The socratic method and socialism

[billc]

Here is one for all of my fans on Martialtalk. This article is from someone who has lived inside the soviet system and the United States and some questions that occurred to him as he was being ridiculed at a book signing.

http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/question-insanity-what-to-ask-progressives/

Here are some of his questions:

If all cultures are equal, why doesn’t UNESCO organize International Cannibalism Week festivals?
Why do those demanding “equal pay for equal work” never protest against “equal pay for little or no work”?
Why has no politician ever run on men’s issues or promised to improve the lives of males?
If all beliefs are equally valid, how come my belief in the absurdity of this maxim gets rejected by its proponents?
Ever noticed that for the past thirty years, we’ve been hearing we have less than ten years to save the planet

 

[billc]

more questions from the article:

Why weren’t there demonstrations with anti-feudal slogans under feudal rule? And under Stalin, no anti-communist demonstrations? And under Hitler, no anti-fascist demonstrations? In a free capitalist society, anti-capitalist demonstrations are commonplace. Is capitalism really the worst system?
If capitalism makes some people rich without making others poor, who will benefit when capitalism is destroyed?
If the poor in America have things that people in other countries can only dream about, why is there a movement to make America more like those other countries?
Why, on the rare occasions when Obama’s actions benefit America, does his base get angry? And every time his actions are hurting this nation, his base is happy? Who exactly are these people?
If cutting out the middleman lowers the price, why are we paying the government to stand between us and the markets?

 

[Ken Morgan]

Anyone who wants a pure form of Capitalism is an idiot, just as anyone who wants a pure form of socialism is equally an idiot. These are idealistic, academic concepts, much more useful in a university lecture hall then in the real world.

 

[jks9199]

Here is one for all of my fans on Martialtalk. This article is from someone who has lived inside the soviet system and the United States and some questions that occurred to him as he was being ridiculed at a book signing.

http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/question-insanity-what-to-ask-progressives/

Here are some of his questions:

If all cultures are equal, why doesn’t UNESCO organize International Cannibalism Week festivals?

They keep trying. For some reason, the party planners they keep sending stop returning calls...

Why do those demanding “equal pay for equal work” never protest against “equal pay for little or no work”?

They would -- but they can't get the people receiving equal pay for little work to actually come into the office and do anything.

Why has no politician ever run on men’s issues or promised to improve the lives of males?

Because there's little to do to improve the awesomeness of a real man's life.

If all beliefs are equally valid, how come my belief in the absurdity of this maxim gets rejected by its proponents?

Because they have the right to believe that your belief is every bit as absurd as you believe ours is...

Ever noticed that for the past thirty years, we’ve been hearing we have less than ten years to save the planet

But whose years are we using? And when do they start?

 

[Cryozombie]

Anyone who wants a pure form of Capitalism is an idiot, just as anyone who wants a pure form of socialism is equally an idiot. These are idealistic, academic concepts, much more useful in a university lecture hall then in the real world.

BUT... many if not most of the Pure socialists I have spoken to both online and at Rallies are College Students, or Ivory Tower Intellectuals... and all they KNOW is the university lecture hall, so they believe in that ********.

 

[Ken Morgan]

all they KNOW is the university lecture hall, so they believe in that ********.

LOL....and THAT is the problem.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

College students and tenured professors, neither of whom have to produce to remain funded. Both tend to lean towards the 'help themselves to everyones wallets and save the rainbows' ideals. Dunno if that was Socrate's method. I do believe there was arsenic involved somewhere though.

 

[granfire]

College students and tenured professors, neither of whom have to produce to remain funded. Both tend to lean towards the 'help themselves to everyones wallets and save the rainbows' ideals. Dunno if that was Socrate's method. I do believe there was arsenic involved somewhere though.

Hemlock

 

[Empty Hands]

College students and tenured professors, neither of whom have to produce to remain funded.

College students do produce - they pay the tuition to keep the system running, remember? They are the customers. As for professors, you don't know a damn thing about them if you think that. Funding is incredibly competitive, and not even a good research and publication record is any guarantee. Competitive renewal rates to the NIH are below 10%, and even well established researchers are losing grants left and right. Academia is not a life of ease.

More facts, less rhetoric and resentment!

 

[Bob Hubbard]

My interaction with college professors consists of my advisor in college telling me BASIC was the future (all 11 commands worth), that this "Internet" thing was a fad, and that no one will ever make money on computer games. That and arguing with a former member here who is a card carrying liberal all in favor of Pelosi's vision for Amerika. So, yeah, I might be skewed a bit. I admit it.

 

[Empty Hands]

My interaction with college professors consists of my advisor in college telling me BASIC was the future (all 11 commands worth), that this "Internet" thing was a fad, and that no one will ever make money on computer games. That and arguing with a former member here who is a card carrying liberal all in favor of Pelosi's vision for Amerika. So, yeah, I might be skewed a bit. I admit it.

What does any of that even have to do with productivity, which was your critique?

Academia is one of the most competitive and cutthroat arenas in our society. The whole "lay around all day and talk about Marx" critique is just so much ********, made for a ideological purpose, with no evidence or experience to back it up. As for Arnisador, whom I assume you are referring to, he was a math professor - which has nothing to do with politics, Pelosi or anything else. Your criticism mainly just comes across like resentment.

Oh, and the "BASIC is the future" guy? "640K should be enough for anybody." - Bill Gates. Bill Gates is a leftist lazy college professor?

 

[Bob Hubbard]

My experience is that college kids are great for beating drums of causes that spend other peoples money, and that college professors buy into political causes of the same vein. Not that they taught it, just that they tend to push liberal ideology. As to Arni, he's still a math professor...and a liberal.

As to the BASIC guy, wasn't Gates. Was a professor in a WNY college whose name is currently escaping me.

Me, I'll go pull a pint of hemlock chai with a side of whipped resentment, and bow out.
:asian:

 

[granfire]

College students do produce - they pay the tuition to keep the system running, remember? They are the customers. As for professors, you don't know a damn thing about them if you think that. Funding is incredibly competitive, and not even a good research and publication record is any guarantee. Competitive renewal rates to the NIH are below 10%, and even well established researchers are losing grants left and right. Academia is not a life of ease.

More facts, less rhetoric and resentment!

They are paying/powering a Perpetuum Mobile....

Unless they are flipping burgers at the arches...nope, no real production of anything really tangible.

 

[Empty Hands]

Unless they are flipping burgers at the arches...nope, no real production of anything really tangible.

The money they pay is a marker for either their past or future (if borrowed) productivity. Nothing comes free.

Is tangibility the only marker of productivity or value? Does a stock broker produce? Does a writer produce? What about a lawyer or an accountant? None of them produces anything tangible, yet they are productive and what they produce has value.

The academic enterprise produces the only thing with lasting value - knowledge. Those burgers are eaten and forgotten in a matter of minutes, that car will eventually rust and decay, every doctor's patient will eventually die. Knowledge however has the potential to remain in our collective memories and to our collective benefit for as long as we last as a species. Where would we be now without science and technology and the knowledge that led to them? What could be more enduring than understanding how the Universe works or our place in it?

Education and knowledge is the key to our future, and academia is where that comes from. Denigrate it at your peril. The US is already finding out what happens on the economic world stage when education is ignored. All of those countries who are beating us by miles with their educational systems will surpass us. Only a matter of time.

Sad to see so many denigrate education, learning, knowledge and research.

 

[billc]

Just yesterday, on a local radio program, Don Wade and Roma, with Bruce Wolf and Dan Proft filling in, they discussed the fact that a Ph.D. is now worth less money than many masters degrees. They pointed out that there were over 100,000 new Ph.D's and only 16,000 new professorships available. This fact alone should have helped reduce the price of education. Education inflation is going to get a lot of attention in the next few years. there is no reason a college degree needs to cost as much as it does, especially in fields that will not produce good jobs, like women's studies degrees and art degrees. I stand ready to be attacked.

 

[granfire]

The money they pay is a marker for either their past or future (if borrowed) productivity. Nothing comes free.

Is tangibility the only marker of productivity or value? Does a stock broker produce? Does a writer produce? What about a lawyer or an accountant? None of them produces anything tangible, yet they are productive and what they produce has value.

The academic enterprise produces the only thing with lasting value - knowledge. Those burgers are eaten and forgotten in a matter of minutes, that car will eventually rust and decay, every doctor's patient will eventually die. Knowledge however has the potential to remain in our collective memories and to our collective benefit for as long as we last as a species. Where would we be now without science and technology and the knowledge that led to them? What could be more enduring than understanding how the Universe works or our place in it?

Education and knowledge is the key to our future, and academia is where that comes from. Denigrate it at your peril. The US is already finding out what happens on the economic world stage when education is ignored. All of those countries who are beating us by miles with their educational systems will surpass us. Only a matter of time.

Sad to see so many denigrate education, learning, knowledge and research.

True, a burger will be eaten and - hopefully - be forgotten withing a couple of hours. but much of the theoretical parts of academia are pull ups of the mind. An exercise in futility if you will. Eventually some of that what was learned in college will seep through and be forged by real life.
I am not knocking academia, but having been enrolled in business at one time in a distant life, the 'let's assume' as the base for an universal model is pretty damn scary.

There were professors that seemed to have their feed on the ground, others their heads in the clouds.

Point is though, that you don't take the word of people with no life experience, like students, or professors who have never seen anything but the inside of the ivory tower for more than that. Because in the end it's easy to proclaim the extreme when you forget that the world is not black and white, but shades of gray!