Tell us about your home gym....

JowGaWolf

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It's generally more difficult to measure changes in connective tissue than skeletal muscle so that's not definitive either.
Not really because there's a physical size change in the tendon. It begins to feel like a rope in the arm versus a string, For example, it was visible that the rock climber had stronger tendons. The measurement may not be a mathematical one but you can tell by feel and by performance.
So, if you do something that makes a muscle stronger, it's likely that the tendons connected to that muscle will become similarly stronger, though that increase in strength may lag behind by a couple of months.
If this was the case then the body builder with bigger forearms should have the biggest tendon, but that's now what we saw. Nor is it what we see when comparing bodybuilders to rock climbers. Here we can see this guys tendons around the joint are no problem. The muscles will only get as strong as it needs to be to move the body. They are not going to get bigger like a weight lifter or football player. However the tendons will continue to develop and get stronger the longer the climb, the longer those tendons are going to stay engaged. This guy's tendons are strong but he's not going to be able to do heavy lifting in the gym. There are people his same size that can out bench press him and out curl him in weight.

1664747908156.png
 

Alan0354

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I guess someone should tell the rock climber that he doesn't know what he's talking about.
There a big problem with this video, You take two people, a rock climber and power lifter to compare the forearm. The two have completely different genetics, I am sure I can find a power lifter with bigger forearm and bigger tendon than a rock climber.

This is not scientific. You have to have a few pairs of IDENTICAL TWINS or at least sample size of 200 ( 100 each) to compare.
 
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JowGaWolf

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I'll Stick to my gym training.. thanks anyway.
No one is saying to change. Just because you learn how something works doesn't mean that it's going to be adopted. I know how dead lifts work. I used to do them when I was a teen and in my twenties. I don't like them, never had. It's just not for me. Will I ever go back to it, probably not, or if I do, I'll focus more on a lighter weight than a heavy weight. Young people often get caught up in how heavy they can lift. I've fallen out of that mindset a long time ago. As I get older, my focus has turned toward function. I just want to move without difficulty.
 

JowGaWolf

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There a big problem with this video, You take two people, a rock climber and power lifter to compare the forearm. The two have completely different genetics, I am sure I can find a power lifter with bigger forearm and bigger tendon than a rock climber.

This is not scientific.
It's not genetics. It's the exercise. Rock climbers engage their tendons for longer periods of time. Anybody's body will develop like that if they engage the tendons like that. People who can lift heavy weights use a full range of muscle movement, so at any point of time during your lift your tendons only have to stay fully engaged for a second. Feel free to try this. Do a 20lb dumbbell bench press and do 3 sets of 22 reps.
1st rep will be the static hold where you slowly let the weight down as slow as possible. It should take about 1 or 2 minutes to go from arms straight to arms bent.
2nd - 11th rep. You will bench the dumbbell normally.
12th rep. Do the static hold where you slowly lower the weight.
13th -22nd rep,. You will bench the dumbbell normally. This completes your first set. Do the same thing for 2 more sets.

Somewhere during the sets, if this is new to you, you will begin to feel a pull near the joints. That is your tendon getting exhausted and weak. If you feel this, then stop and take a 2- 3 minutes break to recover. If you continue without a break then you risk tearing the tendon and not the muscle. My personal recommendation is that once the 2 to 3 minutes breaks no longer help then stop completely or break the reps in half.

I can show you this on video if you like. You can see me visible struggle with 20lbs and watch my body tremble and shake as I go through the hold. If people can workout and make muscles stronger then it's only logical that those same people can work out and do exercises designed to make tendons stronger.
 

JowGaWolf

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For the sake of Taiwan in today's tense situation, I hope they do better than that. This is not the time to catch fish with bare hands.

Looks good to me. Took a punch and used a lock. And before you say that this was a big guy vs small guy. Keep in mind that it was originally small guy that had him in a mount.
 
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Alan0354

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It's not genetics. It's the exercise. Rock climbers engage their tendons for longer periods of time. Anybody's body will develop like that if they engage the tendons like that. People who can lift heavy weights use a full range of muscle movement, so at any point of time during your lift your tendons only have to stay fully engaged for a second. Feel free to try this. Do a 20lb dumbbell bench press and do 3 sets of 22 reps.
1st rep will be the static hold where you slowly let the weight down as slow as possible. It should take about 1 or 2 minutes to go from arms straight to arms bent.
2nd - 11th rep. You will bench the dumbbell normally.
12th rep. Do the static hold where you slowly lower the weight.
13th -22nd rep,. You will bench the dumbbell normally. This completes your first set. Do the same thing for 2 more sets.

Somewhere during the sets, if this is new to you, you will begin to feel a pull near the joints. That is your tendon getting exhausted and weak. If you feel this, then stop and take a 2- 3 minutes break to recover. If you continue without a break then you risk tearing the tendon and not the muscle. My personal recommendation is that once the 2 to 3 minutes breaks no longer help then stop completely or break the reps in half.

I can show you this on video if you like. You can see me visible struggle with 20lbs and watch my body tremble and shake as I go through the hold. If people can workout and make muscles stronger then it's only logical that those same people can work out and do exercises designed to make tendons stronger.
No, that I cannot agree. Two different people doing the same exercise can have completely different result. Or else anyone that work hard can look like a body builder. I can assure you that it's not the case.

I don't have the genes, I work hard all these years, I learn how to do weights, I don't have the muscle to show.

I am very familiar with scientific experiments that video is completely invalid with sample size of TWO.

Talk to people that are into weight training and body building.
 

Alan0354

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Looks good to me. Took a punch and used a lock. And before you say that this was a big guy vs small guy. Keep in mind that it was originally small guy that had him in a mount.
Not the kind Kung Fu Wang show. I am sure they train a lot better than that. KF Wang's video is another catching fish in the pond or belt cracking type that just want to be different.

Actually ballet can be very good too. My grand daughter was in ballet for 3 years, she can do high round kick and spin kick in one day training. Kept her knee high, she can even hold her leg in still position up high. Talk about good muscle. Maybe people should learn ballet to train TKD kicks!!!

I know better, Taiwan people know better.
 
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JowGaWolf

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There a big problem with this video, You take two people, a rock climber and power lifter to compare the forearm. The two have completely different genetics, I am sure I can find a power lifter with bigger forearm and bigger tendon than a rock climber.

This is not scientific. You have to have a few pairs of IDENTICAL TWINS or at least sample size of 200 ( 100 each) to compare.
I'm pretty sure you can't find a weight lifter with bigger tendons than a rock climber unless that weight lifter does rock climbing. Those tendons in the forearm are things that are developed through rock climbing and the exercises that they do to condition their body for rock climbing. A power lifter isn't looking to develop big tendons for climbing, They train to develop big muscles.

If the weight lifter isn't doing this stuff then it's not going to happen. If you aren't training and conditioning the body for climbing then it isn't happening. Conditioning is more than just muscle development. It includes flexibility and tendon development. Specific conditioning gives you the ability to do one thing and not the ability to do another. A person can be strong for rock climbing and weak for weight lifting.
 

JowGaWolf

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No, that I cannot agree. Two different people doing the same exercise can have completely different result. Or else anyone that work hard can look like a body builder. I can assure you that it's not the case.
The only difference is the degree at which they excel at it,

Your comment surprises me because in your mind, you think anyone who does MMA can fight. If you believe that then Rock climbing is more achievable because your success doesn't depend on how good you are in comparison to how good someone else is. In order to rock climb you just have to be able to climb. In order to win a fight, you have to beat someone else.

Train rock climbing and you'll be able to rock climb. It's that simple. So much for genetics


 

Alan0354

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I'm pretty sure you can't find a weight lifter with bigger tendons than a rock climber unless that weight lifter does rock climbing. Those tendons in the forearm are things that are developed through rock climbing and the exercises that they do to condition their body for rock climbing. A power lifter isn't looking to develop big tendons for climbing, They train to develop big muscles.

If the weight lifter isn't doing this stuff then it's not going to happen. If you aren't training and conditioning the body for climbing then it isn't happening. Conditioning is more than just muscle development. It includes flexibility and tendon development. Specific conditioning gives you the ability to do one thing and not the ability to do another. A person can be strong for rock climbing and weak for weight lifting.
NO, if the weight lifter do grip exercise, it's the same. You do NOT need rock climbing to do it. There are other ways. I do a lot of grip exercise for cane fight. I use gripper, I don't need to climb anything.
 

Alan0354

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The only difference is the degree at which they excel at it,

Your comment surprises me because in your mind, you think anyone who does MMA can fight. If you believe that then Rock climbing is more achievable because your success doesn't depend on how good you are in comparison to how good someone else is. In order to rock climb you just have to be able to climb. In order to win a fight, you have to beat someone else.

Train rock climbing and you'll be able to rock climb. It's that simple. So much for genetics


No, I said MMA is a better MA. If two people of same talent, one train in MMA, chances are very high he will win over conventional MA one.

What are you talking about, your original video is about how big the tendons on the forearm. Of cause, the rock climber can climb rock better!!! We are talking about tendons and muscles. Your video was trying to say the guy that climb rocks will have bigger tendon and forearm muscle by just compare two people. THAT IS NOT SCIENTIFIC proof EVEN THOUGH in general might be true. I am saying the video is DECEIVING, not that the general result is not true. You cannot use that video as a proof. Use something else that is more scientific.


It's the video that I disagree, not your assertion. That video is NOT GOOD.
 

JowGaWolf

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I don't have the genes, I work hard all these years, I learn how to do weights, I don't have the muscle to show.
Did you work to become strong or did you work to be a body builder and have a body builder's look?
If you worked to be strong then you have already made comments on how strong you are . It seems like you accomplished the goal you were seeking by your own comments on how much you are able to lift and what is easy for you.

If you want to look like a body builder then I have to ask if you were following the same diet and exercises that people in body building do. Now when you talk about how strong you are but no muscles for you to show for it. Then I think you are confusing 2 things. Being strong is one thing and having the body of a body builder is something else. Unless you train like a body builder to sculpt your body a certain way then you aren't going to look like that. Train according to purpose.
 

JowGaWolf

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NO, if the weight lifter do grip exercise, it's the same. You do NOT need rock climbing to do it. There are other ways. I do a lot of grip exercise for cane fight. I use gripper, I don't need to climb anything.
It's not the same dude. Every grip is not the same grip. Weapon grip is not the same as grappling grip. Grappling grip is not the same as rock climbing grip. This is what Kung Fu Wang was talking about body unification.. You can't just isolate one thing and think that it's the same thing as "Training the Grip" when there are different types of grips that need and use different applications of the grip.

How you hold on to a wall is not the same grip used for holding onto a bar. Holding grip for 15 seconds is not the same as holding a grip for a few moments. It's not the same and it doesn't develop the muscles and tendons the same way. You can't just sit in a gym talking about I'm working on my grip doing for arm curls and thinking that's going to translate into rock climbing grip strength. It doesn't work that way.

I can't run 5 miles a day and think that will give me the same cardio that is needed for wrestling, simply because I'm "doing cardio" it's not the same thing. If you want to climb rocks and walls then you need to do the rock climbing training not body building training.
 

JowGaWolf

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No, I said MMA is a better MA. If two people of same talent, one train in MMA, chances are very high he will win over conventional MA one.
But you just admitted that two people can't be the same because of genetics. And that it's not scientific because they aren't identical twins. There's a lot of people who play baseball that aren't identical twins. Much of the talent that they have came from training baseball. The more they train the better they got at it. The less they trained the slower their progress is. There's very few people with "Raw talent" but there's a lot of people who can train to be good at baseball.

It's the same in Martial Arts. The more you train the better and the better your training is, the better you'll be at it. Now if you don't have good training then don't expect your training to get the results that you want. For example, If you want to climb rock but you only train like a body builder then your rock climbing skill will suck. Not because of talent, but because you weren't training for rock climbing.
 

Alan0354

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I want to emphasize, it's NOT what you said, it's the VIDEO that is bad. What you said make sense, just don't use that video as proof.

I still believe if a weight lifter put more effort in grip strength, the result is the same. Just they don't. Climbing is not unique.
 

JowGaWolf

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What are you talking about, your original video is about how big the tendons on the forearm. Of cause, the rock climber can climb rock better!!! We are talking about tendons and muscles. Your video was trying to say the guy that climb rocks will have bigger tendon and forearm muscle by just compare two people.
It is. scientific compare the tendons of other rock climbers and you'll get the same results. The training determines how the body develops. Different rock climber same thick tendons.
1664755507226.png


Another rock climbers arm
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Alan0354

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It is. scientific compare the tendons of other rock climbers and you'll get the same results. The training determines how the body develops. Different rock climber same thick tendons.
View attachment 28998

Another rock climbers arm
View attachment 28999
It's ONLY scientific it you have sample size of like 100.

I don't know whether you get what I said. Scientifically, you cannot claim anything unless you have a pool of people. Even though it make sense and we know it's true. It's the example you gave that I have problem, not the idea.

Don't use that video, that was bad, you will get attack on that and mudding up your point.
 
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