The gun thing

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tmanifold

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How is it that that anytime some one wants to scoff at the martial arts they almost always say something along the lines of "What are you going to do when I pull a gun?" or "Yeah, I know a martial art, Glock fu."

I don't know about do in the US or other places but most people don't carry guns with them all the time (or at all for that matter). Hell, most of the people who say that have probably never touched a gun, let alone fired one in anger. I mean I think I could kill if need be (see the article on my site entitled Am I able to kill) but I don't think it is something I would want to do if i had any other choice.

I guess it is very easy to belittle what you don't know, especially if your are using something else you don't know about to belittle it.

Tony
 
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tonbo

Guest
I would have to paraphrase Ed Parker, when he said, "You can always tell a punk, because he is the one who buys a weapon, rather than taking the time to develop one".

"So what would you do if I pulled out a gun?". Depends. Who are you threatening with it, and what do you want? Want my money? Take it. My car? Take it. My life, or those of my family? Then, you will have a fight coming. I may not win it, but at least you will know I was there.

Glock-fu may be common, or not. I don't encounter many people who are carrying a pistol around normally. Those that do tend to be willing to use it, otherwise they wouldn't have it.

The people that ask these kinds of stupid questions are generally just misinformed, and of the "You know martial arts? Show me something!" variety, or are not entirely serious. For the most part, they can be ignored or laughed off.

The ones that are packing guns and *don't* ask questions like that, however, are a different story. Put a respectful distance between you and them if situations get nasty. :)

Just one person's opinion.....

Peace--
 

KennethKu

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To clear up a misconception here. Guns serve as a key deterrence. Many cirmes in progress are deterred by the show of firearm. You don't need to blow some one's brain out everytime. Just like you don't break limbs, jab eyes, choke windpipe , smash testicles, everytime you get into a confrontation.
 
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Little_Shoto

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I read on another thread that someone just says that they do martial arts to stay in shape if they are confronted by the typical Billy Bad-**** walking the streets looking to prove a point.

Most people have a misconception that you are learning MA so you can kick everyone's ****. Although there are some martial artists that think this way, my hope is that these people are in the minority.

To paraphrase the greatest Martial Arts movie of all time, The Karate Kid ;) , "I train so I do not have to fight."
 
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Kirk

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Originally posted by KennethKu

To clear up a misconception here. Guns serve as a key deterrence. Many cirmes in progress are deterred by the show of firearm. You don't need to blow some one's brain out everytime. Just like you don't break limbs, jab eyes, choke windpipe , smash testicles, everytime you get into a confrontation.

Yes, but in order to show it, you have to be willing to use it. If
stripped of it by an attacker, you've now given him the power to
kill more people. I wouldn't present a gun, unless I KNEW I
could and would use it if necessary.
 
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Master of Blades

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U just tell them to run like crazy, or if that fails that you hope they have a nice funeral :D
 

KennethKu

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Originally posted by Kirk
Yes, but in order to show it, you have to be willing to use it. If
stripped of it by an attacker, you've now given him the power to
kill more people. I wouldn't present a gun, unless I KNEW I
could and would use it if necessary.

DUH ! LOL THAT GOES WITHOUT SAYING!!

A gun is a deadly weapon! You don;t flash it around for show!!
 
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sweeper

Guest
Ok I disagree with the thought that most people who say these things do not have a gun or under estimate martial art. Where I train I know at leaste one person who carries a gun, ALOT of people carry other weapons like nives or short clubs or some other form of weapon that wouldn't be classified as one (like if you needed to go to the air port) We are trained to use every advantage we have including any available weapon/environmental weapon. These people are not mis informed about martial arts and understand perfectly well the limitations of those weapons when and whee you would use them and the legal mess they could get you in. Now perhaps I mis understand the type of person you are speaking of, but in my opinion if you are looking for real self deffence, as in you need to deffend your life or another's life and you arne't just interested in out toughing some punk on the street or in a bar, than you should aquire and learn to use your weapons in the order of most powerfull to leaste powerfull.. I gun is relativly easy to learn how to use and to keep for deffence, combined with good self deffence knowledge, environmental awareness and such it will be very effective, much more so than an unarmed art. Most of what I hear along the lines of "I know glock fu" is on something like RMA when someone else says they need to learn how to deffend themselves fast someone says get a gun.

Along a simular note I have a few fammily members that carry or have carried guns with them, they aren't trained in any martial arts (unless you consider tactical firearm implimentation a martial art) and also are aware of the weapon's limitations. they use(d) the weapons for self deffence purposes because of situations they came across where other means of self deffence were useless.
 
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Eraser

Guest
Hey there all,


All i want to say.. is that I hope i NEVER have to use my MA to defend myself.. I hope that i never get into a situation like that..
People think.. WHY train if you never want to use it??? Im not a fool.. i know that the odds are stacked against me that sometime im life here on earth i will be attacked in some way shape or form.. so I ask them.. what your doing to get ready for that day?????

I know im dreaming here.. but i truly do hope for the day when martial arts is just that ..... an art form.. (ok well it is) and not used for a way of defending ones life..
now don't get me wrong.. i understand that no everyone takes MA to learn how to defend themselves.. there are many other reasons why.. and people can have several reasons.. its just me im on a sugar kick and im rambling on here... LOL :D
 
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redfive

Guest
I live in Texas, and we have a concealed hand gun permit down here. I carry and lots of my friends carry. None of them are in any kind of martial system and have had no hand to hand trainig. They thought the right to carry a fire arm would be the "win all " solution. Well its not. They and many other people who carry forget that they have to get to the weapon first, draw it and have time for target acquazition. This gives me more than enough time to jam them up and take them down or some times I draw a practice knife on them and cut them. They worry to much about the gun, rather then handling the incoming threat, then going for the gun. So the majority of citizens who do carry don not have the proper training on how to quick draw th gun or how to keep it, if someone does get ahold of there gun arm or hand. I carry a combat folder as well. I can get to it alot faster then my gun, it does not have to be concealed, So that would buy me time to get to my gun. But if I guy jumped out from around a corner and already had a gun drawn and aimed, well you just would have to play it out? But for me to try to pull my gun against him, NO. So if someone does mock your martial arts and says that he could shoot you, put him to the test, give him a practice gun and tell him to draw on you, when you start to close in on him. Start at about 10-15 feet. Its great practice for both of you and alot can be learned. Its best if you use a bb gun pistol or something that has a real triger to pull.
Redfive
 
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Shinzu

Guest
its a known fact that no one is faster than a bullet at close range. these people just say this garbage because they know you or no one else would be able to dodge it and they like to poke fun at what they dont understand.

if they are waiting for a mystical martial arts answer perhaps they have been watching to many bruce leroy movies.

never the less... an effort to explain things to these types of people is an effort wasted.
 

7starmantis

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In my humble opinion, if you are pointing a gun at my head, I'm giving you whatever it is you want. Until the very last moment when I think or can see that you are deffinatly, without a question, going to kill me, I will then attempt to fight back, but not until then. And trust me, you do not want someone life having been taken on your hands! You still have to live with that. Every night when you close your eyes, you have to live with it. So just think twice before shooting, eh?

Oh, btw, I am liscenced in Texas to carry a handgun. As a point of refrence, I don't think I ever have.


7sm
 
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MartialArtist

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You really can't defend against a gun and never should you try unless he was bent on your destruction.

However, statistics show that a man is less likely to be killed in the US if he has a firearm than if he just cooperates.

Bah, Glocks are for thugs who participate in drive-by shootings as they need 20 or so bullets because they can't aim. A real gun is at least .45
 

KennethKu

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Prefragmented ammo such as Mag Safe or BeeSafe (Corbon) has proven stopping power and you don't have to put up with the kick of a 45. :)
 

7starmantis

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Does anyone else feel we are defeatin the entire purpose of MA by talking about the usage of guns? I mean self defense, yeah, but isn't true MA totally against violence?

7sm
 

KennethKu

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No it does not. Fighting is "as is" with all the "is" and "is not" ---Bruce Lee. If you are going to get involve in a fight, you must not ignore the possiblilty that the other side could be armed.
 
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J-kid

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baD THINGS COME FROM THINGS THAT CAN ONLY BRING PAIN AND DEATH,:eek:
 
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tonbo

Guest
George Carlin had a stand-up routine about the "seven dirty words" you couldn't use on television. He made a good point: There *are* no bad words. There are bad thoughts, bad intentions......and *words*.

Same thing with a gun. A gun can be an equalizer, sure. But it is a *tool*, just like anything else. If I have a shaky hand, or forget to take the safety off, forget to load the damn thing, or it jams, it is useless. In those cases, I will most likely get my a** handed to me by whoever I drew against.

Next point: A gun can sometimes be just boosted courage. Would you consider yourself "better equipped" to handle a confrontation if you have a gun? Would you still run away from a mugger or punk if you were armed vs. unarmed? People *may* be less likely to be killed if they have a gun, true, but what are the statistics of people carrying guns being involved in confrontations? Hey, easier to be bold, when you have superior firepower, no? (I'm not saying that's true in *all* cases, just some). (And yes, this goes for MA too--before the flames start, just thought I'd throw that out).

People either buy or develop weapons for their own safety, and I am all for that . We *need* to be safe. However, I will return the point I was starting to make above: Guns are a tool, just like knives and even MA. It's not the tool that determines the outcome--it's the person *using* the tool, and the others in the situation.

Gun, MA, or both--it's your choice. Just respect the tools, and use them sparingly. Remember: as a martial artist, you now truly understand how easy it is to get hurt in a confrontation, and how quickly things can change. That's worthy of a little thought, and more than a little applied wisdom, no?

Peace--
 

Nightingale

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Sometime before he died, Grandmaster Parker was asked why he carried a gun... he held up his hands and said something to the effect of "These don't work from fifteen feet away."

Personally, the only case where I would use a gun is if there is someone in my home. If someone comes in to my home, as a female living alone, I am in fear for my life, and frankly, I would rather deal with someone from fifteen feet away than from one foot away. I don't own a gun, yet. I am working on the safety requirements required by the state and saving my money for a good weapon.
 

KennethKu

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Glock, Sig Saur and Beretta are quality but expensive handguns. (They are not the only quality guns)

They are Double Action Only (DAO). What ever you get, make sure it is DAO, b/c DAO is prosecutor-proof, ie you won't be charge for careless discharge. DAO tyically has 10-12 lb of trigger pull vs SA (single action) where the trigger pull could be 3-4 lb, hence easier to be accidentally pulled.

As for size, a 9mm is less intimidating to fire b/c of lower recoil. Your best bet would be to use Corbon Bee Safe pre fragmented ammo. This bulllet will not pass thru wall and kill someone next door. And the stopping power is proven. If you are going to use regular ammo, then you should go with a 10mm or 0.40 size gun.
 

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