Taekwondo: Is striking with hands neglected?

[Doomx2001]

Some schools that I've noticed focus alot on striking with the legs, which to be fair is the trademark of Taekwondo. But, does any feel that hand strikes and blocks are neglected?
Some schools teach boxing in the place for Taekwondo hand work. Others do not. Or am I just crazy, LOL!

- Brian

 

[Cyriacus]

*shrugs*
We spend about 30 minutes to 1 hour of class practicing Hand Strikes. Kicking requires more practice than Punching, so I can see why some Dojang would focus on it alot more than others. The handwork in TKD is fine - It can resemble Boxing, but thats more because Boxing can be compared to just about anything. Its a very broad style. Just think: Kickboxing, Shotokan Karate, Muay Thai... Most of there punching looks like Boxing. Funny that. Consider that a praise to all these systems, and to Boxing
Its not Taekwondo. Its the TEACHERS. The TEACHERS sometimes dont teach it as much.

 

[ralphmcpherson]

we spend about 50% of time spent on striking doing punching and hand work. I cant speak on behalf of other clubs, but thats how we do it. Kicks are generally harder to learn than punches, so thats why many places probably spend more time on kicking.

 

[Doomx2001]

I agree with you guys. It always comes down to the teachers.

 

[ralphmcpherson]

I agree with you guys. It always comes down to the teachers.

... and your teacher's teacher. If your instructor was never taught to use their hands properly they are unlikely to openly admit it to students, instead they will just teach heaps of kicking and neglect the hands.

 

[Gnarlie]

Point of interest:

The techniques of the Taegeuk series of poomsae are 80% hands. Just over half of that is defensive or blocking technique, the other half aggressive striking. Less than 20% is kicking, and the majority of those kicks are front kicks.

If your class schedule is in line with that, then I'm not sure hand techniques are neglected. Of course we balance up by practicing more kicking.

Gnarlie

 

[Earl Weiss]

It also comes down to the rules of the sport. If your system does not allow or provide nearly as much opportunity for scoring with the hands, and your training is geared toward competition, then why waist time with something that won't score?

FWIW the non punching type sparring is not something that appeals to me. BUT, I can certainly see how that system may develop speedy kicks and good footwork.

I'll make a JJ comparison.

My background was in an Okinawan style of JJ. it was very effective. Then I went to workshops with Brazillians and saw how some of their refinements eliminated or minimized certain weaknesses in the techniques I knew which could be exploited assuming a knowledgable and able adversary.

 

[Kong Soo Do]

... and your teacher's teacher. If your instructor was never taught to use their hands properly they are unlikely to openly admit it to students, instead they will just teach heaps of kicking and neglect the hands.

This is a good point to bring up. It is apparent that there are different flavors of TKD with some being more inclined towards a specific venue. As one begins to 'specialize' in one area it is very possible for some elements to be dropped or neglected over time. This leads to the above quote which is similar to what I've said in the past, you can't teach what you haven't learned.

Point of interest:

The techniques of the Taegeuk series of poomsae are 80% hands. Just over half of that is defensive or blocking technique, the other half aggressive striking. Less than 20% is kicking, and the majority of those kicks are front kicks.

Which begs the question of why TKD is considered primarily a kicking art. At least originally, and in certain organizations, hand use (whether defensive, offensive, locking, throwing etc) was much more in use. To me, this is a better representation of the art as a whole as it takes into account more training options than focusing on just one specific area for one venue. Not to suggest that specialization for a specific venue is wrong, only that there is far more to the art if one wishes.

 

[Manny]

Well... the dojang of my master is almost kicking as many tkd dojang around here, in the other hand karate dojos around here are more hands than feet that's their concept. Myself... I am inclined toward kicking but would like to use more hands as a boxer so I would like to incorporate focus mitts on my class to increase the training of boxing punches (jab,cross,right, uppercuts and hooks) making my teach more balanced.

The only time when we practice hand techs is when doing basics and one steps or hoshisul, but most of the drills are kicking.

Manny

 

[WaterGal]

It also comes down to the rules of the sport. If your system does not allow or provide nearly as much opportunity for scoring with the hands, and your training is geared toward competition, then why waist time with something that won't score?

Yeah, really, this. In WTF sparring you can only punch to the hogu, and you might get 1 point for it, but probably not. While a kick can get you up to 3 points. So of course you'd want to focus more on kicking.

Also, you just get more power from the legs than the arms. This is especially true for women. I can compete pretty evenly in TKD sparring with a guy in my weight/skill class, but I just don't have as much upper-body strength. I think doing 50 push-ups was the hardest part of my 1st Dan test for me, lol.

 

[Gnarlie]

The only time when we practice hand techs is when doing basics and one steps or hoshisul, but most of the drills are kicking.

No Poomsae?

 

[Manny]

No Poomsae?

Yes we do poomsae quite a bit. Once a week, and yes we do hand techs there.

Manny

 

[sopraisso]

I don't totally agree that it comes down to the teacher. I mean, yes, there's truth in this, but I also believe there are some trends that can be most related to the style or the competition ruleset, no matter the teachers' prefferences or knowledge. Other people here have said something about this, and I agree with them.

I have a strong impression that many people in this forum train in places that don't reflect the massive aspects of most dojangs. The sole fact that people here have chosen very well and carefully their dojang -- or run it that way -- make a difference.

So yes, I do think hand strikes and blocks are frequently negleted in general taekwondo training, despite the fact that there are great dojangs out there that have a much more balanced practice.

By the way, despite some things in common, I can also see great difference between boxing and taekwondo hand techniques. It begins with the fact that boxing techniques are mostly design to boxing ruleset and protective gear (gloves mainly). I believe taekwondo techniques were originally more suited to civillian self denfence, and this makes a big difference. I'm not comparing with sport taekwondo, which I believe follows different principles (e.g., I think in sport it's usually safe to sacrifice stability for speed an power generation, which is not a great option in self defense). For example, a gloved punch has different effect compared to a bare-handed punch, and this makes great difference in each system, I believe. Furthermore, in today's boxing there's no grappling techniques, wilst in taekwondo I believe it's a vital aspect of the art, so much that the pulling hand in punches, as I understand, can be used to hold the opponent's hand, or clothe, or whatever. Finally, when we go deeper into taekwondo hand techniques, be it blocks or more strict grappling techniques, they're still hand techniques, but have very little resemblance with boxing. But now I have a strong impression that this is dangerous terrain, where so things should make sense, but many times they just don't.

Anyway, I'm no expert in any of the subjects I talked about, so take it FWIW.

 

[chrispillertkd]

Yes we do poomsae quite a bit. Once a week,...

OK, Manny, I'm just going to say that we have very different definitions of "quite a bit"!

Pax,

Chris

 

[ACJ]

Also, you just get more power from the legs than the arms. This is especially true for women. I can compete pretty evenly in TKD sparring with a guy in my weight/skill class, but I just don't have as much upper-body strength. I think doing 50 push-ups was the hardest part of my 1st Dan test for me, lol.

Punching has little to do with upper body strength. The power all comes from your legs.

 

[Manny]

Last night we do kicking shileds training using strong basic kicks (ap chagui, peet chagui and yop chagui), at the end I told students that these kicks aimed to the torso and to the solar plexus area can be devastating, and show to students that a hard punch to mthe solar plexus can take the breath away from the bad guy BUT a well aimed kick to this area is simple much better than a punch because the leg is stronger than the arm.

Liked or not TKD is a Korean Martial Art that focus in kicking, however the hands/arms are equally important not only for puching or hitting but to deflectiong blocking and even grabing, so I can say I use my hand a lot doing one steps and ho si sul not only for punching but for blocking,parriying and for grabing and to execute locks,trows and pins.

Manny

 

[WaterGal]

Punching has little to do with upper body strength. The power all comes from your legs.

Really? I hadn't heard that before. I have plenty of power in my legs but I still can't break two boards with a hand technique (and have seen very few women that can). But then, I don't have nearly as much practice in hand striking, so you could be right and it's just that I'm not lining up my body correctly or something.

I do that know that in grappling (since I do Hapkido), upper body strength really does make a difference, and the weaker person has to be a lot faster and more skilled. That was kind of my basis of comparison there.

 

[ACJ]

Really? I hadn't heard that before. I have plenty of power in my legs but I still can't break two boards with a hand technique (and have seen very few women that can). But then, I don't have nearly as much practice in hand striking, so you could be right and it's just that I'm not lining up my body correctly or something.

I do that know that in grappling (since I do Hapkido), upper body strength really does make a difference, and the weaker person has to be a lot faster and more skilled. That was kind of my basis of comparison there.

Yeah, it wasn't to discount a disparity between women and men. Women will still have a harder time of generating a maximal level of force, even if they have the same lower body strength. This is actually based on how hormones interact with the central nervous system. Other contributing factors for the board breaking may include an increased sensitivity in terms of physical contact and thus pain, which I believe has been shown to be higher in women, and a neurological safety measure, everyone will control their force output subconsciously to avoid pain and injury. And most importantly striking with the hands in terms of maximal power relies heavily on bodyweight too.

When you're next punching, make sure to focus on the leg pushing your bodyweight into the punch, if you use mechanics similar to boxing, focus on contracting the glutes of you back leg, while engaging you calf muscle of the same leg to ensure strong contact between your ball of foot and the ground.