Come in, or go away.

[Bill Mattocks]

[Ring ring.]

Hello, I'm interested in taking classes, I was wondering if you could answer a few questions.

Sure, come on in and I'll be happy to talk with you. You know where we are and our hours?

Yes, but well, before I come in, I just want to talk with you on the phone.

Didn't you call last week?

Er, yes, but I had a few more questions.

And once before that, about a month ago?

Um, maybe? I've been calling lots of places...

OK, so come in, we'll talk.

But I...

Nope. You are not going to come in. You just call and talk about all the things you will never do. You have great plans, but you're all talk and no action.

That's kind of rude.

I'm not wrong, though, am I?

...

So put the phone down and come in. We will welcome you, show you around, let you watch our training, you can even try a bit if you wish. We don't do contracts, nobody here gets paid, there is no pressure to join. Love to have new students, but we don't need to beg for them. We'll answer all your questions face to face.

That seems a bit, I dunno, harsh?

Son, we teach martial arts. The first secret of martial arts is to show up. So show up.

....well...I just wanted to ask some questions...

Ask me in person. Goodbye.

 

[JP3]

That's exactly how I do it at my place, Bill. Dojo has a website, contact email and phone number of course, but everyone gets the same spiel.

Come on by and watch a class, and I or someone else will answer your questions while you do so. Monthly fee, paid one month in advance just to keep the lights on, no contracts, just people getting together to share and learn.

 

[JR 137]

I answered the phone several months ago while my CI was teaching. It was classic...

Me: Dojo name, can I help you?

Caller: I want to sign my kid up for karate.

Me: Ok???

Caller: I want to sign my kid up for karate. How do I do that? (in a tone of voice that tells me I'm the stupid one)

Me: You can stop in before childrens' classes begin, speak with the head instructor, and watch class to see if it's a good fit for you and your child. If it's what you're looking for, the head instructor will give you all the details. I'd let you speak to him now, but he's currently teaching.

Caller: (now getting aggravated, and kids are yelling in the background). How do get my kid to karate?

Me: I don't understand the question. (Thinking to myself 'you get in the car and drive him over)

Caller: I'll make it really simple... I don't want to come in and watch, I just want my 4 year old to do karate. How do I do that?

Me: I'm sorry, but the youngest students we take are 6 years old.

Caller: (matter of factly) Well that answers my question. Hangs up.

My CI had a puzzled look on his face when I hung up. I guess I had that look in my eye. After class, I told him conversation. He chuckled and said "we get a lot of those."

 

[Headhunter]

Can't agree with that. It's a very hard step starting a class and some can find it very challenging. So they call up and want to ask some questions to get a feel of what they're doing and reassure themselves or maybe simply they want to find out some details to decide whether it's even worth there time driving down.

 

[Steve]

You don't do the school any favors being a hard *** on the phone. Takes no more time to be nice to someone calling, regardless of how many times they have done so. If they keep,calling, I'd take it to mean they are mustering the courage to come in.

I think the message, "come on in," is terrific. But I'd stop short of "or go away."

 

[Headhunter]

You don't do the school any favors being a hard *** on the phone. Takes no more time to be nice to someone calling, regardless of how many times they have done so. If they keep,calling, I'd take it to mean they are mustering the courage to come in.

I think the message, "come on in," is terrific. But I'd stop short of "or go away."

Agreed for some it isn't as simple as just come in...people want to train for different reasons....what if a woman wants to train because she was raped and wants to defend herself but has serious trust issues or confidence issues basically telling her either turn up or get lost isn't going to help her is it.

 

[ShortBridge]

I posted something similar a few months back and got good feedback from you guys on it, but it was more or less the same frustration that I was expressing.

The key lesson for martial arts students and perspective ones is that you need to approach and deal with your future teacher on their terms. If they are highly commercial, their terms will be different than if they are not. If they have space available, they will be different that if they are full. But, most teachers will lay it out for you or guide you through it and as perspective student, if you might want to train there, you need to follow.

It doesn't mean you can't shop or can't chose to go someplace else if it doesn't sit right with you, but if you might want in, you don't get to approach it in your own special way.

I play a classical instrument and it's not that different approaching teachers in that field. Frankly it's one of the most useful things I've learned in 30x years as a martial arts student, I use it in every day life dealing with all types of people.

Nice post, Bill.

In response to "what if they were a rape surviver with trust issues?". I don't deal with everyone who calls me the same way, how they approach me influences how flexible or rigid am with them, which frankly is an intrigal part of my training. Bill's post was about a particular caller and I think he probably read him correctly, we've all had that call. I also suspect that with his experience, he would have read and responded differently to someone else.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Son, we teach martial arts. The first secret of martial arts is to show up. So show up.

English is not my native language. But when you call someone "Son" on the phone, is that considered to be rude?

Your post just remind me something like the following:

A: I just want to look around.
B: If you don't intend to buy, or you can't afford to buy, don't hang around and don't waste my time.

IMO, there is no "bad customers" but only "bad salesperson".

 

[Gerry Seymour]

English is not my native language. But when you call someone "Son" on the phone, is that considered to be rude?

Your post just remind me something like the following:

A: I just want to look around.
B: If you don't intend to buy, or you can't afford to buy, don't hang around and don't waste my time.

IMO, there is no "bad customers".

In some areas of the US (including my area) it can be both a standard greeting to someone much younger (in rural areas, especially), and a rude manner of address. It's all in the tone of the voice.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I agree with the basic tenor of this. In general, I'll answer a few questions on the phone, but I want them to stop by. If it's not convenient to stop by, they almost certainly (no absolutes here, but really high probability) won't continue classes, because it'll be too inconvenient.

 

[WaterGal]

In some areas of the US (including my area) it can be both a standard greeting to someone much younger (in rural areas, especially), and a rude manner of address. It's all in the tone of the voice.

Yeah, I'd consider it to be a little patronizing, but not quite rude. Unlike "boy", which unless the guy is in single digits, is definitely rude.

 

[WaterGal]

While it's important to be polite and helpful on the phone, in my experience, people who ask 1000 questions and want to talk for a long time before they've ever been to the school are usually time-wasters who like to imagine doing martial arts but will never commit to it.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

In some areas of the US (including my area) it can be both a standard greeting to someone much younger (in rural areas, especially), and a rude manner of address. It's all in the tone of the voice.

Thanks for your explanation. Many years ago when I was a waiter and served coffee to someone, he said, "I don't want no sugar." I put a lot of sugar into his coffee.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

I have very little time. My personal time is very, very precious and at this point I have more than enough students. So much that I can hardly keep up with all the private lessons. While I am happy to talk with people there is only so much to say before they need to make that leap and come and train. I get Bill's initial post and while I always try to be professional and answers questions and be encouraging there is only so long it will go on before I must move on.

 

[Tez3]

English is not my native language. But when you call someone "Son" on the phone, is that considered to be rude?

Not usually in the UK, we have lots of other words like crotchgoblin that we use, or cockwomble even wankspangle.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

[

English is not my native language. But when you call someone "Son" on the phone, is that considered to be rude?

It can be. But it depends on context. Consider that I'm 56 and many people calling are in their late teens to early 20s at the latest.

Your post just remind me something like the following:

A: I just want to look around.
B: If you don't intend to buy, or you can't afford to buy, don't hang around and don't waste my time.

IMO, there is no "bad customers" but only "bad salesperson".

A dojo is not Burger King. They don't get to have it their way.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Your post just remind me something like the following:

A: I just want to look around.
B: If you don't intend to buy, or you can't afford to buy, don't hang around and don't waste my time.

IMO, there is no "bad customers" but only "bad salesperson".

Except that they aren't hanging around. They're calling on the phone. If someone called a retail outlet a lot of times asking questions that a) were indicative of someone who is unlikely to buy, and b) took time from assisting customers in the store, then it's time to get off the phone with them. Same thing at a dojo.

 

[drop bear]

I will take the other side.

If customers were not idiots you would not need service people.

It is a basic part of your job. Whether you get paid for it or not.

I had to deal with it in martial arts. I had to deal with it in security. I have to deal with it working at the bottle shop. Instead of expecting the customers to change. Gain the skills to handle the customers.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I will take the other side.

If customers were not idiots you would not need service people.

It is a basic part of your job. Whether you get paid for it or not.

I had to deal with it in martial arts. I had to deal with it in security. I have to deal with it working at the bottle shop. Instead of expecting the customers to change. Gain the skills to handle the customers.

Someone who won't come to the school isn't a customer. They're barely a prospect.

 

[drop bear]

Someone who won't come to the school isn't a customer. They're barely a prospect.

They are still a person. You either have the time to help them out or you don't.