Witchcraft Growing Faster Than Religion's Big Three

[Bob Hubbard]

My mother insists I'm Christian, because I was baptized, confirmed, etc. Oh and had top marks in Sunday School.
But I went athiest, agnostic, satanist (Lavey), BOC, Wiccan, Egyptist, Taoist, Buddhist, Shintoist, and Hindu since then.

My current path is a combination of all those I've walked before. I define myself as a Seeker of Knowledge, walking a Pagan path, seeking enlightenment, and hoping for the guidance of the Goddess in all of her forms and faces.

It works for me, but makes it real hard to find someone to officiate a wedding who can do that blending right.


And, lets be blunt....God has to be a woman. A man would have made it sooo much simplier, and used alot more duct tape. :rofl:

 

[elder999]

....God has to be a woman. A man would have used alot more duct tape. :rofl:

What do you think knees are? :lfao:

 

[CoryKS]

And, lets be blunt....God has to be a woman. A man would have made it sooo much simplier, and used alot more duct tape. :rofl:

That would explain random acts of god.

"God, why did you let a tornado destroy my house?"

"Oh, I think you know why I let that tornado destroy your house."

 

[tellner]

My mother insists I'm Christian, because I was baptized, confirmed, etc. Oh and had top marks in Sunday School.
But I went athiest, agnostic, satanist (Lavey), BOC, Wiccan, Egyptist, Taoist, Buddhist, Shintoist, and Hindu since then.

My current path is a combination of all those I've walked before.

Sounds like the JKD approach to spirituality

At first glance the Satanist doesn't seem like it would play well with a theistic Wiccan approach let alone ego-deprecating Buddhist methods. How do you fit those into the same headspace?

It works for me, but makes it real hard to find someone to officiate a wedding who can do that blending right.

Tell me what you want, and I'll come up with a serviceto fit. We can get the install started with:

./configure -deity=ALL -nodeity_opt-TRUE -flags=prayer -prenup=localopt
make husband
make wife
make install

And, lets be blunt....God has to be a woman. A man would have made it sooo much simplier, and used alot more duct tape. :rofl:

Given the evidence I'm inclined to believe She is a beetle.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

Given the evidence I'm inclined to believe She is a beetle.

Ringo, or Paul? The rest are gone, I think. Oh wait, I can check for you.

which beetle
/usr/sbin/beetle
ls -l /usr/sbin/beetle
0 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 10 2008-12-24 16:50 /usr/sbin/beetle -> /bin/paul

Paul.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

ROFLMFAO!!!!
You 2 are too much.

 

[Carol]

Congrats on your semaphor, Bob. Hope it doesn't go to /dev/null :rofl:

 

[exile]

Ringo, or Paul? The rest are gone, I think. Oh wait, I can check for you.

which beetle
/usr/sbin/beetle
ls -l /usr/sbin/beetle
0 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 10 2008-12-24 16:50 /usr/sbin/beetle -> /bin/paul

Paul.

Hey—you use Unix also!

Come in and have a seat... lemme pour you a beer...!

 

[jarrod]

Congrats on your semaphor, Bob. Hope it doesn't go to /dev/null :rofl:

i love it when you talk nerdy to me...

jf

 

[Hand Sword]

If we played out the scenario to its fullest and all 4 of the religions mentioned went to their extremes and the actions that have been associated with that through time.......I say GO WICCA!!!!!

 

[jarrod]

At first glance the Satanist doesn't seem like it would play well with a theistic Wiccan approach let alone ego-deprecating Buddhist methods. How do you fit those into the same headspace?

i wanted to come back to this one since bob & i have explored similar roads it sounds like. from my perspective, ego & all other forms of dualism are illusions. however, we have lessons we can learn from these illusions if we explore them. satanic indulgence of the ego is an indulgence in illusion, but it is still beneficial.

at it's heart, satanism as i understand it is really just a matter of developing the courage to walk your own path. if your own path leads you to seek the obliteration of your own ego, then you can be a satanic buddhist!

jf

 

[Bill Mattocks]

It is easy to misunderstand Satanism, because Satanism misunderstands Satanism.

Taken on the surface, a Satanist would be a follower or devotee of 'Satan', also known as Lucifer or the Devil in most Christian belief systems. And yes, I know that many Satanists and other occultists argue over that. But just go with it for a moment.

Satan was the angel who fought with God and was cast out, to become regent of Hell.

So it would seem clear that Satanists are against God, and in opposition to Christianity. Some Satanist sects do indeed do things that would make it seem so, such as their priests wearing Catholic priestly garb (Roman collar reverse-tabbed) and performing 'Black Masses' where the "Lord's Prayer" is recited backwards, etc. An inverted cross is the sacred symbol of the religion, and a sacrament is desecrating wafers that have been previously consecrated by an actual Catholic priest. That's pretty much anti-Christian.

On the other hand, there are sects of Satanists who see themselves as more followers of Lucifer, the light-bringer, the one who offered Eve something that we all now know and value - knowledge of good and evil. Satan was not the 'bad guy' but was painted that way by Christians, according to these Satanists. Satan was just trying to help humanity and informing us that having Free Will means we must be free to exercise it without fear of Holy reprisal (judgment day), or it isn't really Free Will. Their Satan is just pointing out the lies fed to humanity by the Christian God and His followers.

And then there are members of other cults or religions (take yer pick) such as Astrum Argentum and so on, who embrace and blend the concepts of Satanism with their own, exemplified in England by men who belonged to such organisations as well as The Hellfire Club, people like Oscar Wilde and Aleister Crowley. Many of them take great delight in tweaking the noses of offended Christians, so they'll wear devil costumes, complete with horns and long tails, and such. Most of them don't dislike Christians as much as they kind of pity them, considering them weak-minded dupes or sheep.

When someone tells me that they are a Satanist, I don't really know anything - so much depends on what they mean by it. Satanism covers a lot of territory. What kind of Satanist? What group? What are your core beliefs? And etc.

"Do as though shalt shall be the whole of the law" is the single commandment of Satanism. It is used by Wiccans too - with the "An it harm none" bit stuck to the front of it. Most Pagan religions, however, celebrate Free Will in whatever manner they see it most applicable. This is in distinct contract to religions that put a God or Gods on top, and everything else below that. Satanists celebrate only one Holy Day - your own birthday.

 

[jarrod]

very true. it's always interesting how people can understand the diversity of beliefs in their own faith but often forget that other religions don't follow a single dogma.

jf

 

[Sukerkin]

That (the above few good posts) said and agreed with, it has seemed to me that most of the self-confessed Satanists or Occultists I have met have been nothing of the sort.

They have been akin to the pseudo Ninjerz I have encountered in my martial arts journey - big on pretence and word-fu but low on content.

Because such alternative spiritual paths on the surface seem to promise 'status' without actually having to do very much they do attract more than their fair share of shallow-willed posers.

I'm not saying that they are any worse than a lot of the 'look how HOLY I am' so-called Christians I have also met but it is a point worth considering that a number who adhere themselves to any faith are looking to shore up faults and shortcomings in themselves the 'easy' way or are avoiding having to do any actual critical thinking on moral issues.

For myself, the only religion that has any personal value is probably Buddhism. All others are seeking to draw on the unprovable existence of a great, if hypothetical, external power to enforce compliance and exert their 'will' on the 'unbeliever'.

I like some of the concepts in the neo-Druidic Wiccan-isms but, in much the same way that I choose to acknowledge reincarnation or continued existence after death as energy, that's only because I think it's a nice idea. Doesn't mean it's real for an instant.

EDIT: Okay, there's a wrinkle of falsehood in my last paragraph there. I have personally experienced too much of what is termed Super or Preter-Natural events to dismiss such things lightly. However, my experiences are not proof of such things being real - just that my particular complex bundle of synapses has interpreted certain things in certain ways.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

That (the above few good posts) said and agreed with, it has seemed to me that most of the self-confessed Satanists or Occultists I have met have been nothing of the sort.

They have been akin to the pseudo Ninjerz I have encountered in my martial arts journey - big on pretence and word-fu but low on content.

You just hit the nail on the head. Give that man a seegar!

You got your McCovens. You got your pimple-faced Kobra Kai "High Priest" who only wants to get lucky with an attractive initiate or six. You got your kids slouching around with the "I'm so depressed, look at how depressed I am" clothes and the black nail polish and eye liner and silver pentacles and they're just gonna judy-spell ya. Give ya the evil eye, is what. Eye of newt, toe of frog, and you are in trouble, mister. Trouble.

About the only difference is that the judy-choppers quickly get sorted out. The judy-spellers don't face any comeuppance from someone who can actually twist a spiritual knot in their tail. Or do they?

 

[Andy Moynihan]

You just hit the nail on the head. Give that man a seegar!

You got your McCovens. You got your pimple-faced Kobra Kai "High Priest" who only wants to get lucky with an attractive initiate or six. You got your kids slouching around with the "I'm so depressed, look at how depressed I am" clothes and the black nail polish and eye liner and silver pentacles and they're just gonna judy-spell ya. Give ya the evil eye, is what. Eye of newt, toe of frog, and you are in trouble, mister. Trouble.

About the only difference is that the judy-choppers quickly get sorted out. The judy-spellers don't face any comeuppance from someone who can actually twist a spiritual knot in their tail. Or do they?

Bill,

You sometimes have the absolute best way of putting things

 

[jarrod]

sukerkin is correct. however i think it's fair to say that many of those who hold pagan or satanic beliefs may not co around advertising it. much like some of the best christians don't make a big outward display of their faith.

jf

 

[Sukerkin]

Exactly so, Jarrod.

I have indeed met a few people over the years, who tread the alternate roads, whose beliefs I only discovered by chance. The phrase "You wouldn't know it to look at them" holds true for many who have deeply held convictions.

This also holds true for more 'mainstream' orthodoxy. The best Christians I have ever met are those who just get on with living their lives by the principles they hold dear.

As I have said before, the core philosophical princple, a la "Bill and Ted", of "Be excellent to each other" is hard to beat, whatever 'clothes' it comes dressed in.

 

[jarrod]

As I have said before, the core philosophical princple, a la "Bill and Ted", of "Be excellent to each other" is hard to beat, whatever 'clothes' it comes dressed in.

wow, lot's of "nail on the head" comments flying around here. well said, sir.

jf

 

[exile]

On the other hand, there are sects of Satanists who see themselves as more followers of Lucifer, the light-bringer, the one who offered Eve something that we all now know and value - knowledge of good and evil.

So, it's Satan playing the role that Prometheus played in ancient Olympian religious belief—defying the all-powerful sky god to bring the benefits of knowledge (the technology of fire, in poor old Prometheus's case) to shivering humanity. And savagely punished for it as well. The difference was that Prometheus was eventually freed from his torment by Heracles; no such eventual liberation shows up in Christian theology for Lucifer, so far as I'm aware... but the other parallels are very suggestive. The later versions of the Prometheus myth, for example, explicitly identify a broad range of knowledge as the distinctive contribution made by Prometheus to human development, and the essence of his transgression against Zeus (who comes off as a kind of angry, overbearing tyrant, compared to the Titan). And knowledge was what it was all about in the Genesis story, eh?