Steve Arsenault Kenpo Clips

[Flying Crane]

I was the attacker in that first video clip. The clip was taken like 14 years ago. I did look a little stiff but I attacked the way I was told to. I take a little offense to the comment on my stance, I don't think my neutral bow looked that bad. I have improved alot since then under a different kenpo orginazation. I'm sorry if I have annoyed people with my stone statue response to the techniques. I just discovered those clips and read the responses and found that I was being trashed almost as much as Arsenault. I was young, nervous and told to just stand there while I got kicked in the groin and stuff. I like to read the responses to the demo's, most of you guys are correct.

Welcome to MT. It is unfortunate you were put under the microscope without even knowing about it. I personally think people should be careful about posting videos, because it represents only a brief moment in time and may not be an accurate representation of someone's true abilities.

 

[Carol]

Welcome to MartialTalk!

If it's not too personal of a question mrdankenpo, you mention that you are a 6th Dan in American Kenpo now, do you mind if I ask what dan rank you were when doing these videos 14 years ago with Mr. Arsenault?

 

[Kenpojujitsu3]

Welcome to MartialTalk!

If it's not too personal of a question mrdankenpo, you mention that you are a 6th Dan in American Kenpo now, do you mind if I ask what dan rank you were when doing these videos 14 years ago with Mr. Arsenault?

Looks like a 1st Black on that tape to me. As to "being careful about posting videos" the Arsenault videos were posted by me at his request. Besides, toughen up guys....being under the microscope is a good thing. Others see things we don't see even if it is "old" stuff. And if he have corrected the issues we were recorded having earlier there is visual proof of how far we have come. Sounds good to me. Personally I think that if you're going to be thin-skinned about what people think you look like on film you are more worried about others opinions and appearances than personal development and improvement. Personally I use all the criticism I can get...it makes me hit the mats harder.

 

[Flying Crane]

As to "being careful about posting videos" the Arsenault videos were posted by me at his request. Besides, toughen up guys....being under the microscope is a good thing.

...

Personally I think that if you're going to be thin-skinned about what people think you look like on film you are more worried about others opinions and appearances than personal development and improvement. Personally I use all the criticism I can get...it makes me hit the mats harder.

I think Mr. Arsenault's request to post this video did not take into consideration the Uke's desires. I suspect it was not done deliberately, but sounds like the bottom line is that that the Uke might have preferred it not be posted. Regardless of how you may feel about your own videos being posted, not everyone feels that way and not everyone wants to be a spectacle on Youtube. Some people are more private about their training than others are. It has nothing to do with other people's opinions of them, but it can be awkward and unwelcome to suddenly discover an old video of yourself up on Youtube being subjected to all kinds of criticisms when you didn't even know about it.

 

[Touch Of Death]

I was the attacker in that first video clip. The clip was taken like 14 years ago. I did look a little stiff but I attacked the way I was told to. I take a little offense to the comment on my stance, I don't think my neutral bow looked that bad. I have improved alot since then under a different kenpo orginazation. I'm sorry if I have annoyed people with my stone statue response to the techniques. I just discovered those clips and read the responses and found that I was being trashed almost as much as Arsenault. I was young, nervous and told to just stand there while I got kicked in the groin and stuff. I like to read the responses to the demo's, most of you guys are correct.

If you were doing what you were told, I don't see how you can be faulted.
Sean

 

[Touch Of Death]

I think Mr. Arsenault's request to post this video did not take into consideration the Uke's desires. I suspect it was not done deliberately, but sounds like the bottom line is that that the Uke might have preferred it not be posted. Regardless of how you may feel about your own videos being posted, not everyone feels that way and not everyone wants to be a spectacle on Youtube. Some people are more private about their training than others are. It has nothing to do with other people's opinions of them, but it can be awkward and unwelcome to suddenly discover an old video of yourself up on Youtube being subjected to all kinds of criticisms when you didn't even know about it.

Although Youtube did not exist at the time, he knew he was being taped. He just got the bonus showing.
Sean

 

[Flying Crane]

Although Youtube did not exist at the time, he knew he was being taped. He just got the bonus showing.
Sean

It's true, and really to the point. At the time, I suppose he expected the video would be shared only among a small circle of people. The possibility of a larger audience didn't even exists. Suddenly Youtube pops up, and the video gets posted where literally the entire world can gawk at it.

I'll let him speak for himself from here on out. But if it was me, i'd be a bit miffed at the lack of courtesy on the part of someone who had a video posted without asking how I felt about it, if I was a major (or maybe even a minor) player in the video.

 

[Touch Of Death]

It's true, and really to the point. At the time, I suppose he expected the video would be shared only among a small circle of people. The possibility of a larger audience didn't even exists. Suddenly Youtube pops up, and the video gets posted where literally the entire world can gawk at it.

I'll let him speak for himself from here on out. But if it was me, i'd be a bit miffed at the lack of courtesy on the part of someone who had a video posted without asking how I felt about it, if I was a major (or maybe even a minor) player in the video.

The videos I'm on that I don't want posted are Legion.:barf:
Sean

 

[mrdankenpo]

Welcome to MartialTalk!

If it's not too personal of a question mrdankenpo, you mention that you are a 6th Dan in American Kenpo now, do you mind if I ask what dan rank you were when doing these videos 14 years ago with Mr. Arsenault?

I am pretty sure I got my 2nd degree that day, it was belt testing at Joe Palanzo's in Baltimore.

 

[mrdankenpo]

Looks like a 1st Black on that tape to me. As to "being careful about posting videos" the Arsenault videos were posted by me at his request. Besides, toughen up guys....being under the microscope is a good thing. Others see things we don't see even if it is "old" stuff. And if he have corrected the issues we were recorded having earlier there is visual proof of how far we have come. Sounds good to me. Personally I think that if you're going to be thin-skinned about what people think you look like on film you are more worried about others opinions and appearances than personal development and improvement. Personally I use all the criticism I can get...it makes me hit the mats harder.

I have got no problems with criticism, that is why I choose to be a student, even to this day. I have been a school owner since 1998 and have about 140 students enrolled. I am also the east coast director of a north east based kenpo organization. Alot of my students and collegues in the kenpo community have access and often log onto these sites. To anyone who knows me and see's the clips and reads the feedback I am made to look like a stone statue fool with a bad neutral bow. I just wanted to post so any of my students, who I hope are proud to be members of our academy don't think I am the laughing stock of kenpo. I don't have any bad feelings to those who post the criticism, I like reading them and think it is funny, I laugh at myself watching it after reading what people say about it. I was just setting the record as to the timeline and circumstances under which the videos were shot.

 

[mrdankenpo]

It's true, and really to the point. At the time, I suppose he expected the video would be shared only among a small circle of people. The possibility of a larger audience didn't even exists. Suddenly Youtube pops up, and the video gets posted where literally the entire world can gawk at it.

I'll let him speak for himself from here on out. But if it was me, i'd be a bit miffed at the lack of courtesy on the part of someone who had a video posted without asking how I felt about it, if I was a major (or maybe even a minor) player in the video.

Thanks for the back-up flying crane. Salute

 

[Carol]

I am pretty sure I got my 2nd degree that day, it was belt testing at Joe Palanzo's in Baltimore.

Very cool! Thanks! :asian:

I have got no problems with criticism, that is why I choose to be a student, even to this day. I have been a school owner since 1998 and have about 140 students enrolled. I am also the east coast director of a north east based kenpo organization. Alot of my students and collegues in the kenpo community have access and often log onto these sites. To anyone who knows me and see's the clips and reads the feedback I am made to look like a stone statue fool with a bad neutral bow. I just wanted to post so any of my students, who I hope are proud to be members of our academy don't think I am the laughing stock of kenpo. I don't have any bad feelings to those who post the criticism, I like reading them and think it is funny, I laugh at myself watching it after reading what people say about it. I was just setting the record as to the timeline and circumstances under which the videos were shot.

Its cool to hear your side of the story.

The biggest issue that I have with videos on YouTube is that they don't tell the whole story. I personally have a very hard time judging any martial art by looking at a flickering 2 inch screen on my laptop.

While I think YouTube serves a purpose, I have yet to take it as gospel. To see is to be deceived, to feel is to believe. I wish more people followed SGM Parker's sage advice.

 

[kidswarrior]

I dunno. It just seems like the techs go on and on and on, way past the point of having any meaning. This kind of thing has been discussed in the past. I know, the idea is that you "automatically flow into the next move" if something doesn't go right. I just disagree, I think he is taking a whole lot for granted, to work a technique out to move number 58, or so. I mean, I think I saw a couple places where he applied a restraining hold, like an armlock, and then LET THE ARM GO! so he could go back to pummelling the guy, who kindly remained where he was, to be pummelled some more.

I personally think it makes sense to plan techs out to maybe 2 or 3, or perhaps 4 followups, but beyond that, you just absolutely cannot make any assumptions about what will happen, and to where you will "automatically flow" next.

Practicing like this doesn't give you something to flow into if the prior move went wrong. The only way the bad guy will be in place for that next move, is if everything prior went RIGHT. And if it all went right, there is no reason for the tech to still be happening. It should have ended ages ago. It's just making some dangerously false assumptions. If the prior move went wrong, the guy is probably nowhere near where he would need to be for you to flow into the next move.

I just think it's overdone.

This is absolutely the central point of it all. Another thread recently posed a question about why Kenpo is denigrated by some as a 'slapping' art. Parts of these vids give an answer. I only watched parts of them, because I couldn't take anymore. The assumptions, as Flying Crane said, are as endless as the techniques. 3-4 moves with power, focus, and intention should be enough, and if not, then the opponent has hit the reset button and we're starting over. Now I have to worry--again--about perhaps the most dangerous part of any fight, the initial engagement.

 

[kidswarrior]

I was the attacker in that first video clip. The clip was taken like 14 years ago. I did look a little stiff but I attacked the way I was told to. I take a little offense to the comment on my stance, I don't think my neutral bow looked that bad. I have improved alot since then under a different kenpo orginazation. I'm sorry if I have annoyed people with my stone statue response to the techniques. I just discovered those clips and read the responses and found that I was being trashed almost as much as Arsenault. I was young, nervous and told to just stand there while I got kicked in the groin and stuff. I like to read the responses to the demo's, most of you guys are correct.

I post responses as I read through a thread, so hadn't gotten this far before my first post (which appears on page 4, I think --late to the dance and all). If it comes off as critical of any one, and especially you, please accept my apologies. My problem is not with any of the artists, but with a certain way we practice the arts, with these huge, very suspect preconceptions that go somethig like: If I do A, I can count on his body doing B, and then carrying that line of thought through much of the alphabet. The SK which I learned (not to speak for anyone else), seems to do too much of that.

 

[Kenpojujitsu3]

I have got no problems with criticism, that is why I choose to be a student, even to this day. I have been a school owner since 1998 and have about 140 students enrolled. I am also the east coast director of a north east based kenpo organization. Alot of my students and collegues in the kenpo community have access and often log onto these sites. To anyone who knows me and see's the clips and reads the feedback I am made to look like a stone statue fool with a bad neutral bow. I just wanted to post so any of my students, who I hope are proud to be members of our academy don't think I am the laughing stock of kenpo. I don't have any bad feelings to those who post the criticism, I like reading them and think it is funny, I laugh at myself watching it after reading what people say about it. I was just setting the record as to the timeline and circumstances under which the videos were shot.

No you don't look like a stone statue fool with a bad neutral. You like someone who has being swung on at high speed and preferred to stay still to avoid getting caught the wrong way accidently. I have yet to see a laughing stock "Uke". Anyone who can't see things like that...it's best to ignore their comments. Also you have 140 enrolled. That's 140 that think you're worth learning from as opposed to the one or two that think you sucked.......over a decade ago. 140 to 1 ain't bad odds.

 

[Kenpojujitsu3]

It's true, and really to the point. At the time, I suppose he expected the video would be shared only among a small circle of people. The possibility of a larger audience didn't even exists. Suddenly Youtube pops up, and the video gets posted where literally the entire world can gawk at it.

I'll let him speak for himself from here on out. But if it was me, i'd be a bit miffed at the lack of courtesy on the part of someone who had a video posted without asking how I felt about it, if I was a major (or maybe even a minor) player in the video.

Then miffed you shall be when I get my hands on video of you LOL. My thought is this. When you get taped doing something and you don't have the tape you do not know what's going to happen with the tape. If you don't like it, don't get taped. Secondly this particular tape was mass produced as part of a marketing tape for that Kenpo organization. It was already available to the world over a decade ago. If you're that worried about people seeing you practice your art then do it in secrecy like they used to do. No spectators, No Cameras, No Camcorders, No Windows.....

 

[Kenpodoc]

I was the attacker in that first video clip. The clip was taken like 14 years ago. I did look a little stiff but I attacked the way I was told to. I take a little offense to the comment on my stance, I don't think my neutral bow looked that bad. I have improved alot since then under a different kenpo orginazation. I'm sorry if I have annoyed people with my stone statue response to the techniques. I just discovered those clips and read the responses and found that I was being trashed almost as much as Arsenault. I was young, nervous and told to just stand there while I got kicked in the groin and stuff. I like to read the responses to the demo's, most of you guys are correct.

Actually I thought that you looked like you were doing what you were told to do. It is the responsibility of the "skilled" defender in the self defense techniques to put the attacker where they need to be. Anyway, who knew 14 years ago that any of this would be out there for the world to see.

thanks for posting,

Jeff

 

[Kenpojujitsu3]

I think Mr. Arsenault's request to post this video did not take into consideration the Uke's desires. I suspect it was not done deliberately, but sounds like the bottom line is that that the Uke might have preferred it not be posted. Regardless of how you may feel about your own videos being posted, not everyone feels that way and not everyone wants to be a spectacle on Youtube. Some people are more private about their training than others are. It has nothing to do with other people's opinions of them, but it can be awkward and unwelcome to suddenly discover an old video of yourself up on Youtube being subjected to all kinds of criticisms when you didn't even know about it.

How private can you be at an open test, at a commercial school a few feet from a video camera that you are directly facing? That's 3 counts against privacy right there. The problem ain't the tapes and videos. It's how people take criticism. It's no different than when it's done face to face. Some take it and roll with it some get offended because someone thought they were less than perfect.

 

[kidswarrior]

The problem ain't the tapes and videos. It's how people take criticism. It's no different than when it's done face to face. Some take it and roll with it some get offended because someone thought they were less than perfect.

Not to get OT, but you've raised an important point. Maybe besides being able to take criticism, it's also how the criticism is delivered. There is some trust necessary between an artist and a reviewer, or student and teacher. For example, if I harshly correct one of my students, especially in public, I may lose them because they might (rightly) feel I broke that trust. But if I use some circumspection and a little finesse in correcting their technique, I still make the point that I can't approve of their technique as just performed, but I still approve of them as people and students.

 

[Kenpojujitsu3]

Not to get OT, but you've raised an important point. Maybe besides being able to take criticism, it's also how the criticism is delivered. There is some trust necessary between an artist and a reviewer, or student and teacher. For example, if I harshly correct one of my students, especially in public, I may lose them because they might (rightly) feel I broke that trust. But if I use some circumspection and a little finesse in correcting their technique, I still make the point that I can't approve of their technique as just performed, but I still approve of them as people and students.

Yup, and there lies one of the flaws of the internet. People can criticize without fear of repercussion due to the anonimity factor. Many that always have something to say about someone else's skill are never willing to put their own stuff "out there" for critique. It's easy to take shots when there are no guns pointed your way. Agreed.