What is NOT being talked about in regards to the Duck Dynasty controversy

[Rumy73]

You need a hug.
But everything I said was correct. You can't defeat the point so you resort to name calling.
The point being religious leaders of the time started the movement to end slavery. Of course it started small all change starts small and grows from there.

Yes, I will take a hug and you can take some college history classes.

 

[ballen0351]

Yes, I will take a hug and you can take some college history classes.

Perhaps you need to come with me

http://www.ctlibrary.com/ch/1992/issue33/3321.html

 

[Rumy73]

Perhaps you need to come with me

http://www.ctlibrary.com/ch/1992/issue33/3321.html[/

You really do not get it. I did not expect you to understand. You never went through the rigors of learning analysis and demonstrating a written intellectual argument. I described you as ignorant, not because I was making a personal attack; rather, I said so, as you never had the concentrated experience of weighing information, contextualizing it and making a written argument. This is the heart of academics. All of this will remain invisible and meaningless if you continue to embrace ignorance; however, your life and mind will be immensely enhanced even by attending community college.

 

[ballen0351]

Perhaps you need to come with me

http://www.ctlibrary.com/ch/1992/issue33/3321.html[/

You really do not get it. I did not expect you to understand. You never went through the rigors of learning analysis and demonstrating a written intellectual argument. I described you as ignorant, not because I was making a personal attack; rather, I said so, as you never had the concentrated experience of weighing information, contextualizing it and making a written argument. This is the heart of academics. All of this will remain invisible and meaningless if you continue to embrace ignorance; however, your life and mind will be immensely enhanced even by attending community college.

So again you can't touch my point so instead of debating the issue you take shots at me

 

[Rumy73]

So again you can't touch my point so instead of debating the issue you take shots at me

I addressed the point. I am speaking in a non-mean spirited way. You know, ppl in the USMC will say: ppl cannot understand what it means to be a Marine. I do not take offense from this, likewise you should not take offense.

 

[ballen0351]

I addressed the point. I am speaking in a non-mean spirited way. You know, ppl in the USMC will say: ppl cannot understand what it means to be a Marine. I do not take offense from this, likewise you should not take offense.

You have yet to prove my point wrong. And newsflash I have taken many college classes I said I don't have a degree. I've attended numerous classes at Johns Hopkins University public safety leadership program. I had to stop when I went undercover because my schedule changed too much. I've also attended classes at Costal Carolina University when I was in the Marine Corps. So again why not get back to the topic and not my personal life. So again my point still stands many of the people leading the fight against slavery were religious leaders.

 

[The Last Legionary]

 

[Master Dan]

Just want to give another point not discussed in all this. I listened to a talk or sermon if you like that the Duck Dynasty gave at church and he was quoting scripture and he seemed more concerned with general infidelity outside the marriage and then also did hit on the OT related to what he thought was condemnation of Gays? On an interesting note I think A&E made a mistake taking such action to pull him because if you look at the listener base of the show they are not LGBT audience and say nothing in general as a rule against them except not wanting to wear certain clothing items. Some retailers even reacted by pulling products and customers complained to have them put back in the stores and sales have increase over 25% since the controversy.

With regards to religion my church I will not mention has a proclamation of the family they feel is important but at the same time councils non judgment or hate of any person or group and that every person has free agency and their decisions are between them and god and we should mind our own business. I do wonder about those who feel they were born gay or Trans Gender how can they be blamed for something that seems to be they were born with I see nothing in Christ's talks that would have caused him to condemn them as a general group?? In our state we had some kind of City ordinance that dealt with veterans but tagged on an anti discrimination section related to LGBT people and some churches got very hostile and organized with red shirts and such very hateful even violent. The bill passed and nobody in the last three years has been the worse for it.

Getting back to slavery my church had a section from the 1800's related to sharing the gospel that it should not be done to anyone who was a slave to make them upset or unwilling to serve their master or to cause public unrest, I found that offensive but this was pre civil war and our church has always tried to be non political and believed in supporting the law of the land??

Don't beat me up on the accurate number but pre civil war the United States net worth some where around 3 trillion dollars was in major part based on owning slaves as an asset. I had no idea?

 

[ballen0351]

Just want to give another point not discussed in all this. I listened to a talk or sermon if you like that the Duck Dynasty gave at church and he was quoting scripture and he seemed more concerned with general infidelity outside the marriage and then also did hit on the OT related to what he thought was condemnation of Gays?

Right and if people look at what he actually said in the GQ article Gays were only one part of what we mentioned but it seems to be the only part getting play. I guess the cheating husbands and wives are too worried about getting caught to be "outraged"

 

[Big Don]

Getting back to slavery my church had a section from the 1800's related to sharing the gospel that it should not be done to anyone who was a slave to make them upset or unwilling to serve their master or to cause public unrest, I found that offensive but this was pre civil war and our church has always tried to be non political and believed in supporting the law of the land??

Excuse me, but, how friggin old are you claiming to be?

 

[Steve]

“Our culture has accepted two huge lies. The first is that if you disagree with someone’s lifestyle, you must fear or hate them. The second is that to love someone means you agree with everything they believe or do. Both are nonsense. You don’t have to compromise convictions to be compassionate.” -Rick Warren

....or that you are a bigot......

Better make sure billc see that.

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[Master Dan]

Excuse me, but, how friggin old are you claiming to be?

Its the proclamation document that was 1800's can't say exact year don't have in front of me right now but your right maybe I am friggin old

 

[Coker101]

For those of you who don't know anything about this, here's the skinny. One of the members of A&Es popular Duck Dynasty program gave an interview to GQ magazine. In the interview, the interviewee made several anti-gay comments that were religious based and were offensive to a large segment of the population. Now, there is a media circus surrounding this and stores across the country are pulling Duck Dynasty products off the shelves in fear of boycotts and other bad press.

Here is what is NOT being talked about by the media though.

Phil Robertson made comments that a lot of people find highly offensive. These comments are based in scripture. Here are some examples.

http://www.openbible.info/topics/homosexuality



It's pretty clear that Phil Robertson IS repeating a CLEAR prohibition in the Bible. And according to believers, the Bible is the divinely inspired word of God. Therefore, if society and the media finds what Phil Robertson said offensive, they are actually saying that the Christian Scripture and the Christian God is offensive. I find it very interesting that society is piling on Phil Robertson right now and refusing to open this door and acknowledge the source of what it finds offensive.

Christianity, the Christian God, and the Bible is the root of the offensiveness that is causing this media circus. This is what is NOT being talked about. It's far easier to talk about how big of a bigot Phil Robertson is...rather than talking about why he is a bigot in the first place.

There is no "problem". He is free to believe and say whatever he likes. I mean we have rap songs bragging about killing people and selling crack all kinds of other stuff but we are supposed to be more offended because he's quoting the Bible about gay acts being a sin?

The media in general is so far left that ANYTHING gay related gets turned into a crazy fiasco. I mean half the anchors on CNN are openly gay and it's almost all they talk about.

And you know, being a Christian myself I support what he said and his option to say what he likes. What's your answer for this so called "problem"? We should be like communist China and take away everyone's rights to worship as they like?

I have a gay sister who I love very much and I don't judge her...it's not my place. Everyone is free to live the way they like but I don't support the gay life style or gay marriage. If you want to believe I'm a bigot for supporting the Bible, knock yourself out. I don't care what you, CNN or anyone else might think.

Just kills me how people are all about freedom of speech...then they hear something they don't like and "OMG that's so offensive". I hate violent rap music with a passion and find songs about killing people, selling drugs and screwing hoes to be a whole lot worse than someone quoting the Bible about gay people going to hell. But I know....that's just not PC enough for America these days.

 

[Coker101]

The Christian God declared homosexuality as an abomination. Abominations are to be put to death. God specifically KILLS homosexuals.

Wouldn't a true Christian obey all of Gods divinely inspired word?

God does not tell anyone to kill gay people though. In fact Christ tells everyone to love people who sin. And Jesus said "all sin can be forgiven"....gay actions being just one of may things that can cause you to not be saved at the end of your life if you're not trusting in Christ for forgiveness. You say "God specifically KILLS homosexuals".....he says the same thing about all sin not just living a gay lifestyle.

If you don't believe in God then how does this matter?

And out of curiously if a gay person said that straight people were going to hell would anyone care?

 

[Steve]

There is no "problem". He is free to believe and say whatever he likes. I mean we have rap songs bragging about killing people and selling crack all kinds of other stuff but we are supposed to be more offended because he's quoting the Bible about gay acts being a sin?

The media in general is so far left that ANYTHING gay related gets turned into a crazy fiasco. I mean half the anchors on CNN are openly gay and it's almost all they talk about.

And you know, being a Christian myself I support what he said and his option to say what he likes. What's your answer for this so called "problem"? We should be like communist China and take away everyone's rights to worship as they like?

I have a gay sister who I love very much and I don't judge her...it's not my place. Everyone is free to live the way they like but I don't support the gay life style or gay marriage. If you want to believe I'm a bigot for supporting the Bible, knock yourself out. I don't care what you, CNN or anyone else might think.

Just kills me how people are all about freedom of speech...then they hear something they don't like and "OMG that's so offensive". I hate violent rap music with a passion and find songs about killing people, selling drugs and screwing hoes to be a whole lot worse than someone quoting the Bible about gay people going to hell. But I know....that's just not PC enough for America these days.

Freedom of speech doesn't mean you can say what you want without any potential repercussion. This guy clearly hasn't broken any laws. This is simply a situation where he said some things and there were consequences. The first amendment is irrelevant to this situation. It just doesn't apply, and it's clear from your post that you're caught up in the political rhetoric.

The network is making a business decision. That's what this is. Not a lefty/righty issue. Not a media issue. It's about a company assessing whether this guy is going to make them more money than he will cost them. Is his inflammatory behavior quirky, trendy and lucrative? Or is it offensive and costly? Often, the decision is arbitrary.

Bottom line, this is an employee/employer decision. And, as a conservative, aren't you glad that the employer has the right to suspend or terminate an employee? I am.

 

[Coker101]

Freedom of speech doesn't mean you can say what you want without any potential repercussion. This guy clearly hasn't broken any laws. This is simply a situation where he said some things and there were consequences. The first amendment is irrelevant to this situation. It just doesn't apply, and it's clear from your post that you're caught up in the political rhetoric.

The network is making a business decision. That's what this is. Not a lefty/righty issue. Not a media issue. It's about a company assessing whether this guy is going to make them more money than he will cost them. Is his inflammatory behavior quirky, trendy and lucrative? Or is it offensive and costly? Often, the decision is arbitrary.

Bottom line, this is an employee/employer decision. And, as a conservative, aren't you glad that the employer has the right to suspend or terminate an employee? I am.

I agree with everything you're saying. They have the right to can him if they like just like he's free to say what he likes...I never argued that. If I were him I would expect that the station would be having a fit and that I might get fired. I'm not even sure where you're coming from with your reply as I never said anything about The first amendment.

My issue with the original post is saying that someone is a bigot for believing in or quoting the Bible. And the whole "God want's to kill gay people" comment is just so absurd. And the fact that he almost sounds like he would ban The Bible if he could because you know, Christians are so terrible and all.

 

[Steve]

I agree with everything you're saying. They have the right to can him if they like just like he's free to say what he likes...I never argued that. If I were him I would expect that the station would be having a fit and that I might get fired. I'm not even sure where you're coming from with your reply as I never said anything about The first amendment.

when you referred to freedom of speech, you weren't referencing the first amendment?

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[Bob Hubbard]

The 1st Amendment has nothing to do with a private business (A&E) censoring an employee (Mr Ducky).

 

[Coker101]

when you referred to freedom of speech, you weren't referencing the first amendment?

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I was not suggesting that the station was wrong in their decision or that what they were doing was somehow an attack on his freedom of speech. That was not my point at all and I think they were doing whatever benefited their station and that is exactly what I would have expected them to do in this ridiculous politically correct society we live in.

When I was referring to the freedom of speech I was not speaking about Duck Dynasty, I was talking about the original posters attack on the Duck Dynasty guys beliefs or more so calling him a bigot for quoting the Bible. Sure he's free to call the Duck Dynasty guy whatever he likes but it's a bit hypocritical in my opinion. It's the "think the way I think or you're a closed minded bigot". Who's the one that's not being tolerant here? Is it the guy who quoted the Bible or the guy calling him a bigot, blaming most bigotry on Christianity and acting like he would like to eradicate the Bible all together? Besides there are so many other things said that are so much worse (like the rap music I mentioned earlier) than quoting the Bible about gay people...besides if you don't believe in the Bible why would this effect you anyway?

And again the media has this same attitude...if you don't support gay mirage you're automatically labeled a bigot...and yes I have heard that exact statement on CNN more than once. So yeah it's the whole believe what we/the media/popular society/Hollywood believes and if you don't then you're a terrible person. I don't support gay marriage but I don't go around saying gay people are terrible people. That's not my place to judge people....there is a difference between not supporting something and being a bigot.

You know, I knew I should not have come in here....I like the MT forums and want to continue to come here w/o drama. So I likely will make this my last post on this subject....if I can resist.

 

[Steve]

I was not suggesting that the station was wrong in their decision or that what they were doing was somehow an attack on his freedom of speech. That was not my point at all and I think they were doing whatever benefited their station and that is exactly what I would have expected them to do in this ridiculous politically correct society we live in.

How politically correct can our society be if people are listening to rap songs about drug use and having gratuitous sex with promiscuous women (with big butts)? You're ranting about political correctness even as you give an example of something that isn't PC. Giving some mixed signals here. Just as you're ranting about freedom of speech and then suggesting that your point isn't about freedom of speech. I'm just trying to follow you.

My personal opinion is that whenever someone starts going on about political correctness, it usually boils down to, "You guys aren't offended by the things that I find offensive and it makes me sad." You're offended by rap music. Fine. Knock yourself out. Other people are offended by this guy.

When I was referring to the freedom of speech I was not speaking about Duck Dynasty, I was talking about the original posters attack on the Duck Dynasty guys beliefs or more so calling him a bigot for quoting the Bible.

The guy on Duck Dynasty's freedom of speech was in no way impinged by Malakalumu's voicing of his own opinions.

Sure he's free to call the Duck Dynasty guy whatever he likes but it's a bit hypocritical in my opinion. It's the "think the way I think or you're a closed minded bigot".

Well, I don't know. Bigotry is actually pretty easy to identify objectively.

Who's the one that's not being tolerant here? Is it the guy who quoted the Bible or the guy calling him a bigot, blaming most bigotry on Christianity and acting like he would like to eradicate the Bible all together? Besides there are so many other things said that are so much worse (like the rap music I mentioned earlier) than quoting the Bible about gay people...besides if you don't believe in the Bible why would this effect you anyway?

LOL. Again with the rap music. So, are you going to own up to your own hypocrisy? For what it's worth, I think you're perfectly entitled to have whatever opinion about rap music you want, even if you're doing exactly the same thing to an entire genre of music that you're accusing the OP of doing to your religion.

And again the media has this same attitude...if you don't support gay mirage you're automatically labeled a bigot...and yes I have heard that exact statement on CNN more than once. So yeah it's the whole believe what we/the media/popular society/Hollywood believes and if you don't then you're a terrible person. I don't support gay marriage but I don't go around saying gay people are terrible people. That's not my place to judge people....there is a difference between not supporting something and being a bigot.

Which media? Do you mean Fox News? Or the Wall Street Journal? Or Breitbart, Drudge, or... Oh... wait. You mean the media you DON'T like... I get it...

You know, I knew I should not have come in here....I like the MT forums and want to continue to come here w/o drama. So I likely will make this my last post on this subject....if I can resist.

Might be a good idea. I get fed up in the Study fairly often and take frequent breaks.