Why Silat?

Discussion in 'Indochinese Martial Arts - General' started by Hawke, Mar 25, 2008.

  1. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    no one is actually a martial artist but rather

    just a martial practitioner that strives for

    flashes or flows of the perfection, that is

    the art , when ten things come together

    perfectly in one step and everything is

    countered and works the way its suppose

    to ,that is a glimpse of the art , like who

    thinks of perfect chess being about hours of

    two staring entranced into the squares, its five

    moves, checkmate, its the opening

    setup, that make these games possible

    to imagine just the first move could set them up a

    hundred percent, so that any follow up becomes

    possible , is to imagine being a martial artist,
     
  2. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    no one is actually a martial artist but rather

    just a martial practitioner that strives for

    flashes or flows of the perfection, that is

    the art , when ten things come together

    with one step and everything is perfectly

    countered and works the way its suppose

    to ,that is a glimpse of the art , like who

    thinks of perfect chess being about hours of

    two faces staring sharply into the squares, its five

    moves, checkmate, its the opening setup, that

    make these rare victories ever possible , and to

    imagine how just the first move could set them up

    a hundred percent, in such a way so that most any follow

    up becomes possible , is to imagine being a martial

    artist, its like chess in that one makes their move having

    calculated every imaginable possible counter move ,from

    the opponent and the counters to those, so seems the more

    counters and options we can find and fathom for our opponents

    to react with the better, and easier to take them away from them
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2015
  3. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    It seems physical fitness and strength is the icing on the cake

    or the cake under the icing, meaning its good to train and stand

    cross legged and smash the air, but without once in a while trudging

    up some steep hills and throwing some some wts around ,and

    possessing some super gymnastic strengh, never slowed Bruce

    Lee down ,in his moves, a great, few might deny possibility the greatest

    modern martial arts practitioner, on or off the screen, now if he had sat

    in a chair all day and drank scotch and taught his martial arts

    techniques at night, it would've not been the same, he would've

    been bruce who ?, but the fact that his peak physical shape was

    inseparable from his martial art, mindset that he could move like a

    feather weight and hit and kick like a heavy weight, its like

    everyone learns the same art in a style , but they express

    and process the knowledge though a different machine, and

    vehicle, heres where everyone takes the art to their own limits

    same thing with Ali fitness fanatic , how could he have been

    the greatest without that, those two both strived constantly to attain

    Rolls Royce level physiques, few are close to, most have in comparison

    volks wagons they would be lucky to ever upgrade to BMW's, but were

    they to if at all possible how could it not help but, serve more

    respect to the expression of whatever art they claim their involvement,

    Lee would explode into motion hit or kick at someone quicker then they

    could see it, with power lifting them off the ground didn't really matter

    what art he lent his hand, that precision timed explosiveness he possessed,

    that made it JKD
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2015
  4. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    Ok the elbow is silats secret weapon no one uses it so

    sneaky widely and efficiently, as the Indonesians, have

    come to , it is the most elbow, of all the arts, silat has more

    variations of elbow than boxing has jabs, as every strike may

    either follow with an elbow or start with one ,but its always

    there like a hidden short baseball bat, the whole objective

    of the arts strategy is to close range, land the elbow, like

    a thousand paths leading to one road, here's a secret why ,

    a coconut cracking silat elbow can be fired full force from

    nearly any position and it won't affect stability or structure ,

    say that about a hong kong hay maker, or ask if a powerful

    western left hook can always include a triggered incidental

    foot sweep and knee,
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2015
  5. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    missing , if you miss you were not focused, if you focus you can not miss

    of course thats an extended embellishment on the reverberating echo of

    my teachers words , but those precise words just came to me, as I was just

    out back breaking apart a big old wooden lounge chair , for the trash

    with a claw hammer, had the arm free with the first hard swing, at the

    half inch high lip,I went at it focused had it in pieces in no time,

    Its a hand eye fusion of total trust , then when I started thinking about how

    perfectly accurately I was hitting off the narrow tips of the steel springs

    I missed three swings , caught up in the gloating for a moment, broke

    the actual focus , reminding me thinking about it is not close to the same

    as actual focusing, when theres focus there can be no thought about it only

    more focus
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2015
  6. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    speed is useless sometimes, if the object is to balance the coin on the table

    the fastest, racing the coin to the table makes no sense, once there,

    you gotta start all over anyways, to gradually find its precise axis of

    gravitational alignment,
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2015
  7. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    funny how its not how fast the punch goes out but

    how fast it retracts that gives it its snap , what, do ya

    wanna leave it out there all day like its taking a long

    cruise, its sure most anyone can throw their punch

    fast but can they catch their punch back faster and use

    that to empower a spinning back hand rolling crescent forward

    lunge sweep not a fat chance or rather not a slim chance, unless its

    silat common sense yells in the ear if something comes back

    faster than it gets out there leaves ahead a surplus of energy

    somewhere upon its return

    there is no wasted movement of motion, just as every

    technique has a hidden flaw every counter is balanced

    as its checked
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2015
  8. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    just completely understanding all of physics, is a bit difficult ,

    there might be martial science but there are no martial physics,

    its cool ,but it aint that cool , nothing is , no there is just

    the one and only physics ,and physics doesn't ever go around you

    you go around it , again the same leverage principles shown

    us as an effortless scissor throw are applied to everything

    all heavy lifting or tossing , we run across , of course there's

    adjustments and limits to fling a tree log over the heap turn

    over a rock or throw out and old couch ,or drunk all what

    physics that was learned is class is perfectly adaptable

    and applicable,the exact principles are in place, thats why

    more physics based martial arts take a while , some might

    talk of body physics as if the body has physics, when it is

    physics, that has the body, say a strike comes flying in

    one might turn to slip and trail the force , but, specifically to

    what exact, calculated measure of degree , to say make

    them come freely fully charging in, past everything, except right

    down clotheslined into the fired elbow, where their head used to be ,

    its like don't we want to time it perfectly and just hit the fast

    ball over the fence without having to physically grapple with its pitcher

    on the diamond rushing in to tackle us ,as the elbow is to silat what the

    bat is to baseball, it sounds simple, but so does winning a game of chess

    in three moves,


    Yeah, I see what you're saying, Blind .That describes it well . It kinda reads

    back, in a blurry streamline flurry like that, to me too. But then again, if no

    one is so sure or too confused what they are reading, they are much less prone

    to pose a dispute or conflict ,could about count those on one hand that have

    here, in the past, seems they all lost all hope and gave up trying, soon enough,

    I don't know ,but anyones disagreements still is appreciated, and amusing.

    especially non silat people
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2015
  9. Blindside

    Blindside Senior Master

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    Do you have a period on your keyboard? It would help if you used it, and paragraphs would be good too.

    As it is it feels and reads like a transcript of someones stream of consciousness dialogue while tripping.
     
  10. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    We know nothing about silat on our own.

    We owe it all to those who taught us.

    It is not our art, but our teachers, just as it

    is not their art, but their teachers .


    as with good faith a fact out weighs fiction

    for one, no art can be put into words,

    especially martial , it can be only visually

    demonstrated with an explanation,

    but without the visual, there is no art

    to speak of ,if you're just standing there

    in the wrong place ,someone just standing

    there in front wants your watch and takes

    a swing , to explain and breakdown every

    motion they made from head to toe in the

    one second from just standing there,

    would be full of allot of fast detail

    its not a description that would sound

    unlike anyone else who has done the same

    but to see it it would stand out to others

    because the visual detail is complete

    words can only describe the completeness

    perceived
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2015
  11. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    if its a triangle, one line is seeing the next feeling the last doing it

    , so if one watches

    a ping pong lesson , then goes to the table and the teacher is a world

    class player , they may use ten percent of their skill to beat them

    in a match, and they wouldn't move much , their great refined

    detailed skills may not be so plainly visible to look at them, yet

    another champion could still pick them out instantly ,

    seems the more skilled the more refined and harder to

    read they become
     
  12. martiallightnin

    martiallightnin White Belt

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    some great anecdotes here. I've been thinking of taking it up myself. Plenty to think about!
     
  13. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    Its hell of allot allot to grasp , it looks so different ,

    than other martial arts again its full of unorthodox

    joint contortions , just watch Indonesian dancers,

    see, notice how far back they bend their hands

    and fingers and the sharp insane angles , in which they

    pivot their wrists, watch the plate and candle

    dancers , they bend their joints till they almost look

    double jointed ,

    once early on, my teacher got tired or bored with me asking

    different ways I can trap his arms

    and next thing I knew I was on my toes the painful

    very efen tips of them , and he had

    his arm raised making two vertical fist turn down ,

    holding my two index fingers with

    my palms facing up, well it was fun for about

    the first five seconds ,but after a couple if

    minutes it was getting old, I looked at my teacher

    just smiling looking right through me

    ,well I didn't ask him about trapping , for some time ,

    to this day those two fingers can bend backwards

    quite a bit farther then the rest, Indonesian style ,

    it was like I was bugging him enough and he punished

    and rewarded me by giving me two Indonesian fingers,

    sore for a couple of weeks , but its the little things that make the

    big things flow smoother, so what I first took for just pure sadism ,

    I came to appreciate thinking the Indonesians must do something

    drastic to contort their fingers back as far as they do, and my

    teacher could bend his back pretty damn far, so I like to think

    his teachers did that to him and he knew exactly what he was doing

    that one morning, he almost broke both my fingers , but when you

    see its not just the dancers bending bending their joints for the aesthetics

    when the old masters can all flex their fingers back as well, again the hand is

    like a swiss army knife , so many tools besides the fists and so many kinds of fists

    I think I have it on film I should ,try to find it re watch it see how long I was actually

    on my toes ,wanna say two hours but that aint right one thing it did make a minute

    seem like hours in pain time but I'm guessing a few minutes real time,come think of

    it that tweaks the toes out too, as you are off your feet balancing on the very points of your

    toes , and that hurts too, at the same time,
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2015
  14. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    the fact seems the martial art for weaklings is a myth

    weaklings don't belong in martial arts I realize I have

    just offended all you weaklings who train, but so what

    you are just a weakling ,you went to train because you

    are weak , so you could still stay a weakling but kicksomeass

    that was your plan, or worse you expected martial arts to

    turn you out of being a weakling, instead of first just deciding

    not to be a weakling in the first place,you can't do anything

    with weak muscles , weak muscles are like having sick muscles

    strong muscles are healthy muscles and the stronger the better

    oh I'll go to class two hrs a week be strong in no time, a weakling

    is just three short degrees from being a sickling , don't think of martial arts

    once a week think of all the ways of

    getting stronger 24'7 going to martial

    arts cause your a weakling is among

    the worst reasons, because it seemingly justifies

    the lifestyle of maybe staying a wimpy

    weakling , are we not every moment getting

    stronger or weaker quicker or slower,

    more or less coordinated , so if you are a

    weakling it only takes a few months to be

    non weak and another few to start getting

    strong, as long as you don't injure muscles

    they will keep healing

    you go to martial arts mostly to get hurt so

    you need extra strong and healthy

    muscles , they are as easy as a few months

    total dedication and a lions share

    of common sense , so best to get strong

    first on your own time and dime

    them when you go to martial arts you can

    storm on the floor and go right to wreaking

    havoc upon the biggest weaklings in the class ,

    saying yeah I

    was one of you, a pathetic weakling,

    strengh is good weakness bad , not conan

    thats mutant deformation

    just strong solid muscles , should be the

    prerequisite for martial arts

    rather than looking for secret strategies

    to protect and preserve your

    weak physique , theres a million programs

    for getting stronger martial

    arts is the hardest , cause of all the

    hits and falls be strong and you might

    break even , besides martial arts gets

    complex and difficult where getting stronger

    on your own is practically a no brainer, it just

    takes patience persistence and devotion

    things you need for martial arts anyway,at the same skill why don't they mix heavy wts with middle wts,

    in boxing, ever, because if you run into some one at your skill

    level only stronger bigger or quicker , who's gonna win, you, ?

    how ?
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2015
  15. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    what skills do you have when you lose your balance,

    but hope to race gravity to the floor stop drop and roll

    go at it low level but what if they take your balance

    and you don't know it , its like this if you don't have

    theirs at close range , theres a good chance they have

    yours, how can you keep your balance in any struggle

    if first you don't have theirs, silat is the art of never

    having to lose your balance, or never doing any move that

    places balance in danger , when you lose your balance you

    lose your , all your hard earned skills in good standing at the

    same time ,when the silat players dance in exhibitions ,they look like

    they are trying to shake themselves to the ground twisting

    and jumping around all jittery, but no that is just a dance what

    martial value could that have, it stabilizes balance in motion

    they swing their balance around in every direction , try to make

    yourself almost fall recover then do it again, then really try,

    why not get comfortable being at that point of no return

    and working down from there , be your own worst enemy

    try and take your balance with missteps tripsteps and wt shifts,

    walk jurus on a two by four , how hard is it to find one of those

    and a couple of blocks , stand around with weight on one leg

    walk on rice paper , but nothing refines the balance like

    the foot work left to the flow in the dance
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2015
  16. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    they need to extend the editing time limit some,

    its like every martial artist is okay with falling

    and okay with catching their balance, but

    not okay when they can do neither of both

    same spooky feeling when realize you've leaned back in

    the chair too far but not quite so far back enough to fall or

    come back up

    sheer panic replaces the moment as it short circuits all thought ,

    you can't even think about falling , maybe you will maybe you won't,

    so same thing happens when standing not thinking the legs will

    involuntarily scramble to find any source of stable footing

    be it the form of a pretzel ,now having taken the bait in their

    last and only available retreating clumsy step, back off balance

    they go only now their legs are maybe locked in a tangle its a

    chase to checkmate you take out the balance take away the legs

    whats left , except the easiest way to fight is the hardest to learn
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2015
  17. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    And so what the heck is a stance , its not to be taken loosely

    jumping all over the place, its not really an option , we have

    little choice how to stand , its the decision of the art how to stand

    variations of mobility dictates the stance , ok , for example your

    in your stance, what can you do , from where you are to where

    you go ,and when you transition to your next stance do you

    have as many or more options , in other words, can you be as

    powerful in any direction ? no because all structures are not equal

    , some are more strategic , and the most strategic of them all

    is the most practical and efficient , that is to say if one is best

    according to the physics of the body, shtcan the rest or at best

    put them on the back burner , why bother with even slightly

    inferior positions , so common sense says , there can be only

    one core stance worth putting forth , one position of ultimate

    instant transition , that is with the smallest adjustments what

    is possible , the time it takes to take a stance is the time it takes

    for a fist to already come flying in ,many may drop into their fancy

    dancy stance only to find themselves swept or hit inside of that

    moment, its about splitting hairs shaving fractions of a second,

    being an expert means doing more with less motion, motion is the enemy

    it must be minimized to be maximized, cause its the little things that

    take the longest to master ,or even to see, so we gladly pay out our dues to

    our teachers out of pure amazement, of their abilities cause we don't know

    just exactly wtf they are doing, if we did should we even need to be there

    but the reason we don't so easily ever catch up with our teachers other than

    the likelihood of their god given physical talents ,is because they too are

    still learning and progressing as they teach , and at a much faster rate than

    their students , because their understanding is so much deeper , you might

    learn five new things at a class session, consider your teach then has just

    discovered ten new things, approaches or angles , remembering they

    only became the teachers through first being learning experts, while

    you're distracted at work, or out doing your daily thing , they are still focused

    on the art

    knowledge is alive the more there is the faster it grows , which is why

    good teachers can always continue to never cease to amaze their students
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2015
  18. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    and popularized strategies dealing with multiple opponents

    is built on fairytale, for one, the facts seem to conclude, they're

    more likely to throw a about thousand pounds of pressure your way ,

    in one near simultaneous stomping pounce , so you have about the time

    of one breath to win or lose , with no time for added defense thats why

    breathing is held to be such a valued skill in silat , yes no one shows you how

    to breathe proper, well they do and they don't I mean its not like

    explaining standard a judo flip where you can just go start doing it ,

    no you say for months or even years internally experimenting am I regulating

    this right most times ahh wtf feel like I'm just suffocating in chi land I know

    the breath is like a metronome , and at the heart of timing , but so many specifics

    and not enough damn oxygen to go around , it is said silat is an internal

    martial art breathing is a part of the internal aspect of silat , yeah duh ,

    doesn't get much more internal than that, all breathing is inside alright

    of course some don't stay only with the breathing but go on to chase

    shadows in the imaginary dark , never seeing the light of day in any

    arena awarding themselves untold amounts untested internal chi force

    energy and yes and no, but then apart from the trained breathing , not

    so much, which can be so tediously complicated in itself to ingrain into

    particular motions, who would guess a little thing like breathing could

    be such a big deal ,yeah how hard could it be whats easier then breathing

    it ain't yoga but being an Indonesian art we steal their chi energy element

    out from under their lotus pillows and match it to dynamic motions,
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2015
  19. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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  20. infinite beginner

    infinite beginner Purple Belt

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    so you take what you get and you run with it

    you learn all the rules ,thats the perimeter

    and off the track , there is no skill in technique ,

    its like technique is the retarded brother of

    counter technique or the dumb end of a tape

    measure, its the one with the best counters

    that has the best system , so there must be

    imagination to find different ways to train ,

    hang a metal bat on a rope attached to a garage

    spring anything to make reflexes sharper

    and chops choppier , but as soon as you do

    something , say after the third move from jurus

    xyz in response to a surprise en counter is, what

    should the jurus tell you , to do

    automatically , but to counter ,so just hung up a

    swinging plastic bat over a swinging medicine ball,

    about easy chair level , but it drove home this valuable

    principle,when I punched the ball the bat slowly swings

    every third or fourth hit or second ? who knows its unpredictable ,

    first was striking then when it swung countering it

    it was breaking the timing of the simple repetitive strikes

    just enough that the only thing to do, was add the little counter

    to the recoil every time, but do we ever know when it will

    be time to counter , no, we don't, so thats why its easy to chop

    at a target , no strategy needed just lighting fast speed and frozen

    coconut cracking force , or theres a good chance it will be countered

    or obstructed, so the counter focused offensive method is always thinking

    what can they do, not what can we do so the intent of the technique

    is to outsmart the counter ,its not who can counter you but who you

    can counter , for every move, or tech, there is, its out numbered by

    multiple counters , so you start your tiger form 27 flurry to counter

    a sucker punch you see from a mile away at the 7 eleven ,only to feel a

    boot buried into your shin as you started your elaborate lash , its a hard

    move to counter ,as low kicks are the most invisible , and unpleasant to

    deal with , sure you might get through you combo form , but the kick

    still smarts, at best, are we willing to take a good solid sneaky shin kick

    because we were too focused thinking about our fantastic technique

    that will send em soaring through the air ,and you might be halfway

    to a reverse arm lock knockout only to realize the shin kicker has taken out

    your foot and leg , think they were going to stop with a simple shin kick

    when that was just part of their entry , they practice like a boxer does a jab,

    as a lead in, so when you go in with a punch you better take their legs out

    with it, know that the low kick is coming just as sure as the low back sweep

    is on the way ,
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2015

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