Tae Gueks and poomsae's

[terryl965]

I have seen more and more adaptation done to the tae gueks in general over the last couple of years, can anybody explain why this is happening? I keep seeing kicks going higher and higher, also I have notive that many do not understand a walking stance and a long stance. I see to many people with the backfoot on a angle and not pointing forward like it needs to be. Punches look more like a movement rather thana punch, the flow is just off to me but yet they score high and I hear praising down by GM about how well it is done, what happen to power and precission of techniques rather than flasn and high and unpractical kicks.

I know on a little rant about it and figure why not with National coming up amd I will see so many of these forms done this way and have to listen to how great they are. Well anybody else having the same problems with this?

 

[ATC]

Any kick done above chin height for face kick is a deduction by the rules. Foot placement in not the correct angle or not the correct length and width for the stance is also a deduction by the rules.

Now with that said I do see local tournaments not following these rules as most local tournaments are run and staffed by the hosting masters school. This tends to lead to some bias scoring for each student of that hosting masters school. They simply think and like the way their students perform the forms. They think it is correct in their eyes because that it what they were taught.

At the national level though you will not see this too much and most times the form performed based off the rules does win. I have seen many people who think they should have won with high held to long kicks complain for not winning, and are surprised when I tell them that they kicked to high or held the kick to long. The same goes for stances as well. Even the setup and transition may be over exaggerated as well. Many just don't know that forms are clean, simple and direct. No flash.

 

[taekwondodo]

Thank you for bringing this topic up. This topic will then correlate with the other thread on USAT decision offering/not offering Open Individual Form division.

I presumed that part of the reasons why USAT did not offered Open Individual Form division at US Open is because USAT would like to concentrate on Sport Poomsae. Also, they would like to consolidate judging method into more precised process. Sport Poomsae judging process will do that. It reduced amout of "bias" and let the judges concentrate on more technical judging with the help of the software.

I also assumed that USAT would like to see more competitors be ready and train in Sport Poomsae so there will be more candidates ready for the World level of competition. Currently, the US is so far behind with Poomsae competition comparing to the rest of the countries.

So I presumed that is why USAT did not offer the Individual Form division, even up to a week ago. I checked Hangastar when I go and register my son, and there wasn't any Individual form division at Black Belt, 10-17. However, there it was offered at the Senior and Ultra level.

With that being said, if judging Individual Form still a Double elimination format, and kids still practiced "regular way", ie.. extremely deep long stances, ie..karate style... kick above their head, middle punches are at the wrong place, Kiaps at the wrong place and DRAMATIC way..etc.. then the US will still behind the rest of the world in Competitive Poomsae.

I would like to suggest that using the Pro-Poomsae software for judging:
1. Required all judges to learn all of the forms correctly
2. Implement Sport Poomsae method down to the Yellow belt level, and modify it according to "their" level.
a. Yellow belt level - requirement to perform 1 form
b. Green belt - to perform 2 forms (taeguek 1 & 3)
c. Blue belt - to perform 2 forms but to know 3 forms (taeguek 1, 3 & 4)
d. etc...

By using this method, the kids will not only have to remember their previous forms, and continued to learn new forms as they matured. Also this will help them to be ready at the Black Belt level in: testing for their next rank, and competing at the JR. level and at the Team Trial.

Hey, I should send this to Master Jimmy Kim to think about when he is developing the Sport Poomsae program.

 

[Disco]

http://www.natkd.com/movies/Forms/Taegeuk_Forms/Koryo.mpg

Hope the above link works, it's showing the first black belt form Koryo. Now this is being done by a Korean Master, not sure if it's directly from the Kukkiwon, but none the less from a high ranked Korean Master. The way it was originally taught, at least to me, was the first sidekick was at knee height level and the second sidekick was at chest level. Why?, because the first kick should/would have brought the attacker's height lower. The kick to the knee should/would have made him bend forward and would have now put his head where his chest would be if he were upright. This follows practical combat applications for what a technique would/should do. Now follow those techniques with the given followup techniques of the form itself, reverse chop/punch/hammer fist and see where the height level of those techniques are being delivered. Their all being delivered at the level where the attacker would now be after a slight recovery if the sidekicks did not remove him from the fight. Their not being delivered at the height the second kick was delivered at. If we follow this logical progression, then the second kick is being delivered at the wrong height.

If their not teaching it correctly, then it can't be done correctly. I've seen too many competitions where flash is cash and I've actually seen a judge's score get over ruled because the other judge's went flash instead of functional.