Bare feet Vs Shoes

[VintageModMan]

So something I have always had trouble with is shoes. Per my genetics I have flat feet. It has been a nightmare to find shoes that work I spent a lot of time in Chuck taylors, skateboarding shoes and the like. At one point I was told by a doctor we need to build arches and for about 3 years I wore shoes with good arch support but never had a change in an arch and did my feet hurt! My feet remained flat. While I was training in Shorin Ryu the policy was no shoes (which at home and around the house is normal for me inside, outside doesn't matter its what I prefer.)

Now I know most MA styles train like this in my limited knowledge. So this got me thinking about real life application can I throw the same kick with accuracy with a shoe on? I personally cannot replicate it due to the extra weight and the non flexibility of my foot. Yes its a similar kick but for me not as effective and the chance of loosing my shoe is very possible.

So where this is leading is are there any barefoot type shoes you guys know of that really do feel barefoot? I know over the past few years there has been a craze over it. I have just never really looked into it much. I know there are vivobarefoot and vibram shoes just wondering what your opinions are on these shoes for street ware and comfort and in the of chance you found the opportunity to use a solid kick in a self defense situation? Also opinions on recommended shoes or reasons to dislike the shoes.

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[Tony Dismukes]

The shoe/no-shoe approach is typically dependent on an art's country of origin. Japanese and Korean arts are commonly practiced barefoot. Chinese arts are commonly practiced with shoes on.

I wear sneakers in daily life and am just as comfortable kicking with them as with bare feet. Really the only way to get used to kicking with shoes is to just do it a bunch. 98% of your technique is the same kicking with or without shoes. You just need some practice to get used to the 2% difference.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

In the dojo where I train, we train barefooted. We train in an Okinawan style, Isshinryu. I understand that kicking with shoes on feels different. I sometimes practice kata in the back yard and sometimes with shoes on; I can feel the difference. The kick can be slower, and my knee can feel hyper-extended because the kick wants to 'keep going' when I want to rechamber it.

I would not argue with people who train with shoes on for self-defense because they know that if they have to defend themselves, it will be with shoes on. But that's just not how we do it in the dojo. I get it.

 

[VintageModMan]

In the dojo where I train, we train barefooted. We train in an Okinawan style, Isshinryu. I understand that kicking with shoes on feels different. I sometimes practice kata in the back yard and sometimes with shoes on; I can feel the difference. The kick can be slower, and my knee can feel hyper-extended because the kick wants to 'keep going' when I want to rechamber it.

I would not argue with people who train with shoes on for self-defense because they know that if they have to defend themselves, it will be with shoes on. But that's just not how we do it in the dojo. I get it.

Just to clarify I not debating right or wrong with or without a shoe. I was looking for an opinion on a more natural feeling shoe due to personal preferance because if I could avoid shoes all together I would. I just have never preferred them. However I wanted to see if there were specific shoes people would use over another. I know a lot of shoes today are made for style instead of practical use.

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[VintageModMan]

The shoe/no-shoe approach is typically dependent on an art's country of origin. Japanese and Korean arts are commonly practiced barefoot. Chinese arts are commonly practiced with shoes on.

I wear sneakers in daily life and am just as comfortable kicking with them as with bare feet. Really the only way to get used to kicking with shoes is to just do it a bunch. 98% of your technique is the same kicking with or without shoes. You just need some practice to get used to the 2% difference.

I don't disagree with you one bit. I think getting used to it would be a good factor. I wear airwalks a lot and they would fly right of if I threw almost any kick with force.

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[Bill Mattocks]

Just to clarify I not debating right or wrong with or without a shoe. I was looking for an opinion on a more natural feeling shoe due to personal preferance because if I could avoid shoes all together I would. I just have never preferred them. However I wanted to see if there were specific shoes people would use over another. I know a lot of shoes today are made for style instead of practical use.

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Right, I understood your statement. All good. I have no issues with people who do it either way, and no particular preference in shoes since I train barefoot. In the street, I generally wear New Balance trainers or a type of dress shoe that would probably fly off if I was to try kicking with it.

Of course, I am not sure to what extent I would attempt to kick in the street in a typical self-defense situation. Maybe a stomp, less likely a kick unless the situation really presented itself.

 

[Danny T]

Vibram Five Finger type shoes are like all other shoes. Depends...it comes down to the individual fit and comfort. The only way to know is to try them.
I have had several different types all feel different. The one thing I have been disappointed in is the length of time they last for me. 2-3 months and every pair I have used are done.

 

[VintageModMan]

Right, I understood your statement. All good. I have no issues with people who do it either way, and no particular preference in shoes since I train barefoot. In the street, I generally wear New Balance trainers or a type of dress shoe that would probably fly off if I was to try kicking with it.

Of course, I am not sure to what extent I would attempt to kick in the street in a typical self-defense situation. Maybe a stomp, less likely a kick unless the situation really presented itself.

I was just making sure I was being clear. For me again personally. I favor kicks over punches. I do both effectively just like the power I have behind them. I've always had the issue where I have tree trunks for legs and through the training I've had we worked on "deadening" my shins. I still feel plenty they just don't pain me much to kick through thing.

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[VintageModMan]

Vibram Five Finger type shoes are like all other shoes. Depends...it comes down to the individual fit and comfort. The only way to know is to try them.
I have had several different types all feel different. The one thing I have been disappointed in is the length of time they last for me. 2-3 months and every pair I have used are done.

That doesn't seem like a long time for the cost of the shoe $75-120 if I'm not mistaken?

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[jobo]

So something I have always had trouble with is shoes. Per my genetics I have flat feet. It has been a nightmare to find shoes that work I spent a lot of time in Chuck taylors, skateboarding shoes and the like. At one point I was told by a doctor we need to build arches and for about 3 years I wore shoes with good arch support but never had a change in an arch and did my feet hurt! My feet remained flat. While I was training in Shorin Ryu the policy was no shoes (which at home and around the house is normal for me inside, outside doesn't matter its what I prefer.)

Now I know most MA styles train like this in my limited knowledge. So this got me thinking about real life application can I throw the same kick with accuracy with a shoe on? I personally cannot replicate it due to the extra weight and the non flexibility of my foot. Yes its a similar kick but for me not as effective and the chance of loosing my shoe is very possible.

So where this is leading is are there any barefoot type shoes you guys know of that really do feel barefoot? I know over the past few years there has been a craze over it. I have just never really looked into it much. I know there are vivobarefoot and vibram shoes just wondering what your opinions are on these shoes for street ware and comfort and in the of chance you found the opportunity to use a solid kick in a self defense situation? Also opinions on recommended shoes or reasons to dislike the shoes.

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I have a pair of everlast seniors running shoes which are made out of nylon mesh with a bouncy sole. They are incredibly light ,pliable and comfy. They feel like you have no shoes on, intact they feel like a new pair of feet

 

[FriedRice]

Shoes ruin the mats, whether by a lot or a very little, still cause more damage than skin. Wrestling mats are very expensive, compared to ie. those puzzle mat cheapo joints.

Shoes are weapons, not a good idea in training. In the street, you could be slower, but the damage inflicted should be greater with shoes on....so, much more damage with, ie. boots.

Shoes are dirty. People say they never wear certain ones for training outside. I don't know that. They can track doo-doo onto the mat and now my face is on it, getting into my eyes, etc. Then there are the dirty people with athlete's foot, or stinky feet who should be wearing shoes. Those rubber shoes that look like feet are probably disgusting and makes your feet stink like crazy, true? I hardly see people wearing those anymore.

 

[VintageModMan]

Shoes ruin the mats, whether by a lot or a very little, still cause more damage than skin. Wrestling mats are very expensive, compared to ie. those puzzle mat cheapo joints.

Shoes are weapons, not a good idea in training. In the street, you could be slower, but the damage inflicted should be greater with shoes on....so, much more damage with, ie. boots.

Shoes are dirty. People say they never wear certain ones for training outside. I don't know that. They can track doo-doo onto the mat and now my face is on it, getting into my eyes, etc. Then there are the dirty people with athlete's foot, or stinky feet who should be wearing shoes. Those rubber shoes that look like feet are probably disgusting and makes your feet stink like crazy, true? I hardly see people wearing those anymore.

I definitely agree these are hard on the mats

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[Gerry Seymour]

So something I have always had trouble with is shoes. Per my genetics I have flat feet. It has been a nightmare to find shoes that work I spent a lot of time in Chuck taylors, skateboarding shoes and the like. At one point I was told by a doctor we need to build arches and for about 3 years I wore shoes with good arch support but never had a change in an arch and did my feet hurt! My feet remained flat. While I was training in Shorin Ryu the policy was no shoes (which at home and around the house is normal for me inside, outside doesn't matter its what I prefer.)

Now I know most MA styles train like this in my limited knowledge. So this got me thinking about real life application can I throw the same kick with accuracy with a shoe on? I personally cannot replicate it due to the extra weight and the non flexibility of my foot. Yes its a similar kick but for me not as effective and the chance of loosing my shoe is very possible.

So where this is leading is are there any barefoot type shoes you guys know of that really do feel barefoot? I know over the past few years there has been a craze over it. I have just never really looked into it much. I know there are vivobarefoot and vibram shoes just wondering what your opinions are on these shoes for street ware and comfort and in the of chance you found the opportunity to use a solid kick in a self defense situation? Also opinions on recommended shoes or reasons to dislike the shoes.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

I have a pair of New Balance trail running shoes that are very minimalist. They are as close as I've come to a "barefoot" shoe. That said, I've practiced my kicks with a variety of shoes. The heavier and stiffer the shoe, the more it changes the kick. But if I practice enough, I'm able to deliver (within reason) most of the same kicks with all my shoes. With heavier shoes, I'm less likely to kick high (above the waist, to me), or indeed at all, because it creates a lag. The stiffer the shoes, the more likely I am to change my foot position (heel kick instead of the ball of the foot, for instance).

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I don't disagree with you one bit. I think getting used to it would be a good factor. I wear airwalks a lot and they would fly right of if I threw almost any kick with force.

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A shoe's ability to stay on in a kick is part of my selection criteria, so that I can kick with them. Only rarely have I liked a shoe well enough to wear it otherwise.

 

[Danny T]

On the mats we are bare foot.
We have an outside covered training area with heavy bags. I wear cross trainers or sandals. Have no problem kicking.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

On the mats we are bare foot.
We have an outside covered training area with heavy bags. I wear cross trainers or sandals. Have no problem kicking.

I never even contemplated that. Now I want an outdoor covered training area. Of course, I'll need a school, first.

 

[drop bear]

I use wrestling shoes on the mats some times. Sometimes bare feet.

In a fight my apparel is the least of my worries. Especially what shoes I am wearing.

Aparently people do wear them casually.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I use wrestling shoes on the mats some times. Sometimes bare feet.

In a fight my apparel is the least of my worries. Especially what shoes I am wearing.

Aparently people do wear them casually.

I think it's a legitimate concern, though, DB. I wear suits a fair amount (sometimes including ties). That can change my range of movement and provide targets (especially the tie). Dress shoes often have iffy traction, making kicks and explosive movements more chancy. Shoes that might come off present a different issue. I wouldn't mind losing my shoes in a fight on the beach, but in that ubiquitous dark alley people always get attacked in in movies, I'd hate to lose a shoe. (That's why I don't live in movies. Dangerous places.)

 

[drop bear]

I think it's a legitimate concern, though, DB. I wear suits a fair amount (sometimes including ties). That can change my range of movement and provide targets (especially the tie). Dress shoes often have iffy traction, making kicks and explosive movements more chancy. Shoes that might come off present a different issue. I wouldn't mind losing my shoes in a fight on the beach, but in that ubiquitous dark alley people always get attacked in in movies, I'd hate to lose a shoe. (That's why I don't live in movies. Dangerous places.)

I have fought guys while wearing suits. short and raincoats. Slippery shoes sneakers and bare feet. In belt kit,with gloves on. Pretty much everything.

We had this elastic tie thing that was supposed to protect while in a fight. Can't remember it ever stopping a face punch.

I could have used knee pads to be honest. That was my big issue. Holding a guy down for 20 minutes untill the cops turned up. Hell on the knees.

The only issue with shoes coming of is if I got hold of one of theirs I would throw it on a roof.

 

[Danny T]

I never even contemplated that. Now I want an outdoor covered training area. Of course, I'll need a school, first.

Just to keep you wanting.