Sport Fighting & Self Defense

[sgtmac_46]

true, but i've also heard of & seen pro boxers & kickboxers break their hand on a guy & keep punching with it anyway because they were determined to win. it's just hard to beat the kind of toughness that can be developed in combat sports.

jf

Mammals produce adrenaline for a reason! And how many football players have we seen who dislocate a finger, go to the side line snap it back in place, tape it and continue playing? There's something to be said for physical toughness born of hard competition and training!

 

[chav buster]

things like mma have good points like dealing with adrenaline and teaching you a basic skill set for fighting and i would say knowing mma would give you a real advantage over someone who dosnt train. but just like in mma where you have to be good at all ranges you you need to be train in all ranges for street fighting may it be someone pulls a knife or theres multiple oponents or your seated or you get jumped ect.

you must try and train for whatever might happen for instance wrestling great it will teach you how to deal with clinching and take down an oponent who is over powering you with blows but you add clothing into the mix and it changes, you add headbutts and it changes again, you add striking to the back off the head/neck/spine and if you dont get that double leg your in real trouble and thats without talking about groin strikes gauging fish hooks ect.

another good excample is muay thai pretty much anyone person standing infront of you is going to take a kicking, but if you get attacked from a different angle you need to havent practice striking and foot work for those angles and you have no tactics for multiple oponents.

in my ju jitsu class the ground fighting looks completly different to how a bjj class would theres always a second or 3rd person involed who can whack you with at any given moment and the focus is mostly on escapes and sweeps to get you back to your feet rather then locks and choke even the positions are different and are mostly moderfied versions of the knee ride postion. i want go on about you shoulnt go to ground in a streetfight as it has been done to death but if you do hit the deck and you have only ever trained in a grappling art you will most likely attamp to grapple which isnt exclusively the same thing as ground fighting.


you do what your trained to in a fight so its ok saying you would adapt this and that but if you dont train it in the heat of the moment you probably want.

i have alot of respect for combat sport and feel that thay go a long way in self defence to prepare you for a streetfight but in themselfs i feel that thay are incomplete for a street scenario.

 

[jarrod]

the problem with the idea that you fight like you train (although it does have a lot of merit) is that it is impossible to train just like a fight without doing serious bodily injury to yourself. so on the one hand you have pure RBSD type training which has difficulty simulating the stress of SD, then on the other you have sport fighting, which, IMO, is even more stressful than SD, but removes the techniques of RBSD.

another issue is the amount of training: no competitve athlete trains twice a week & expects to win a competition. yet how many people train teh deadlies twice a week & think they can disarm multiple knife weilding baddies? competition is also great motivation for training.

jf

 

[sgtmac_46]

the problem with the idea that you fight like you train (although it does have a lot of merit) is that it is impossible to train just like a fight without doing serious bodily injury to yourself. so on the one hand you have pure RBSD type training which has difficulty simulating the stress of SD, then on the other you have sport fighting, which, IMO, is even more stressful than SD, but removes the techniques of RBSD.

another issue is the amount of training: no competitve athlete trains twice a week & expects to win a competition. yet how many people train teh deadlies twice a week & think they can disarm multiple knife weilding baddies? competition is also great motivation for training.

jf

Good points.....though the idea of fighting like you train is to simulate as close as possible reality.....you can never actually achieve reality as you.

Fortunately for most folks, the average attacker isn't the average trained professional competitor........when he is, though, it's a bad day!

 

[seasoned]

I was just thinking about what I got the most out of "knockdown" kaarte events, which are a sport event and I think it is, getting hit hard and not freaking out. Think about it, the purpose the other guy has is to knock you out. I know it is not to kill you, but they still want to inflict harm on you and you are having to deal with that. At the very least, you are going to be able to better control your adrenal dump.

Very good point Searcher. My Sensei always taught, that mind set was very important. I could have the greatest weapons going for me, but if my mind wasn’t in the game, I would get my a- - handed to me. If I may add to this, we have to bring our training as close to the real thing as possible. Obviously we can only go just so far, because it is just practice. But it was the mind set, that made all the difference. When we stepped into the DoJo, it was also with an air of seriousness, for that 2-3 hours, everything outside of the DoJo was put on hold. Everything we did was at 110%. Whether it was Kata, sparing, or drills, it was the feeling of kill or be killed. My Sensei never allowed us to take advantage of anyone either, but excepted us to never hold back mentally, when faced with him, or any of the higher ranks. When we were on the sparing floor, if we were dishing it out or taking it, always do it like it was a life or death situation. To this day, when training with someone, I distinguish the difference with my techniques, but never with my mental state. I have seen instructors as well as higher black belts running classes, get accidentally hit , just demonstrating blocks, how embarrassing. :asian:

 

[searcher]

As I've said many times -- sparring is ONE way of practicing the learned techniques against a partner. But, unless you want to run out of playmates, you can't really go full force against a training partner.

I have been accused of this before and it is a great arguement for sparring.


Without sparring how are you going to know what is going to work? You won't. Sport fighting is just moving the testing phase into an area where the other guy is even less co-operative. If you want to do trial and error on the street, go ahead. But the first time you make a bad error, you are going to pay in bruises, cuts, and maybe worse.

 

[sgtmac_46]

I have been accused of this before and it is a great arguement for sparring.


Without sparring how are you going to know what is going to work? You won't. Sport fighting is just moving the testing phase into an area where the other guy is even less co-operative. If you want to do trial and error on the street, go ahead. But the first time you make a bad error, you are going to pay in bruises, cuts, and maybe worse.

Very good points!

 

[searcher]

From a post in another thread I thought of something that sport fighting definately does NOT help with in prep for the street, the hands. How many fighters have we seen that break their hands the first time they punch a guy with bare fist? Quite a few. I have seperated my knuckles hiting with bare fist. All of this by not training the body to know how much force to put into a shot along with the hands needing additional padding.

Just a thought that I needed to state.

 

[just2kicku]

I think sport fighting like sparring is good for conditioning but more importantly it's good for your timing. I think it helps with anticipating an oppenents next move. But when it comes down to it you still need to practice as real as you can for the streets. For instance, if a guy shoots for you legs and you can reach his face and gouge his eyes, then do it. I teach our kids and adults that. If you can gouge out an eye then keep squeezing till it pops! Fight over. If he exposes his spine and you can paralyze the attacker, fight over. You don't get that if you only train for sport. I don't mean to offend anyone that's just my opinion.
Sijo once said " If there's blood on the mat itls been a good workout"

 

[jarrod]

From a post in another thread I thought of something that sport fighting definately does NOT help with in prep for the street, the hands. How many fighters have we seen that break their hands the first time they punch a guy with bare fist? Quite a few. I have seperated my knuckles hiting with bare fist. All of this by not training the body to know how much force to put into a shot along with the hands needing additional padding.

Just a thought that I needed to state.

i just recently considered this & i've been thinking of adding knuckle conditioning to my training. good point.

I think sport fighting like sparring is good for conditioning but more importantly it's good for your timing. I think it helps with anticipating an oppenents next move. But when it comes down to it you still need to practice as real as you can for the streets. For instance, if a guy shoots for you legs and you can reach his face and gouge his eyes, then do it. I teach our kids and adults that. If you can gouge out an eye then keep squeezing till it pops! Fight over. If he exposes his spine and you can paralyze the attacker, fight over. You don't get that if you only train for sport. I don't mean to offend anyone that's just my opinion.
Sijo once said " If there's blood on the mat itls been a good workout"

i think you touched on something very important here; timing. if i had to trade away all of my physical attributes & keep just one, it would be timing. speed, strength, & cardio are just icing compared to timing.

jf