The official "Bujinkan use of ASP" thread

Grey Eyed Bandit

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It so happens that I work as a security guard, for a small company specializing in loss prevention. Basically this means I get to walk around various stores in civilian clothing, catch shoplifters, inspect employees's bags as they leave for home and make sure nobody's providing alcohol to minors. My current work loadout includes a roughly 20 inch baton (rubber with a steel core) which I carry vertically tip-up on my left side in a custom made shoulder holster, Hatch gloves, and a bullet-resistant vest I usually only carry in one particular area of town.

In september though, I'll go through a certification course that'll allow me to carry a 21 inch expandable as well, and possibly handcuffs as well. Fortunately, having looked through our intervention archives, it seems like only two of our people (both of them women, interestingly enough) have had to use violence to subdue perps for the last year and a half. Nevertheless, as we all know it's better to have and not need than to need and not have.
I own two ASPs already and I'm currently experimenting with methods of carry. So far, a cross draw from a left side rotating holster carry is the method that seems the most comfortable to me. Either that, or tip-up carry in my right back pocket if I for whatever reason don't have a sheath available.

As for usage, even with my current baton, I'm only allowed to target the arms and legs and will probably face severe legal repercussions if I hit anything else. That by the way is the problem with most ASP instructional material available today, all those cool chokes and fight-stopping targets are off-limits for actual use, at least when used in the line of duty as is the case with me.

Comment away, ladies and gentlemen.
 

HKphooey

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I am very surprised your employer lets you carry a baton. Back in college, I worked LP for Lord & Taylor. We would be fired on the spot for carrying any weapons.

But in any case, handcuffs can be just as effective as a weapon. :)
 

shesulsa

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Certified in ASP 1 here.

In Washington state, you're allowed to attack the offending appendage, so if your perp has any kind of hand-held weapon, you can use the asp on the appendage carrying the weapon. We train to target center of mass.

How you extend and re-close your EB is important based on the confrontation.

Which is the more comfortable draw for you and why, Nimravus?

Also curious if Booj shows joint lock/pressure point combos you can use while the EB is not extended. Thanks.
 
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Grey Eyed Bandit

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I prefer a cross draw from a left side carry as stated before. Mainly because both the velcro and the plastic sheath are tight enough to make a draw from tip-up carry stiff and jerky. Also, a left side cross draw enables me to relatively quickly produce the baton at a sideways position across my left chest (which seems far less threatening and offensive than the classical "caveman" chambering position, while at the same time positioning it for both vertical, diagonal and horizontal strikes), as well as hit the attacker's front arm or leg at the same time as the baton is extended.
 

Don Roley

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Luke Molitor is the guy who I would reccomend talking to about the matter. He is qualified in it's use as well as being a very skilled Bujinkan teacher.

I have one as well, given to me by him. Nagase and I both have played with them and found ways to incorperate taijutsu into their use. But I still tend to think of what I do as being a work in progress.
 

Bigshadow

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First, I will admit I don't use an asp but I do program in ASP (I had to read the thread as I thought it meant Active Server Pages, I am such a geek :rofl:). However, I have held one and messed around with it. It was a collapsable baton that belonged to a LEO who was training with us at the time. It seems to me that it can be used in many ways, open or closed. I can see it used to pinch skin on grabs, pressed in between the bones of the hands on gyakus, and of course the more obvious strikes to the hands, wrists, inside of the arms, etc.
 

green meanie

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shesulsa said:
Certified in ASP 1 here.

Very cool. Can you tell me more about this? How & where can one go to get ASP certified? You are ASP 1 Certified? How many levels are there and what do the different levels involve? Thanks! :)
 

Blotan Hunka

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green meanie said:
Very cool. Can you tell me more about this? How & where can one go to get ASP certified? You are ASP 1 Certified? How many levels are there and what do the different levels involve? Thanks! :)

If its like martial arts probably as many levels as you want as long as you keep paying.
 

shesulsa

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green meanie said:
Very cool. Can you tell me more about this? How & where can one go to get ASP certified? You are ASP 1 Certified? How many levels are there and what do the different levels involve? Thanks! :)
I should say, rather, I'm certified in Extendable Baton, I.

My teacher is certified to instruct EB and the program is, I believe, separated into basic, intermediate, advanced and instructional. At the time I was going to go for intermediate I started training for my black belt test and honestly just haven't made the time to pick it back up.

I learned some basics of drawing, retracting, different kinds of EBs, some state laws governing the carriage and usage by whom, basic strikes both extended and retracted, etcetera.

Since the retracted EB simulates a short wood stick we use in training, I also already know how to use it to aid in joint locks and pressure points and I'm guessing :) that this is part of the intermediate program. I'll have to talk to my instructor about his intermediate and advanced programs.

Where can you get certified? Hmm. I would start asking people who carry them and who teach EB if they are certified to instruct, by whom and if you can get certified as well.
 

Don Roley

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Nimravus,
You show up to Japan from time to time, right?

Give me some advanced warning before your next trip and I will talk to Nagase. I will explain that you carry an ASP for your work and would like to know how to use it within the legal situation you have. He has one, I have two and if you bring yours we could have a little class on their use. I could meet up with you beforehand and show you some stuff so that he can spend less time introducing info and more time fine tuning the moves.
 

Kreth

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Don Roley said:
Nimravus,
You show up to Japan from time to time, right?

Give me some advanced warning before your next trip and I will talk to Nagase. I will explain that you carry an ASP for your work and would like to know how to use it within the legal situation you have. He has one, I have two and if you bring yours we could have a little class on their use. I could meet up with you beforehand and show you some stuff so that he can spend less time introducing info and more time fine tuning the moves.
Is it legal to bring an ASP into Japan?
 

Carol

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Andy Moynihan said:
No civilian use of ASPs here, I'm afraid.

That's something I can't follow the logic of.

I can carry a gun, but not an ASP. Does anyone know how that works?:idunno:

In our state? You have an understanding chief (or armorer), otherwise you may not be packing at all ;)
 
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Grey Eyed Bandit

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Kreth said:
Is it legal to bring an ASP into Japan?

My thoughts exactly. However, I did manage to get a balisong OUT of Japan last time...

Funny though, I busted a long-time drug abuser trying to steal a bottle of Smirnoff today. If all junkies keep being that compliant, I doubt I'll ever have to use a baton...
 

Brian R. VanCise

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The ASP is an excellent tool. I enjoy using mine for striking as well as joint locking techniques. While I am not to sure you can bring one into
Japan. You can probably buy one there and bring it out of the country.

Then again, when I went to Japan last I brought in all kinds of sticks, booken, fukuro shinai, kunai, training rope and nobody paid the slightest bit of attention to them. :ultracool

Don, when I get to Japan next I would love to see you or Nagase demonstate how you work with the ASP. Heck if and when you make it back to the states look me up and we can have you up for a seminar.

Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com
 

Dale Seago

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Nimravus said:
However, I did manage to get a balisong OUT of Japan last time...

Aye, and years ago I brought a custom 14-inch-bladed Scottish dirk out of Japan without getting caught, after realizing I shouldn't have brought it in in the first place. Don Roley will remember that one. Now I content myself with a sgian dubh. . .
 
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