My TKD Journey with ATA

BobS761

White Belt
Joined
Mar 17, 2012
Messages
3
Reaction score
1
I haven't posted much, but wanted to share my perspective on TKD. First off,my son wanted to practice martial arts. Admittedly, to my dismay, he has given up all his stick and ball sports, but since he is doing something, I can live with it.

So, in my area our choices were limited, and after visiting some schools and clubs, we settled on an ATA school. So, signed the contract, won't say how much other than it was less than dance lessons for the girl, and had at it. Within a month, I'm thinking, "I can do that". (Mea culpa, 50 year old body, 20 year old brain.) I think I could barely walk for a week after that first session.

So now my son and I are learning Songahm Taekwondo. We train 2 to 3 times a week. I'm fitter, stronger and more flexible that this time last year, son is an athlete anyway, but he is more focused, and more level headed. (God gave them to you as lovable babies, so you wouldn't kill them as teenagers.) We are both advancing, and learning.

Generally, at my "McDojang", my instructor has us working pretty hard on basic fitness, then specific TKD skills, and finally forms. he encourages where needed and corrects where needed. He expects the complete best from each students ability. He also admits his imperfections, and demonstrates his own will to improve. What really surprised me has his ability to coach and push us out of our comfort zones. Admittedly, I'm not ever going to be the next Chuck Norris, but I see Black Belt as an attainable goal. And, according to my instructor, that's when the real journey begins.

Now on my journey, I find out that ATA sucks and we aren't real martial artists. Worse, it's just a money making scheme for the school owners. (I know what I pay, I looked around and counted heads, and I'm glad I have a day job, There isn't a Lambo in the owners parking space.) And, I wonder why? Because we had a Grand Master with a different vision? Doesen't every style, and every martial art? Is there never innovation? I mean, we train, we kick, we punch, we spar, (sometimes vigorously), and we learn. And some are better than others. Yep, I said it, some are better than others. Some get that black belt and are gone, and some don't get past white belt. And some continue for a lifetime. But most of our goals are the same, be fit, be active, and learn TKD.

Mostly, though, I appreciate my school, and my instructor. He is dedicated to us, yet, as a reasonable adult, I know he has to eat. I feel we get his best, and that in turn deserves our best.

Maybe my son and I are just lucky.

B
 

jks9199

Administrator
Staff member
Lifetime Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2006
Messages
23,508
Reaction score
3,852
Location
Northern VA
Not every ATA -- or any other martial art -- school is run as a business with almost no eye towards the actual growth and development of the students. If you're happy there, and happy with the training you're getting, and you're getting what you want and expect, that's great, and it's what really matters. The only caution I'll throw in applies equal to every other school out there: It may or may not be giving you good preparation for real violence; you have to assess and look carefully to be sure that it is answering that need, IF that's what you're after.
 
Last edited:

bluewaveschool

2nd Black Belt
Joined
Sep 16, 2010
Messages
745
Reaction score
13
Location
Kentucky
Black Belt factories aren't limited to any organization, or any style for that matter. I like to think that most of us on here that teach have a true love for it, and care about our students progress and not just the money they hand over (for those of you that get paid).
 

Gentle Fist

Master Black Belt
Joined
May 2, 2004
Messages
1,145
Reaction score
15
Location
U.S.A.
Good to hear of an ATA school that goes against the grind and is not about money :)
 
OP
B

BobS761

White Belt
Joined
Mar 17, 2012
Messages
3
Reaction score
1
As for real world self defense? I think I am much more prepared for that event, if it ever comes. If nothing else, just the increased clarity of mind gleaned from sparring. But in all honesty, I'm probably not going to whip out my TKD chops on someone. In my rural area, the chances of meeting violence is not great on a day to day basis on the street. But on a fairly regular basis, my instructor throws out the cirriculum and we get a "what if" class, and a chance to practice responses. I suppose it's TKD based, but really (it seems after being demonstrated) simple things to escape or give yourself space. Besides, I'm pretty sure at my level of fitness, if I don't dispatch an attacker within a minute or so, I'm toast anyway. Like I said earlier, I'm better than I was, but by no means an olympic athlete. :bangahead:

B
 

Instructor

Master of Arts
Supporting Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2012
Messages
1,645
Reaction score
558
Location
Knoxville, TN
It sounds to me like you found a pretty good place and an instructor who is trying to do things right. Hopefully others will follow his lead.
 

sfs982000

Master Black Belt
Joined
Oct 14, 2009
Messages
1,090
Reaction score
40
Location
Woodbury, MN
I haven't posted much, but wanted to share my perspective on TKD. First off,my son wanted to practice martial arts. Admittedly, to my dismay, he has given up all his stick and ball sports, but since he is doing something, I can live with it.

So, in my area our choices were limited, and after visiting some schools and clubs, we settled on an ATA school. So, signed the contract, won't say how much other than it was less than dance lessons for the girl, and had at it. Within a month, I'm thinking, "I can do that". (Mea culpa, 50 year old body, 20 year old brain.) I think I could barely walk for a week after that first session.

So now my son and I are learning Songahm Taekwondo. We train 2 to 3 times a week. I'm fitter, stronger and more flexible that this time last year, son is an athlete anyway, but he is more focused, and more level headed. (God gave them to you as lovable babies, so you wouldn't kill them as teenagers.) We are both advancing, and learning.

Generally, at my "McDojang", my instructor has us working pretty hard on basic fitness, then specific TKD skills, and finally forms. he encourages where needed and corrects where needed. He expects the complete best from each students ability. He also admits his imperfections, and demonstrates his own will to improve. What really surprised me has his ability to coach and push us out of our comfort zones. Admittedly, I'm not ever going to be the next Chuck Norris, but I see Black Belt as an attainable goal. And, according to my instructor, that's when the real journey begins.

Now on my journey, I find out that ATA sucks and we aren't real martial artists. Worse, it's just a money making scheme for the school owners. (I know what I pay, I looked around and counted heads, and I'm glad I have a day job, There isn't a Lambo in the owners parking space.) And, I wonder why? Because we had a Grand Master with a different vision? Doesen't every style, and every martial art? Is there never innovation? I mean, we train, we kick, we punch, we spar, (sometimes vigorously), and we learn. And some are better than others. Yep, I said it, some are better than others. Some get that black belt and are gone, and some don't get past white belt. And some continue for a lifetime. But most of our goals are the same, be fit, be active, and learn TKD.

Mostly, though, I appreciate my school, and my instructor. He is dedicated to us, yet, as a reasonable adult, I know he has to eat. I feel we get his best, and that in turn deserves our best.

Maybe my son and I are just lucky.

B

I'm in the same boat as you, although my kids went on to do other sports after about 6-7 month, but I'm still plugging away. Considering the reputation that the ATA gets on-line, I feel very fortunate that I have a great instructor that does a great job of motivating and coaching us to do our best every class.
 

Balrog

Master of Arts
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
1,764
Reaction score
482
Location
Houston, TX
As an long-time ATA instructor and school owner, I have to say that the major problem we have is people adopting business models that are not much better than used car salesmanship. The Songahm style of Taekwondo is very strong, but when it gets downplayed to second fiddle behind selling upgrades, we all suffer.

School owners in any discipline deserve to be able to make a decent living teaching their art. But I look at it this way: do I need to have a Lambo when my Nissan gets me from Point A to Point B comfortably and cheaply, and lets me carry my gear bag easily? I don't think so. And yet, too many owners in too many disciplines think that if they aren't hauling in $100k a month, they're not doing something right. They quit focusing on teaching quality martial arts and start focusing on cranking bodies through their school.

I'm old-fashioned. I teach my students for a flat rate. My "programs" are a two month intro so that they can make a better-informed decision to make a long-term commitment, and then a Master Club that is 36 months long to take them to First Degree. At First Degree, they can renew it to continue training. Leadership is by invitation only and we don't charge extra for that; that's my potential pool of future instructors. Once someone gets their first level of certification, I'll usually waive their monthly dues because by then, they are earning "sweat equity" by teaching in the school.

We all have different points of view, but to me, it's all about the art. Teach quality martial arts and you'll be successful. You might not be rich, but you'll do okay financially.

My $0.02 worth....
 

SPX

Black Belt
Joined
Dec 1, 2011
Messages
590
Reaction score
6
I always do love hearing stories about the ATA, both positive and negative. The positive stories bring hope and the negative stories bring lulz.

I've heard of a handful of "renegade" ATA schools that are actually pretty good, with a strong martial focus and harder/more realistic than usual sparring.

Personally, unless I could find one of these great schools that I felt gave a comparable martial education to what I could find in another TKD org or perhaps a good karate class, I would avoid the ATA as a primary style, but I have sometimes thought it could be something fun to do as a secondary activity. And it sounds like you are having fun, getting in better shape, and learning at least some basic self-defense. If that's what you're looking for, then it's all good.
 

ETinCYQX

Master Black Belt
Joined
Nov 24, 2009
Messages
1,313
Reaction score
19
Location
Gander
As long as you are learning and improving yourself, my opinion or anyone else's opinion on ATA means absolutely nothing. Enjoy Taekwondo and I'm glad it's helping you and your son. ATA has an excellent tournament circuit too if you or your son has athletic aspirations.
 

Earl Weiss

Senior Master
Joined
Jan 27, 2009
Messages
3,584
Reaction score
929
Current issue of BB Mag has an article on the ATA & it's 50th anniversary.
 

Kwan Jang

Purple Belt
Joined
Sep 9, 2006
Messages
345
Reaction score
27
Location
Gallatin, TN. (suburb of Nashville)
I would guess that there are many school owners and instructors in the ATA that are like the OP's and are dedicated and really care about their students progress and helping them to grow beyond their comfort zones. IMO, any student that can find an instructor that does that, regardless of style, org., ect. has found something worthwhile. One of the main objections that many in the industry have with the ATA is the lower standards of quality and requirements that the org. as a whole enforce/require. In addition, some of the business practices that some of the higher ups in the ATA actually have shared (or sold) to other schools in the industry have been questionable at best. These business models have been solicited to other schools outside of the ATA's org as the "secrets" of their business success and they are not something that I would personally feel morally right in doing. I also feel that this model has done quite a bit to damage the overall integrity of the industry in the eyes of the general public, just as the watering down of black belt standards has hurt the overall image and perception of a BB in the mind of the general public.

I am NOT against an instructor or school owner making a very good living from teaching martial arts or running a professional school and being profitable. To the contrary, I believe that a senior black belt should be a highly skilled professional educator and should be as well paid as other professionals. (my wife who works with me just bought a Porsche a few weeks ago). It's just that the DVD that was sent to me by some of the top leaders of the ATA telling me how to buy into their business plan and giving examples of it was DEFINITELY NOT in the best interest of the students and their families and I would get out of the industry before I ever ran my school that way. I also cringe to think about the long term effects on our industry and it's reputation when other schools pull this garbage. This does NOT mean that ALL school owners or instructors within the org. come with either this philosophy or business model, but those of us who looked over the material might be a bit suspicious when the ATA is mentioned.
 

Balrog

Master of Arts
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
1,764
Reaction score
482
Location
Houston, TX
It's just that the DVD that was sent to me by some of the top leaders of the ATA telling me how to buy into their business plan and giving examples of it was DEFINITELY NOT in the best interest of the students and their families and I would get out of the industry before I ever ran my school that way. I also cringe to think about the long term effects on our industry and it's reputation when other schools pull this garbage. This does NOT mean that ALL school owners or instructors within the org. come with either this philosophy or business model, but those of us who looked over the material might be a bit suspicious when the ATA is mentioned.
That's what I said earlier. When the business model gets in the way of teaching quality martial arts, we all suffer. And it's not just ATA - there are a ton of schools from different organizations that have the same issues.
 
Top