A Dangerous Seed Sprouting in British Politics

Sukerkin

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It is with persuasive use of icons and touchstones of our culture such as this that the BNP is gaining a dangerous currency in the political sphere:

http://tv.bnp.org.uk/2009/03/why-si...jected-by-todays-politically-correct-parties/

If you have a look through some of the available videos et al on the BNP site you will see that they hit all the right notes to harmonise with the fears and common opinions of ordinary people (I don't exclude myself from this). Clips like this one are a million miles away from the Great Game and bring politics into the tangible realm for most people:

http://tv.bnp.org.uk/2009/04/bnp-making-a-difference-in-stoke/ (by the way, I worked on the archaeological dig from this place and lived just down the road from the estate which was locally termed "Scabby Abbey")

http://tv.bnp.org.uk/2009/04/the-betrayal-of-our-soldiers/

Misuse and mistreatment of our troops, overly open borders, too many 'foreigners' already here, too much taxation, overtly corrupt politicians, the EU's drain on our coffers whilst giving nothing back, lack of good jobs (subtext: "for British people"), the corrosion of our culture and so on.

An impressive list and the scary thing is that I can agree with almost everything they say ... on the surface.

Altho' they disarmingly use ordinary people rather than skilled orators to put the message across, there is much mileage made in the 'political' trick of the presentation of half the truth or just using the parts of same that support their message.

So you find yourself in agreement with what they say, especially if you don't know enough about politics and history to realise what they are not saying. For you see, this party is the British embodiment of the movement that occurred in a certain other European country in the 1930's - that didn't turn out so well, as I recall.

That is why they are 'dangerous'. Not for what they claim to represent but for the beginning of a road they could lead us down. A frightening thing to feel in myself is that, even knowing where such a path could lead, I still find myself wondering if that would be such a bad thing? After all, I'm English, from a family incredibly well rooted in English soil and patriotic as they come - surely they'd never turn their sights on such as me ... would they?

As most of the people who post here are American, I wonder what your opinions are of what the BNP 'platform' purports to be?
 
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Sukerkin

Sukerkin

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I just found this clip whilst browsing about trying to learn some more:


Very hard to disagree with cogent passion like that. But you have to think what is tucked behind the truth being spoken. Not necessarily in the mind of the speaker there, who seems very genuine to me (and, again, whose 'heart' I actually agree with) but in the minds of those that are organising the political movement.
 
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chav buster

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i would say the rise of the bnp is largely a back lash due to the libral facist politics that runs through modern british politics. i dont really agree with the bnp but people are concerned with the way things are going on issues such as imigration, positive disgrimination ect and the bnp seems to be the only party willing do answer these issues but yes its a very worrying!
 

Tez3

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i would say the rise of the bnp is largely a back lash due to the libral facist politics that runs through modern british politics. i dont really agree with the bnp but people are concerned with the way things are going on issues such as imigration, positive disgrimination ect and the bnp seems to be the only party willing do answer these issues but yes its a very worrying!

Liberal fascist politics? what on earth are you talking about? Liberals in the UK are nothing like the liberals you have in the States and the fascists are the BNP.
The BNP are the British Nazi Party for crying out loud, they are not the only party to worry about immigration which is actually blown up out of proportion anyway. The BNP are Holocaust deniers and are known rascists.
 

Empty Hands

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I'll give them credit, the neo-fascist political groups have evolved a lot. They have developed new media skills, image control, and other hallmarks of modern politicking. I guess it was inevitable. Even David Duke tries to sound moderate these days.

In a way, the development of such strategies shows how out of touch the values of groups like the BNP are with wider society. When you have to hide the essential truth of what you are in order to gain popularity, then the people aren't really with your essential identity. See also the Republican two-step on gay issues. I take this as a heartening sign.

After all, I'm English, from a family incredibly well rooted in English soil and patriotic as they come - surely they'd never turn their sights on such as me ... would they?

I don't think you really believe that. Assuming the BNP or someone like them fully implemented their vision, any dissenters from the True Faith would be punished - no matter what their pedigree. Like if say a certain well-educated Economist disagreed with the farcical economic posturings of the powers-that-be.
 

Ken Morgan

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Parties like these are depended on the one issue voter.

In my experience in politics, its amazing how many people will agree with you on 190 out of 200 issues, but they put an enormous amount of value of the other 10. They look for reasons not to vote for you.

Honestly how many people, besides political geeks like me, actually read the policy books put out by the parties up here? 3%, maybe on a good day?

The BNP says some compelling things to the general people, the vast majority will not look any deeper, and the party will not say HOW it intends to implement its policies.

Unfortunately or fortunately, in a democracy the nuts cases are allowed to speak and organize.
 

Jenna

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I'll give them credit, the neo-fascist political groups have evolved a lot. They have developed new media skills, image control, and other hallmarks of modern politicking. I guess it was inevitable. Even David Duke tries to sound moderate these days.
Good post :) And you are exactly right. The BNP here also have a niche advantage - a kind of parasitic feeding off the idea that all the country's ills are simple solvable factors of race (non-white) and immigration. I hate seeing these school-grade notions being crusaded by some of the tabloids here (Mail especially, pffft). Unfortunately I do not think it is mere rhetoric and politicking because these ideas encourage racism and xenophobia themselves and which only polarises the communities and prejudices and paranoias further. For me, the BNP do not offer any solutions besides insular, backward-looking anachronisms. Mussolini is never lauded anywhere by the BNP that I can see, though their "fixes" for the UK would seem impossible without judicious use of his methodologies. I never understand how they miss that ;) Anyway, I do not mean to rant and but at times before, my father and his family were considered immigrant here
Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna
 

CoryKS

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Buzzwords rule. "Liberals" are bad. "Fascist" is bad. Put them both together - extra bad!

Probably referring to situations like this one. Whether or not it's entirely accurate to label as fascist those who would threaten police action for something like this, I will leave to those wonks who don't think we have nearly enough "Socialism: I Do Not Think It Means What You Think It Means" threads. But no one could argue with a straight face that this sort of authoritarianism was instigated by a right-leaning individual.

There are libertarian and conservative commentators who have made the point that some European countries have gone rather a bit far in accomodating immigrants, to the point of alienating sectors of their citizenry, and that the result is a growing interest in parties such as the BNP or Le Pen's party in France. They warn that the parties currently in charge need to offer some balance in their policies in order to ward off nationalist tendencies because when Europeans go xenophobic, they tend to do so on the bloodiest scale imaginable.
 

yorkshirelad

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Liberal fascist politics? what on earth are you talking about? Liberals in the UK are nothing like the liberals you have in the States and the fascists are the BNP.
The BNP are the British Nazi Party for crying out loud, they are not the only party to worry about immigration which is actually blown up out of proportion anyway. The BNP are Holocaust deniers and are known rascists.
The Labour party PM wrote a communist manifesto back i the early '70. There are a few racists in prominant positions in the Labour party. An aspiring, female Labour parliamentary candidate was told by an Islamic Labour councilman that she was too Jewish to be a candidate for his constituants. But of course most don't see this as racism, because it would be politically incorrect to label a Pakistani muslim as such and this one guy is also a holocaust denier.

The Labour controled areas of Harehill and Chapeltown in Leeds are also some of the racist places you will find. In Chapeltown, I have personally been threatened with "a good kicking" because I just happened to be a white guy in a black neighbourhood. In Harehills I have been refused service in one particular store because I was not asian. Both of these districts are Labour controlled areas, but if I complained about racism, I would have been laughed out of town. Why? Because of the tone set by the ruling idiots in Whitehall and the positive discrimination standards set by them. They are also becoming morwe and more anti-semetic because of their need to capture the islamic vote. Time for a change. It looks like Brown and his croneys are through. Lets hope the tory's can do a better job. If they're not up for the task, I'm sure the BNP will a some point gain ground. And if they do, good for them.
 

Tez3

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The Labour party PM wrote a communist manifesto back i the early '70. There are a few racists in prominant positions in the Labour party. An aspiring, female Labour parliamentary candidate was told by an Islamic Labour councilman that she was too Jewish to be a candidate for his constituants. But of course most don't see this as racism, because it would be politically incorrect to label a Pakistani muslim as such and this one guy is also a holocaust denier.

The Labour controled areas of Harehill and Chapeltown in Leeds are also some of the racist places you will find. In Chapeltown, I have personally been threatened with "a good kicking" because I just happened to be a white guy in a black neighbourhood. In Harehills I have been refused service in one particular store because I was not asian. Both of these districts are Labour controlled areas, but if I complained about racism, I would have been laughed out of town. Why? Because of the tone set by the ruling idiots in Whitehall and the positive discrimination standards set by them. They are also becoming morwe and more anti-semetic because of their need to capture the islamic vote. Time for a change. It looks like Brown and his croneys are through. Lets hope the tory's can do a better job. If they're not up for the task, I'm sure the BNP will a some point gain ground. And if they do, good for them.

It will never be a good day when the BNP gain control of anything. I go to the places you mention in Leeds all the time and have never had problems. My synagogue is in Chapeltown.
There is however a huge amount of anti Islamic feeling in Leeds.
the BNP are a foul pestilance and never should they be allowed to take control of even one council seat, their militant wing, Combat 18, will literally batter people into submissin. Please don't think I'm exaggerating or being melodramatic, they really are clones of the Nazi stormtroopers.
Rascists you will find everywhere and in every party but never will you find a party other than the BNP with racism as their policy.
http://www.skrewdriver.net/
 

yorkshirelad

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It will never be a good day when the BNP gain control of anything. I go to the places you mention in Leeds all the time and have never had problems. My synagogue is in Chapeltown.
There is however a huge amount of anti Islamic feeling in Leeds.
the BNP are a foul pestilance and never should they be allowed to take control of even one council seat, their militant wing, Combat 18, will literally batter people into submissin. Please don't think I'm exaggerating or being melodramatic, they really are clones of the Nazi stormtroopers.
Rascists you will find everywhere and in every party but never will you find a party other than the BNP with racism as their policy.
http://www.skrewdriver.net/
To tell you the truth, I know nothing of Combat 18, but I see the left in Britain becoming more and more left and the right becoming more and more right. Racism is rampant in the Labour party. It's called positive discrimination. Tez, with all due respect, your Synagogue may be in Leeds, but you live in North Yorkshire. I lived in West Yorks for all of my childhood, apart from just a few years when I lived in Haxby in York. When we moved to Haxby, I loved it. It was safe and friendly. When we moved back to Leeds I hated it. As a young man, I had to keep my head down most of the time in the areas I mentioned in my last post, for fear of being pummeled.

It seems that anti-racism laws are also being used in the UK, to try to coherse dissenters into towing the party line. So I think that the liberals in charge or the Labour party are becoming totalitarian fascists themselves. Like I said before. When a woman is labelled too Jewish to be a Labour candidate, there obviouslt is a problem.

BTW enjoy Leeds. I much prefer Southern California these days. I have freedom of speech, I can own a gun and have great weather at the same time.
 

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Damn. Other than Tony Blair's "New Labor" and warm beer I thought you Brits had more sense than us Yanks. I remember when the NF was an object of scorn.
 
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Sukerkin

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I don't think you really believe that. Assuming the BNP or someone like them fully implemented their vision, any dissenters from the True Faith would be punished - no matter what their pedigree.

Quite right, sir. It was intended to stand out as broad-brush irony. The path of fascism, whilst initially giving people the 'strong rulers' they crave, has an inivitability about it when it comes to the crushing of any dissent or disagreement.
 

Tez3

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To tell you the truth, I know nothing of Combat 18, but I see the left in Britain becoming more and more left and the right becoming more and more right. Racism is rampant in the Labour party. It's called positive discrimination. Tez, with all due respect, your Synagogue may be in Leeds, but you live in North Yorkshire. I lived in West Yorks for all of my childhood, apart from just a few years when I lived in Haxby in York. When we moved to Haxby, I loved it. It was safe and friendly. When we moved back to Leeds I hated it. As a young man, I had to keep my head down most of the time in the areas I mentioned in my last post, for fear of being pummeled.

It seems that anti-racism laws are also being used in the UK, to try to coherse dissenters into towing the party line. So I think that the liberals in charge or the Labour party are becoming totalitarian fascists themselves. Like I said before. When a woman is labelled too Jewish to be a Labour candidate, there obviouslt is a problem.

BTW enjoy Leeds. I much prefer Southern California these days. I have freedom of speech, I can own a gun and have great weather at the same time.

I was born and raised in Brixton London, have lived all over the country as well as abroad. North Yorkshire is where I'm posted at the moment. My other half is from Oulton, Leeds.
I am not a Labour supporter btw, I'm Liberal in the British sense.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brixton
 

Tez3

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I don't get the California weather but then don't get the earthquake problem either lol. I own guns and get to carry too.
 

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