Wu Shen Pai Kenpo in Vegas?

[kenpomike890]

Kenpo Novice,

Have you ever met or trained with Professor Robert Jones?

Mike

 

[KenpoNovice]

Mike,

Yes I have met him on two different occasions. Now your turn, how about answers to those questions I listed above?

Terry the KenpoNovice

 

[Dark Kenpo Lord]

Re: Wu Shen Pai Kenpo in Vegas?

"He holds a Ph.D. in Public Policy and Politics and is working on a Ph.D. in Political Science."

That says it all, it's all politics.


Actually, he doesn't hold a Ph'd. For years he claimed he had a Ph'd from NAU in Arizona. In turns out they kicked him out of the school when he had been a doctoral candidate for years and wouldn't do any work.

That is utterly false! In fact, I have two Bachelor of Arts Degrees (History / International Relations) Both are awarded Summa Cum Laude – With Highest Honors. I also graduted from the Northern Arizona University Honors Program. So “With Honors” appears on my diploma. Second, I have a Master’s Degree in Political science from Northern Arizona University. (By the way – With Distinction) To date, I have not been expelled, removed or otherwise made ineligible for advanced work at my alma mater.





The funny thing is, being a doctoral candidate is impressive and something to be proud of. But when you force everyone to call you "Dr.", advetise as a Ph'd, and brag about your title over and over when you actually never received your diploma, that's sad.

I do not nor have I ever forced anyone to call me Doctor. In fact, I do somewhat loath the title. That said, I have worked more years than you can imagine to EARN it. I have received a Doctoral Diploma. It is through a University in the UK. Why there? Well because I fancied going to Academics sometime and in that world it is a bad thing to finish ALL degrees in one place. Soooooo, I moved on..I remain interested in Political science although My UK Degree in PS is Public Policy. I am still doing postdoctoral work leading to another degree from my alma mater. Oh, I may also be working toward an Ed.D. Degree soon. Does that meet with you approval? If you want to consult Political Science and justification for actions at its very best, you can observe the slander and character assassination that is allowed on this Forum. Oh, you are participating in it. Sorry, I forgot. By the way, before you libel someone, sight unseen…at least have the good graces to meet them and ask them for the facts.





Well actually, I'm mistaken. He does have a ph'd from some type of correspondance course from a school in the U.K. For $500, any of us can have ph'd's as well. Seriously, you pay $500 and you get the degree and title in a couple of weeks.



See my denial above.



This info. I received from several of his students, meeting them outside his school in a social setting.



If you got that from any student at my school, then they were obviously working off a twisted agenda of their own, probably from being expelled.





Respectuflly



Professor Robert L. Jones, Ph.D.

So tell us Bob, what is your reasoning and basis for this sudden change in American Kenpo that you needed to develop yet another second rate Kenpo offshoot, you've never explained that? As someone who worked first hand with you for many years I'd be interested in why you took such drastic actions and went outside the paradigm of AK. Your pedagogical methods were sound, but as the years went by they declined as your insatiable desire for rank and status increased. Now you've gone completely out of AK for rank, and you certainly are not entitled to wear it as such, but I'm sure you'd disagree. You've made a grave error with this new path, one you will pay for mentally and financially I can assure you.

DarK LorD

 

[kenpomike890]

Second Rate? When you refer to a school as second rate, you are also refering to the students of Professor Jones' as second rate. I find this personally offensive and insulting since you don't know me or my background, as I am a student at the school.

I am just curious, isn't there anything better to do in Kenpo than insulting students at a school, and maybe doing Kenpo training instead?

Just a thought.

 

[KenpoNovice]

"I am just curious, isn't there anything better to do in Kenpo than insulting students at a school, and maybe doing Kenpo training instead?"

Maybe that's a question you should ask Bob?

By the way Mike, you got those answers for me for my post above?

Terry

 

[kenpomike890]

No Terry, That's a question I am asking on here. We don't insult students at other schools, contrary to the false statements made by individuals in this forum.

In answer to the other questions, why would I need to answer them? I wouldn't worry about someone else's credentials and acheivements. I have done enough research and have had things explained to me in detail that they don't warrant further discussion in this forum.

If you are so worried about someone's rank, ask any 8th, 9th, or 10th Black, what Senior Instructor awarded them that rank?

 

[rmcrobertson]

May we ask about your, "research," and what the "detail," was?

 

[kenpomike890]

As I stated, Professor Jones' Academic Credentials and background warrant no further discussion in this forum.

 

[rmcrobertson]

One quite agrees--quod erat demonstrandum est--and was simply inquiring as to sources and methods.

Note to relative novices:

The desire to support one's teacher remains, to be sure, admirable. The question to be asked--and to be asked in all cases--is whether or not such support remains warranted.

When one studies martial arts--or anything else, or enters analysis--there are always dangers. Freud referred to them under the general heading of "transference-love," and identified it as both what Lacan subsequently called, "the direction of the treatment and the principles of its power."

This closely resembles the issue in the martial arts. To train and study, we need a teacher. What's more, we need (and "need," is the right word, connoting as it does both practical necessity and the emotions attendant upon the dialectic situation) to trust that teacher, if for no other reason than that we need to shut up and train as we're told.

On one hand, there have over the years proved to be many people in the martial arts who do not deserve to be trusted--right at the start of kenpo, for example, there's James Mitose. If one is unlucky enough to be their student, one may very well learn, but one can also count upon being taken advantage of.

On the other hand, there have over the years proved to be many people in the martial arts who cannot learn, because they have never figured out the difference between their defense mechanisms and genuine questions. These folks are unlikely to be taken advantage of, but they are also unlikely to learn.

Mostly, though, we end up wobbling between these extremes.

Otherwise, this poster stands by their earlier posts on this thread.

 

[KenpoNovice]

"We don't insult students at other schools, contrary to the false statements made by individuals in this forum."

Really? Bob did it both times I met him. He talked badly about other schools in town, other instructors, and even mentioned a former instructor at his own school! But you've never heard Bob insult anyone, have you Mike?


"I have done enough research and have had things explained to me in detail that they don't warrant further discussion in this forum."

Well great. Like I said before, more power to you. If you feel your "research" was sufficient and your happy with Mr. Jones, then I say the best of luck to you. Keep in mind, I have no problem with someone wanting to run off into Willy Wonka land unmedicated. The problem I have is poor attitude and spreading lies about others. He did it when I met him, when my friend visited him, and any former student of his I have ever met since. If Bob can't stand it, maybe he should stop talking trash about people.


"If you are so worried about someone's rank, ask any 8th, 9th, or 10th Black, what Senior Instructor awarded them that rank?"

Tell you what, I'll answer your question after you get answers for mine from my previous post.

Terry

 

[Dark Kenpo Lord]

As I stated, Professor Jones' Academic Credentials and background warrant no further discussion in this forum.

Other than the second rate thing (which is true nonetheless), you haven't answered my questions of why he took the actions he has. I talk about people all the time, doesn't bother me one iota, and the same is true in the reverse, but slander and libel are something I will not tolerate, and Bob is at rock bottom in that department, and he's going for a jackhammer. I will be in Vegas mid Jan., I hope to see you there when I visit Mike, I will fill you in on the truth should you want to hear it.

DarK LorD

 

[kenpomike890]

The reason I have not answered the questions, is it is not my place to answer your questions about Professor Jones. These are matters to be discussed with him directly.

If you are planning on visiting the studio in January, don't bother. I will be on a business trip at some point during the month of January, as will Professor Jones.

This is a request from Mrs. Jones, who knows of your previous visits with other schools that you have issues with. She has stated that you not come here and cause a disruption.

 

[Dark Kenpo Lord]

The reason I have not answered the questions, is it is not my place to answer your questions about Professor Jones. These are matters to be discussed with him directly.

If you are planning on visiting the studio in January, don't bother. I will be on a business trip at some point during the month of January, as will Professor Jones.

This is a request from Mrs. Jones, who knows of your previous visits with other schools that you have issues with. She has stated that you not come here and cause a disruption.

You know, as much as I love and adore Kris, and hope she manages well thru this whole ordeal, if she hangs on to the anchor, she's gonna sink too, but it is her choice to make. Seems a bit convenient that you'll both be out of town during Jan. ?

DarK LorD

 

[rmcrobertson]

Uh...it's not your, "place," to answer questions, but it is your place to write, "If you are planning on visiting the studio in January, don't bother. I will be on a business trip at some point during the month of January, as will Professor Jones.

This is a request from Mrs. Jones, who knows of your previous visits with other schools that you have issues with. She has stated that you not come here and cause a disruption."

Yes, I'm a friend and training partner of Clyde's. I don't see the whole world the way he does, but I'm still confused as to what the heck's going on.

Otherwise, I stand by my earlier posts.

 

[kenpomike890]

No It is not by convenience. I actually have a job where I will be out of town in January. What Professor is doing has nothing to do with my trip.

 

[Dark Kenpo Lord]

The reason I have not answered the questions, is it is not my place to answer your questions about Professor Jones. These are matters to be discussed with him directly.

If you are planning on visiting the studio in January, don't bother. I will be on a business trip at some point during the month of January, as will Professor Jones.

This is a request from Mrs. Jones, who knows of your previous visits with other schools that you have issues with. She has stated that you not come here and cause a disruption.

Hmm, Bob will be out of town so I won't be able to confront him directly, where does that leave me?

BTW, the other guy I visited was Al Farnsworth, someone Bob insulted all the time, to me and others, I went to his studio and did it to his face. He's dead now of course, water under the bridge.

I'm also looking into having all rank given to Bob, by all previous instructors, revoked. I hear that's a tactic he likes to use for coercion, maybe a brown belt would look good on him, whatdaya think Dennis?

 

[Goldendragon7]

Maybe a brown belt would look good on him, whatdaya think Dennis?

Well, since I didn't promote him to anything...... I am not someone that you need to ask. I know his history first hand (as you already know) and what he does or dosen't do doesn't effect me or my organization one bit.

He is not the first one to take this type of action within the Martial Arts and specifically Kenpo, and I'm sure he won't be the last.

Those that do not realize that they are walking in the dark will never see the light.

:asian:

 

[KenpoNovice]

"I will be on a business trip at some point during the month of January, as will Professor Jones."

For a guy who doesn't speak for Bobby your doing a pretty good job!
Maybe I can play mediator here between you and Dark Kenpo Lord.
Mike what works out better for you and Bob, late December or January. You did say that any problems need to be discussed face-to-face!


"What Professor is doing has nothing to do with my trip."

Maybe Bob's attending school in the U.K.!


"This is a request from Mrs. Jones, who knows of your previous visits with other schools that you have issues with. She has stated that you not come here and cause a disruption."

Now we see the real decision-maker at the school!!!

Doesn't Mr. Jones want to discuss these issues with his former friends and instructors? He did post on this thread a few days ago about his educational background. What happened?!? Bobby, let's set-up a round table discussion so we can speak about these issues like grown-ups. Please ask Kris if it's OK and get back to us.

Always Bowing to your Hobbitness Bob,:asian:
Terry the KenpoNovice

 

[Nick Ellis]

First of all Clyde.... you really must have no life if all you think about from the time you wake up till the time you go to sleep is how to ruin Professor Jones
I will have you know that he doesnt think about you or Larry at all.
and yes when students commit unspeakable acts like going against agreements they signed with the school they get demoted in rank. there have only been 2 students professor has had to do this with and it is also at the approval of the executive board not just him. that is how it was in my old school except my old teacher would do alot worse. he would call them out beat the hell out of them and physically strip them of rank. I have worked hand and hand day in and day out with Professor for about the last year. I see him more than I see my own family. It has been a priviledge and Honor for me to have worked with him. I am glad why prof has done what he did.. the American kenpo community is nothing more than a rotting ses-pool of gossip. Wu shen Pai is about preserving the old ways of honor and integrity. Martial artists who do nothing more than gossip and try to ruin others careers are nothing more than thugs... why is Wu Shen Pai different because we work throws joint locks acupunture and accupressure bone setting Tai chi yang and chang style if you must know and other healing arts. We also teach our students to be respectful and to act with honor. you guys make me sick.. years ago before I even started kenpo I was warned about how you sharks act by my old teacher.

where is the honor in that Clyde.. I don't see it.

there is no way John Sepulveda is going to listen to you or care what you think
and neither is Paul Mills
Philip Porter already gave you his answer..

enough is enough

answer me this your in california and we are in Nevada why should what we do bother you in anyway. if you wanted to run around town in a rainbow colored gi it doesnt effect us. if you wanted to start your own system it doesnt effect us.

ohh and terry kenpo novice if you want to run your mouth then why dont you step in our school and do it. if memory serves me correctly I was there when you were. and you were not highly thought of when you left by any of us that were there that day..

as the new year approaches let bi gones be bi gones worry about your selfs and your training..
peace to all
proud member of the IKKS
Nicholas Ellis MCSE A+

 

[kenpowonderer]

Mr. Ellis, there is no need to insult someone who out ranks you by any means. You know this as well as I do. You and Mr. Jones have asked where I put my loyalties, well here they are. They lie within each of my many many instructors over the years. I have served (And I do mean the word SERVED) all of them with in limits and outside limits of my personal well being. They lie within the ART OF AMERICAN KENPO. So those are my loyalties, I have had enough with everyone in Vegas questioning those.

I have found some people who never will question those, because they have seen what I have done for all of my Instructors. You talk about respect, and honor and integrity where is yours??