Should I be addressed as Sifu?

[masherdong]

Hello everyone. I had a question that I thought that I would bring up here. I have been training in kung fu and am an Asst Instructor for kung fu. Now, this past summer, I became a certified instructor in krav maga. After coming back to school, many of our students started calling me Sifu. My Sifu for kung fu told me no, and that I am to be addressed as Si Hing. So, my question is, why cant I be addressed as Sifu? I am a teacher or instructor, just not in kung fu.

How different is that than the medical field? If you are a Dr. for Cardiology or Dr of Pediatrics, doesnt matter, you are still addressed as Dr. so why should that matter in my case??

Your thoughts are appreciated.

 

[jks9199]

Hello everyone. I had a question that I thought that I would bring up here. I have been training in kung fu and am an Asst Instructor for kung fu. Now, this past summer, I became a certified instructor in krav maga. After coming back to school, many of our students started calling me Sifu. My Sifu for kung fu told me no, and that I am to be addressed as Si Hing. So, my question is, why cant I be addressed as Sifu? I am a teacher or instructor, just not in kung fu.

How different is that than the medical field? If you are a Dr. for Cardiology or Dr of Pediatrics, doesnt matter, you are still addressed as Dr. so why should that matter in my case??

Your thoughts are appreciated.

I'd say your too hung up on titles, kind of like a Ph.D. who insists on being addressed as "doctor" at all times. In the US, outside of academic and some formal settings, only medical doctors are commonly addressed as Dr.

If you are teaching krav maga, you're the teacher. If you're in kung fu class -- you are a student.

 

[Tez3]

Just to confuse things lol, here consultants are called Mr. not doctor! It's supposed to denote, respectfully, their experience and high position!

 

[punisher73]

Because usually the title of "sifu" is to denote an instructor in kung fu. It is a way to designate a hierarchy and level of experience for students.

You earned the title of "instructor" in krav maga, and when instructing that or teaching classes it would be appropriate.

In the same vein, you list being a purple belt in kenpo. Would it be appropriate for students to call you an instructor in that style? Nope, you don't have the experience and knowledge yet in that style. Same thing for you in kung fu. You are on the way, but are not there yet in your training and experience.

 

[mograph]

If there's any doubt in your mind or in the mind of an objective observer, I'd err on the side of humility: not to be called "Sifu".

In my opinion, just being an instructor doesn't make you a Sifu. Technically, in Mandarin, it makes you a laoshi. To be a Sifu, to my mind, requires having passed through a number of toughening leadership experiences leading to a deeper understanding of the art combined with a humility that comes with seasoning and maturity.

Another thing: I think that being prematurely addressed as "sifu" would devalue the title.

Finally, I think that when you're worthy of the title, you'll know it, but paradoxically, it won't matter.

 

[Nolerama]

You've got a lot of styles under your belt...

How about being addressed as "Coach"?

 

[masherdong]

Because usually the title of "sifu" is to denote an instructor in kung fu. It is a way to designate a hierarchy and level of experience for students.

Not true. I have heard school teachers and music teachers being addressed as Sifu as well. My chinese relatives feel that I should be addressed as Sifu because it is my highest title and I am teaching.

 

[terryl965]

Not true. I have heard school teachers and music teachers being addressed as Sifu as well. My chinese relatives feel that I should be addressed as Sifu because it is my highest title and I am teaching.

Well to be honest with you Masherdog, you are not the Sifu of the school your instructor is. If you would like people o call you Sifu than go and open a school and pronounce yourself that title, otherwise just go and train and forget about something so small and has no merit anyway.

My students call me Master or Sabanim simply because I am and I own and operate my school but most importantly they call me that because I have earned there respect both on the matt and outside the school, my humbleness over the years have given me the respect of my peers as well.

You seem to be hung up by even posting a board to ask this question is simply improper to me. I hope your insurcurities will not be your downfall in the Arts.

 

[KELLYG]

I was under the impression that the Main or Head, or Chief instructor should be called Sifu, or in TKD Master. Because you are an in instructor, in a different style, does not mean that you are sifu in kung-fu. The Title Sifu would be reserved for your teacher, unless he thinks it is OK for you to be addressed that way.

 

[Xue Sheng]

I have taught, I was even labeled a teacher by my first sifu and I also help my Taiji sifu teach and as far as I'm concerned my first name is fine.

My Taiji sifu and my sanda sifu both use their first names and that is fine with me.

Sifu is just a title; don't get hung up on titles

But is it is a title question you are not a sifu in your Kung Fu class only your sifu is therefore no you are not a sifu there.

If my Taiji sifu's sifu were still alive and he went back to help him teach he would not be a sifu there, he is a student of his sifu and at best a martial arts older brother to all of his sifu's students.

However if I walked into the room he is my sifu and his sifu is my sigung. I would be the only one in the room calling him sifu since I am the only one that is his student. All the rest are his sifu's students and I am their younger brother or possibly whatever the term in CMA for nephew is since they would all be 5th generation and I am 6th. Traditional CMA etiquette can get rather confusing

 

[Jdokan]

I would suggest you look to obtain greater knowledge in your art and not a title. Students will know how to refer to you based upon that... I would never refer to myself as Master...yet my that is what my students call me....Personally I think the whole title thing is kind of silly....I prefer to train and exchange.....

 

[masherdong]

You seem to be hung up by even posting a board to ask this question is simply improper to me. I hope your insurcurities will not be your downfall in the Arts.

Not insecure, just curious. Your right, it's just a title. I ask this cause my in-laws thought that I should. Heck, everyone in kung fu addresses me as Mr. Mark and I am ok with that.

I was trying to see why they would think I should and that is why I thought about doctors and tried to do a similarity.

I'm with you Terry I just want to train too. But, if my in-laws are giving me an earful, I would like to know why.

 

[Tensei85]

Actually there are two different Sifu(s) in Chinese which I'm sure your aware of. 師父 Sifu - Which is your Sifu/directly related to you,
師傅 Sifu which is the title that you refer to other including chefs, cab drivers whatever/whoever is a leader in there specialized field.

Then given as Xue stated Sifu in the case of genealogy: You can't be a Sifu of the students in the school when they are already a student(s) of your Sifu which makes them in lineage rights the same generation as you are. But then when you use the term Sifu it would cause unwanted confusion based on genealogy. But your the Sihing or even Dai Sihing which a lot of times does several times more work than the Sifu in a lot of Schools anyways. Now when you go out & have an actual Sifu to To Dai relationship with those not students of your Sifu than they can call you their Sifu.

So I'm not saying that your not a Sifu level by your systems evaluation or what not, but in this case it would not be politically correct.

Good luck with traning.

 

[masherdong]

Actually there are two different Sifu(s) in Chinese which I'm sure your aware of. 師父 Sifu - Which is your Sifu/directly related to you,
師傅 Sifu which is the title that you refer to other including chefs, cab drivers whatever/whoever is a leader in there specialized field.

Yes, I believe this is why my in-laws were saying this. Like I said, I was just curious and wanted to know why they were yelling at me for not being called a Sifu.

Oh, by the way, I do have my own location and teach my own students.

 

[terryl965]

Not insecure, just curious. Your right, it's just a title. I ask this cause my in-laws thought that I should. Heck, everyone in kung fu addresses me as Mr. Mark and I am ok with that.

I was trying to see why they would think I should and that is why I thought about doctors and tried to do a similarity.

I'm with you Terry I just want to train too. But, if my in-laws are giving me an earful, I would like to know why.

I understand your delima and only hope the best possible outcome for you and your inlaws.

 

[Xue Sheng]

I'm with you Terry I just want to train too. But, if my in-laws are giving me an earful, I would like to know why.

If it helps;

My Sanda sifu is trained in and from Heilongjiang and he does not really want to be called sifu at all and he has been training Sanda for over 30 years.

My Taiji sifu is also from China and spent all of his taiji training life in Hong Kong and does not mind being called sifu but most certainly does not expect it (generally goes by his first name) and he has been doing taiji and only taiji for more than 50 years. The only time he gets demanding about titles is of you try and call him grandmaster... then he demands that you stop calling him that

 

[Flying Crane]

If your sifu says no, then the answer is no. There is no further discussion.

Whatever happens outside the kwoon, when you are doing Krav Maga, or Kajukenbo or something else, is separate from the kwoon, and is subject to its own rules.

 

[clfsean]

One school... one sifu. End of story really.

Your teachers school... he's the sifu & you're sihing to everybody under you. If you need a title at his school, sihing is best. If that's not ok, try gaau lin.

Your school... you're the sifu & your sifu is your student's sigung.

 

[Carol]

I was once in a meeting with a few PhD level scientists, and a couple of vice presidents. The company had a policy of not utilizing the title of "Doctor" at any time. (There were many scientists there with a terminal degree).

At the end of the meeting, one of our newer scientists took issue with the policy and asked why he couldn't be called "Dr." after working very hard for his science degree. His VP just looked at him, shrugged, and said "Big deal. I have three of them. From MIT. What are they going to call me? DoctorDoctorDoctor? Doctor Cubed?"

The complaining scientist never brought the subject up again.

Remember, part of growing in to a leadership role is knowing how to manage other people's expectations, as well as your own.

 

[Punchy]

If your si-fu is also the si-fu of the others in the class then you are classmates, which makes you their si-hing. Even if you do go on to earn the title of sifu from your si-fu, you will always be their si-hing.