing version of these punches. I guess we will have to wait for him to clarify that! Wing Chun certainly has its own counterparts of boxing's "jab, cross, and hook", but as some have pointed out, wouldn't typically use those terms because they are not the same punches.

I would say this. Those are just arm positions. Look at it like a war head. The delivery system of that war head or body mechanics for this example, determines if it's WC or boxing or yoga.

If Wing Chun only consisted of a straight punch. I would of laughed at it and questioned if it worked and thought it was fantasy fu like most MMA 'ers. But I was taught straight circular and spiral. I know it works and I LIKE that people argue about whos got the right stuff or if it works. Keeps people occupied with nonsense and allows me to be that much better. Haha! Suckers!

 

[ShotoNoob]

...
If Wing Chun only consisted of a straight punch. I would of laughed at it and questioned if it worked and thought it was fantasy fu like most MMA 'ers. But I was taught straight circular and spiral. I know it works and I LIKE that people argue about whos got the right stuff or if it works. Keeps people occupied with nonsense and allows me to be that much better. Haha! Suckers!

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You said a TMA mouthful....

 

[geezer]

...It (changing associacions/sifus) doesn't seem to be as common in other lineages of Yip Man Wing Chun, though I suppose I do know of one or two here and there across all other lineages.

Then you haven't been paying attention. Many, if not most of the prominent WC figures have worked with different sifus, and many end up going out on their own. Since most "old school " Chinese sifus don't share students with other instructors, that means that these guys are also "break aways", except not every group is as public about it as LT. And interestingly many of LT's prominent "rebels" originally came to him only after leaving other WC sifus.

Personally I think it's perfectly normal for a person to pursue their own path eventually. In any other field of knowledge, you attend school, then college, then graduate school, maybe followed by an internship. But eventually, you are supposed to make your own mark in the world. You don't follow your college professor around as "a disciple" for your entire life! Same in sports. Athletes don't stay with the same coach or team for an entire career. Only in TMA.

Now back to the OP: What Jake said. Different situations and different opponents require different energies. Your punch can go straight or curve around an obstruction, or whip in from the side. Power can be released in a lot of ways. Dropping, rising, thrusting, twisting, spiraling.... Ironically, in recent years, I've found some of my best insights into WC have come from outside WC. Sometimes even basic things are clearer when viewed from a different perspective.

 

[Danny T]

Then you haven't been paying attention. Many, if not most of the prominent WC figures have worked with different sifus, and many end up going out on their own. Since most "old school " Chinese sifus don't share students with other instructors, that means that these guys are also "break aways", except not every group is as public about it as LT. And interestingly many of LT's prominent "rebels" originally came to him only after leaving other WC sifus.

When researching the history of the martial arts top instructors you will come to realize almost all of them have had multiple instructors, masters, sifus or whatever.

Ironically, in recent years, I've found some of my best insights into WC have come from outside WC. Sometimes even basic things are clearer when viewed from a different perspective.

Yes, yes, yes!

 

[ShortBridge]

Then you haven't been paying attention. Many, if not most of the prominent WC figures have worked with different sifus, and many end up going out on their own. Since most "old school " Chinese sifus don't share students with other instructors, that means that these guys are also "break aways", except not every group is as public about it as LT. And interestingly many of LT's prominent "rebels" originally came to him only after leaving other WC sifus.

Personally I think it's perfectly normal for a person to pursue their own path eventually. In any other field of knowledge, you attend school, then college, then graduate school, maybe followed by an internship. But eventually, you are supposed to make your own mark in the world. You don't follow your college professor around as "a disciple" for your entire life! Same in sports. Athletes don't stay with the same coach or team for an entire career. Only in TMA.

Now back to the OP: ...

You edited my post when you quoted me. I didn't say "changing" lineages. For the record, I started in one lineage and ended up in another after a move across the country. You're right, it does happen all the time ... and I do pay attention.

That's not what I was commenting on. If it's important to you, please go back and reread. Better yet, let's move on, I already regret getting involved in this conversation at all.

 

[Jake104]

Ironically, in recent years, I've found some of my best insights into WC have come from outside WC. Sometimes even basic things are clearer when viewed from a different perspective.

Same here! Geezer and I train in the same group outside of WC, "DTE".. Very diverse group. Grapplers, boxers , Thai boxers and even Karate. Interesting thing is when working a technique. The technique changes with each person/art. This has taught me that the idea is more important than the technique. I try to not think in terms of technique anymore, but rather energy principals and ideas. I don't think I would of learned this without training outside of Wing Chun. Same reason IMO IP Man students went out on there own to fight other arts back in the day.

 

[Danny T]

Same here! Geezer and I train in the same group outside of WC, "DTE".. Very diverse group. Grapplers, boxers , Thai boxers and even Karate. Interesting thing is when working a technique. The technique changes with each person/art. This has taught me that the idea is more important than the technique. I try to not think in terms of technique anymore, but rather energy principals and ideas. I don't think I would of learned this without training outside of Wing Chun. Same reason IMO IP Man students went out on there own to fight other arts back in the day.

Am a strong proponent of sparring vs other styles. Not someone within your style attempting to mimic another style.
e.g. a wing chunner pretending to be a nak muay rather than one that is a nak muay. If you have people who have training with in your circle that is better but then you need to go to those outside of your circle of training.