Looking for Ninjitsu Training Partners in the NW Indiana Area

Discussion in 'Ninjutsu' started by ronin7411, Dec 8, 2009.

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  1. oaktree

    oaktree Master of Arts

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    曇/曇り Kumori-by itself means like cloudy,foggy something like that.
    曇天Kumori ten-cloudy,foggy sky.


    So what Kumori ryu means is like the school of cloudy weather.....
    I guess its better than 馬鹿 白人 流-baka hakujin ryu.

    :shrug:
     
  2. Bruno@MT

    Bruno@MT Senior Master

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    Stupid white man ryu?
    See. I knew learning Japanese would pay off :D
    (My goal for this year is to learn the kyoiku kanji).
     
  3. oaktree

    oaktree Master of Arts

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    Correctomundo
     
  4. Kumori Ryu Ninja

    Kumori Ryu Ninja Orange Belt

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    Your calling me Stupid. Well how Cute...

    Thanks!
     
  5. Bruno@MT

    Bruno@MT Senior Master

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    He wasn't. He said your name was better than his example. Probably to point out that even though your name is not wholly thought through, at least it is not embarrassingly bad like the alternative.

    But otoh, if you are going to make up a Japanese name for your system, it might be a good idea to have it checked by a person who speaks Japanese. Just like if you'd get a kanji tattoo.
     
  6. Kumori Ryu Ninja

    Kumori Ryu Ninja Orange Belt

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    It was implied... I think Ill move on...
    Good day.
     
  7. jks9199

    jks9199 Administrator Staff Member

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    Folks,

    MT remains a FRIENDLY forum. Drop the personal shots and sniping.
     
  8. oaktree

    oaktree Master of Arts

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    I am not calling you stupid per say, just when people start using Japanese names or Chinese names to call themselves or school or whatever and it comes out to mean
    something like: Cloudy weather school it just sounds stupid to me and it is almost as bad as calling yourself baka hakujin ryu.

    There were many such cases of people creating their own branches of what they consider Ninjutsu and adding some obscure Japanese name.

    Also the average Japanese when hearing of some funny ninjutsu ryuha name that an American made up will do one of two things 1.remain silent 2.may ask you about why you choose that meaning.

    This has been my experience when asking Japanese what they think about subjects like this.
     
  9. Kumori Ryu Ninja

    Kumori Ryu Ninja Orange Belt

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    I used the name because the Clouds have great meaning to me...
    They are like the heavens on earth...

    Im sorry that something I take seriously is stupid to you.. But to be honest I didn't ask you if you like my name or not...

    I commented here on this thread to help encourage an uke in the arts..

    I hope that you can do the same for someone!!
     
  10. oaktree

    oaktree Master of Arts

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    Hi Kumori I will try to be more gentle maybe my post was a little rude. My apologies.
    I understand you like clouds. The word you picked is Kumori 曇.
    Now the word Kumori means 1.Cloudy(as in like a storm) 2.Overcast 3.Dark clouds.
    So naming your school the Overcast school or Dark cloud school it is a very strange name.

    When you add Ninjutsu to the name it sounds even stranger.

    My post was really not directed towards you it was in response to Mr.Parker
    I thought he was asking in regards to the Kanji for Kumori.

    It is also a bit odd to create a Ninjutsu ryuha without some sort of Menkyo or transmission from 1.Soke or figure head 2.Menkyo in the system.

    I am in no way attacking you I am pointing out things that may draw up criticism or potential students or people may ask you.
     
  11. Bob Hubbard

    Bob Hubbard Retired

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    We had a guy pass through here who basically made up his systems name from his own made up language. He got a lot of flack. He insisted it was ninjutsu, even though it had zero ties to anything Japanese. Even the word ninjutsu was misspelled. He was eventually removed from here after much disruption on his part. When dealing with unfamiliar languages, its best to get a trusted person to verify all translations and grammar. Otherwise, it'll be a long term headache for all involved.
     
  12. Kumori Ryu Ninja

    Kumori Ryu Ninja Orange Belt

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    I thank you all for your opinions
     
  13. Omar B

    Omar B Senior Master

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    Screw it. This thread is f-ed anyway.
     
  14. ronin7411

    ronin7411 Orange Belt

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    For starters Chris I was here looking for people to train with not your advice and even though you knock me learning from home study courses. I see more Bujinkan instructors and their off-shots than any other style and lineage coming out with home study courses or "at home training material" for the style of Ninjutsu. Also since you guys knock home study courses how do you feel about what Grandmaster Robert Law and David Suzuki say in an article claiming Masaaki Hatsumi is over commercializing Ninjutsu with home study courses that he grades on the progress of students on the Bujinkan home study courses. Now should I also mention that he's ex Bujinkan himself and along with Stephen Hayes and Robert Bussey breaking away to do their own thing motivated him to do the same as well.

    http://www.ninja-training.com/grandmaster/

    http://www.ninja-training.com/DavidS.html
     
  15. Bruno@MT

    Bruno@MT Senior Master

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    There is nothing wrong with home study guides IF they are used in conjunction with live training. Tanemura sensei also has the kyu curriculum available on DVD for those who want to buy it. They can be helpful as a study guide to help you prepare for your exams, especially if you only see your sensei every other week or once per month. But having a sensei is essential.

    And I'd like to see some proof that Hatsumi sensei is grading people over home study courses before we go down that road. I know RVD does it, and he is considered dubious by many in the Bujinkan, with his 'up to 4th dan' home study exams and his fake menkyo kaiden in 'ninjutsu ryu'. Given thatmost serious Bujinkan people I know loath him, it would surprise me greatly if Hatsumi sensei would do such things.
     
  16. Kumori Ryu Ninja

    Kumori Ryu Ninja Orange Belt

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    Id love to know why my Sensei hates this guy lol.... Well to say the least Sensei Ennan showed his distaste in his teachings and his material...

    I never knew the whole story but Id love to here your take on it...

    Thanks
     
  17. Kumori Ryu Ninja

    Kumori Ryu Ninja Orange Belt

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    Actually while in discussion with my past Sensei..
    He had stated that "any one that has learned anything can teach... You can not rank Bujinkan however with out the requirements"... I discussed the idea of training and teaching in my area which was an hour from him. He didn't show any signs of distaste in my intentions... I had emailed him several times to update him and keep track... Im in the midst of finalizing my dues to him {this stuff aint cheap} once that is finished I plan on continuing my training to aid in my teaching...

    I pondered that statement for some time... My sense is not terribly personable so it is difficult to approach him to confront all the issues with his written release of permission to teach what Ive learned from him..

    So in regards to your post I appreciate your attention to my history with Ninjutsu...

    Thankyou!
     
  18. Bruno@MT

    Bruno@MT Senior Master

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    Many buj people hate him because he does 2 things that reputable people don't agree with.

    1) he sells home study courses and grades you up to 4th dan just for paying the fee, thus devaluing the perception of bujinkan as a whole.

    2) he claims to hold a menkyo kaiden in something called 'ninjutsu ryu' which is so obviously fraudulent (*) it is not even funny. The cornerstone of the authenticity discussion within the ninjutsu world are the menkyo kaiden in the schools from which the founders composed their system. Those menkyo kaiden are what separates the frauds from the real thing.

    Even legitimate offshoots who don't use the menkyo system anymore, or have a founder who doesn't hold menkyo kaiden, can trace their knowledge back to those menkyo kaiden via long term student-teacher relationships. While this is still subject to discussion (how long did the student teacher relationship exist), at least there is enough substance to argue either way.

    By claiming to hold (any) menkyo kaiden, RVD is setting himself up to appear much more learned and expert than he really is (probably for marketing reasons) while at the same time associating the Bujinkan with that sort of nonsense.

    (*) It is obviously fake because an authentic ryuha would have an actual name. Terms like ninjutsu, jujutsu, bojutsu, etc are the classification. Kukishin ryu, Togakure ryu, Takagi Yoshin ryu etc are names. What makes it doubly suspicious is that he would hold a menkyo kaiden in something that no Japanese has ever heard of, and without being able to identify who trained him and explain why there are no Japanese people who trained that art.
     
  19. Chris Parker

    Chris Parker Grandmaster

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    Hi Jon,

    I'm going to try to be gentle here, so please take this is the spirit in which it is intended. You have thanked us a few times for our attention to your school, or, in this case, your history with Ninjutsu. Can you clarify exactly what your history is? So far I have seen a few things that seem to contradict themselves, although that could easily just be the phrasing (such as being a part of the Bujinkan and studying Toshindo at the same time, as that is directly against the direction of the Bujinkan, on Hatsumi Sensei's instructions).

    More in particular, how long have you studied in each of these organisations, and what level did you achieve? My main reason for asking is your, frankly, rather odd turns of phrase, such as "practicing Nin", and refering to all students as "Uke":

    This use of Uke really doesn't ring true for someone who has trained for a fair amount of time, as it is fairly mis-used. The term refers to "reciever", as in reciever of the technique, and typically means the attacking partner. In traditional arts, however, the attacking partner (Uke, Teki, Shidachi etc) is the more senior of the two, so refering to someone like Johnny as "uke" is incorrect on a number of levels.

    Now to Johnny....

    Son, this will be less gentle.

    No, we didn't knock you for learning from home study courses, it was for not listening when you were guided to legitimate teachers in the art who were close to you, even though you wanted to open a "ninjitsu dojo" as you felt it was "lacking in your area". You went out of your way to avoid legit training in order to pursue your fantasy version. You then started learning via correspondence in a downright fraudulant system, then started attacking the Bujinkan, and claiming that we were ganging up on anyone not in the Kan's (might I point out that I'm not Kan myself here?). You got knocked for being willfully ignorant and then attacking the people who tried to help you (not that it did them any good).

    Really, I can't say what I think about "Grandmaster" Robert Law and David Suzuki here... frankly, the TOS wouldn't cope with what I'd say. But for the record, Law was barely credible when he was in the Kan, he then went on a bizarre fantasy trip, came back with rather odd titles and claims (such as being a Soke in such things as Taijutsu, Kenjutsu, Hojojutsu etc.... there is no such thing as a Soke in them. You are a Soke in a traditional system, not in a skill set that is taught as part of a system, this shows a level of delusion that cannot be looked past), and David's article is fundamentally flawed as it is basing itself on claims that are flat-out incorrect. Hatsumi has never ranked anyone via video as is claimed in the beginning of the article. If you are wanting to believe any of this, there is no point discussing anything with you.

    Law is very very different to Hayes and Bussey. If you can't see this, you have no idea of anything to do with this whatsoever.
     
  20. Kumori Ryu Ninja

    Kumori Ryu Ninja Orange Belt

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    Mr. Parker...

    With all do respect,
    Im not conserned with what you think in the slightest..
    Im not on the earth to make bujinkan students happy..
    I have nothing to hide.. Im a 6th kyu Bujinkan and I study To-Shin-Do without rank... I don't care about rank... Time is important not rank...

    3 yrs Studying bujinkan
    1 yr Toshindo studies

    A lot of the things you try to point out to me I am fully aware of.. Please try not to treat people like there stupid, It makes you look bad!
    I call my Buddies Uke.. You have a problem, that's your thing not mine...

    You seem to only be interested in tearing others down and slapping internet Hi fives with your buddies and students..

    For this reason.. I will do my best to ignore you!!

    Thanks!123
     
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