The luck aggression principle

skribs

Grandmaster
Joined
Nov 14, 2013
Messages
6,615
Reaction score
2,026
He never did. His father complained to the head instructor who he was friends with that his poor little boy didn’t appreciate being pushed so hard.
With the exception of a couple of white belts, most of the time parents complained because we weren't hard enough on their kids. Those white belts with the helicopter moms never made it past the 2-week trial.
 

GojuTommy

Brown Belt
Joined
Jun 18, 2018
Messages
453
Reaction score
171
With the exception of a couple of white belts, most of the time parents complained because we weren't hard enough on their kids. Those white belts with the helicopter moms never made it past the 2-week trial.
Yeah I got chewed out, part of the reason I left.
 

GojuTommy

Brown Belt
Joined
Jun 18, 2018
Messages
453
Reaction score
171
I am familiar with it.

It's stretching the definition of "study" to apply it to that bit of creative (and likely fictional) writing. Other WWII historians (notably Leinbaugh) have pointed out good reasons to think Marshall may have made it up entirely. Sort of like the British Dr who published the "study" showing a link between vaccines and autism.

Additionally, that "study" does nothing to support your claim; it does not even pretend to address the motivations of those who supposedly did not fire. Was it an unwillingness to hurt someone, or a few of being hurt? That is one of the more damning omissions from the work. I find it inconceivable that if you were interviewing a solder, and they said they had not fired as they were trained, your very next question would be "why not?".
That’s not really how studies/research works.
You don’t just endlessly ask questions.

You have 1 major question, and you ask that question.
The question of why would need to be a follow on study to find out generally why.
 

Oily Dragon

Senior Master
Joined
May 2, 2020
Messages
2,405
Reaction score
1,183
Oh my, the level of expertise being displayed here...definitely a black belt in something, with an ego that big.

Goju, seriously buddy you're going on my mute list. Anybody claiming to be an expert in both martial arts and "research" is not going to be useful long term. You're here to lecture others, not discuss or learn.

Sorry pal, your dime is up with me. Reporting you for trolling didn't work, but this will.
 

Jared Traveler

Black Belt
Joined
Jul 17, 2022
Messages
629
Reaction score
273
Actually, that is quite precisely how research works.
I must be confused on your position. Are you suggesting people naturally apply too much or just the right amount of aggression in a self-defense situation. As opposed to people typically under responding to violence against them?
 

Dirty Dog

MT Senior Moderator
Staff member
Lifetime Supporting Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2009
Messages
21,758
Reaction score
7,636
Location
Pueblo West, CO
[Ad hominem insult deleted]

Goju, seriously buddy you're going on my mute list. Anybody claiming to be an expert in both martial arts and "research" is not going to be useful long term.
There are lots of people who are both.

Jeff Monson (60-26-1) has a Masters in psychology and is licensed as a Child Psychologist.
Tor Troeng (16-7-1) has a Masters in Engineering Physics.
Takeya Mizugaki (21-11-2) has a Masters in Electrical Engineering.
Terry Martin (23-11-0) has a BS in psychology, an MS in Clinical Psychology, and is currently a PhD candidate.
Shane Carwin (12-2-0) has a BS in Mechanical Engineering from the Colorado School of Mines - one of THE schools for engineering. And a second one in Environmental Technology.
Rosi Sexton (13-5-0) has a BS and MS in math, and a PhD in Theoretical Computer Science.
One of my friends is an ER Dr and a BJJ 1st Dan.
Another is an MD who, because Medical School isn't difficult enough, did a PhD in Virology at the same time. He's a BB in some form of karate.

I (with zero losses in my professional fight career [and zero wins or ties, either]) have multiple Dan ranks, a BS in Nursing and a Masters in Human Physiology.

MA expertise and research expertise are in no way incompatible.
 

Dirty Dog

MT Senior Moderator
Staff member
Lifetime Supporting Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2009
Messages
21,758
Reaction score
7,636
Location
Pueblo West, CO
I must be confused on your position. Are you suggesting people naturally apply too much or just the right amount of aggression in a self-defense situation. As opposed to people typically under responding to violence against them?
Neither. I am saying that if you present something as fact, you really ought to be prepared to support it with something other than "because I said so". Opinions are fine, and you are certainly entitled to hold whatever opinions you like. Facts, however, require support.
 

Oily Dragon

Senior Master
Joined
May 2, 2020
Messages
2,405
Reaction score
1,183
Neither. I am saying that if you present something as fact, you really ought to be prepared to support it with something other than "because I said so". Opinions are fine, and you are certainly entitled to hold whatever opinions you like. Facts, however, require support.
Careful, Dog.

He claimed to be a SWAT Commander.

That's right up there with Goju Ryu black belt.
 

Jared Traveler

Black Belt
Joined
Jul 17, 2022
Messages
629
Reaction score
273
Neither. I am saying that if you present something as fact, you really ought to be prepared to support it with something other than "because I said so". Opinions are fine, and you are certainly entitled to hold whatever opinions you like. Facts, however, require support.
Okay. I'm not really interested in proving much here. Sharing my thoughts and opinions, yes for sure. But I have been on here long enough to know people are going believe what they want.

I've read about it, I've experienced it personally, I've seen time and again from cadets, martial arts students, police cadets, victims of crimes. You believe what you want.

If you believe that humans don't have a natural aversion to hurting, damaging and or killing another human in a sudden, unexpected self-defense situation that's up to you.

For those who do believe that to be true, I have a lot to say about how this aversion could be overcome.
 

Steve

Mostly Harmless
Joined
Jul 9, 2008
Messages
21,120
Reaction score
6,645
Location
Covington, WA
Okay. I'm not really interested in proving much here. Sharing my thoughts and opinions, yes for sure. But I have been on here long enough to know people are going believe what they want.

I've read about it, I've experienced it personally, I've seen time and again from cadets, martial arts students, police cadets, victims of crimes. You believe what you want.

If you believe that humans don't have a natural aversion to hurting, damaging and or killing another human in a sudden, unexpected self-defense situation that's up to you.

For those who do believe that to be true, I have a lot to say about how this aversion could be overcome.
For what it’s worth, I believe you. I just don’t think it’s actually a healthy thing for most people to want to overcome. Even cops.
 

Oily Dragon

Senior Master
Joined
May 2, 2020
Messages
2,405
Reaction score
1,183
For what it’s worth, I believe you. I just don’t think it’s actually a healthy thing for most people to want to overcome. Even cops.
That's Wolf of Snow Hollow territory.
 

drop bear

Sr. Grandmaster
Joined
Feb 23, 2014
Messages
22,376
Reaction score
7,129
For what it’s worth, I believe you. I just don’t think it’s actually a healthy thing for most people to want to overcome. Even cops.

I think to be successful at fighting you have to mentally want to be there. Or at least committed to be there. And most people don't which is why most people suck. And put a half assed effort in to it.

Unless they are winning in which case they will probably be quite willing to hurt people.

And that is the reason for all the eyes closed throwing imaginary tennis balls that generally consists as a street fight.
 

Jared Traveler

Black Belt
Joined
Jul 17, 2022
Messages
629
Reaction score
273
I think to be successful at fighting you have to mentally want to be there. Or at least committed to be there. And most people don't which is why most people suck. And put a half assed effort in to it.

Unless they are winning in which case they will probably be quite willing to hurt people.

And that is the reason for all the eyes closed throwing imaginary tennis balls that generally consists as a street fight.
"Committed to being there" is a good way of describing it, verse "want to be there." By the nature of the situation choosing you (self-defense), even trained people don't want to be there in that situation. But they can be committed or even comfortable using appropriate force even if they don't want to be in that situation.
 

Latest Discussions

Top