Legality of Martial Arts

[Highlander]

The Empty Cup Podcast: The Legal Ramifications of Defending Yourself: Interview With Jason Korol

This file has some audio issues. Gets better towards the middle. Worth the listen.
Especially for non traditional artists

 

[CB Jones]

Didnt care for it.

Neither one seemed like they new much about the legalities of self defense.

 

[Buka]

I think people have false worry about self defense legalities. However, if you are a person who gets into a lot of self defense situations you should worry ......about a lot of things, more than we'll address here, like "what the hell is wrong with you?".

But if you're just a regular person you shouldn't worry, just live your life, train, be a good person and don't restomp the groin.

 

[CB Jones]

I think people have false worry about self defense legalities. However, if you are a person who gets into a lot of self defense situations you should worry ......about a lot of things, more than we'll address here, like "what the hell is wrong with you?".

But if you're just a regular person you shouldn't worry, just live your life, train, be a good person and don't restomp the groin.

It just makes me cringe a little when people start giving legal advice without a lot of knowledge about the actual legal side of it. Creates a lot of misconceptions on what is legal and what is not.

 

[Danny T]

Yeah...not much on the legalities of self defense. Lot on opinion.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

It just makes me cringe a little when people start giving legal advice without a lot of knowledge about the actual legal side of it. Creates a lot of misconceptions on what is legal and what is not.

I think - especially within the self-defense oriented world - there's a lot of bits and pieces passed around and rebroadcast by folks who don't really understand them.

 

[Buka]

Maybe I'm just being naive, I don't know, but in nearly fifty years nobody I've ever trained, in fact nobody I actually know, ever had a problem concerning the legalities of self defense. And it's not like I don't get out a lot.

But now I'm curious. Any of you guys know of anyone who had that problem? Maybe I'll ask other guys I know who've been around forever, and in the arts as long or longer than me.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Maybe I'm just being naive, I don't know, but in nearly fifty years nobody I've ever trained, in fact nobody I actually know, ever had a problem concerning the legalities of self defense. And it's not like I don't get out a lot.

But now I'm curious. Any of you guys know of anyone who had that problem? Maybe I'll ask other guys I know who've been around forever, and in the arts as long or longer than me.

I can't think of anyone who's run into any legal issues, except some folks being idiots (so not really self-defense).

 

[dvcochran]

I remember being threated with legal action a several times when I was at the PD and still teaching. It never happened though. Usually someone who was pissed off in the moment and was going to sue everybody. I see no greater risk of litigation just because a person is proficient in MA. Quite the opposite I think.
I do remember being quizzed about my "credentials" several times in the courtroom. Never amounted to anything however.

 

[Highlander]

One of my students got attacked by a guy with a machete. A guy got road rage followed him to his home and attacked him with a machete. My student swept him to the ground by his throat and punched him a few times and his head hit the pavement. The guy went to the ICU and eventually filed a civil lawsuit. Ended up getting dismissed because he filed a suit against the attacker first. My dude's dad was an undercover cop and a student of my dad for a long time. Suit ended up getting dropped. Just because you're in the right doesnt mean you wont get screw in the end.

The reason I like this pod is because they talk about the fights worth getting into vs the fights not worth getting into. The fights that you can walk away from should never happen. Also liked how they discussed how self defense can easily swap from one side to the other. Personally think they have good convo and gave solid advice

 

[Highlander]

Just wondering. For you guys who didnt like the podcast. Did you listen to the whole thing?

 

[CB Jones]

Also liked how they discussed how self defense can easily swap from one side to the other.

But that is a misconception. In most states, you can not claim self defense in the commission of a crime.

If you attack someone unprovoked....your claim of self defense goes out the window.

There was just to many misconceptions about what is legal and how to handle reporting it. They should of just stuck to discussing about staying out of fights.

 

[thanson02]

Maybe I'm just being naive, I don't know, but in nearly fifty years nobody I've ever trained, in fact nobody I actually know, ever had a problem concerning the legalities of self defense. And it's not like I don't get out a lot.

But now I'm curious. Any of you guys know of anyone who had that problem? Maybe I'll ask other guys I know who've been around forever, and in the arts as long or longer than me.

None that I know of. In the US, self-defense laws are different from state-to-state. In Wisconsin (where I live), you have to do some digging and talk to people in law enforcement to get a clear picture on how the laws work and even then they will give you the run-around because they don't want people going out and using the grey areas of the laws to get into fights. I didn't get any strait answers until I started working hospital security and they felt I needed to know the details for my job.

 

[Highlander]

But that is a misconception. In most states, you can not claim self defense in the commission of a crime.

If you attack someone unprovoked....your claim of self defense goes out the window.

There was just to many misconceptions about what is legal and how to handle reporting it. They should of just stuck to discussing about staying out of fights.

Yes but if the guy you attacked gets on top of you and starts pounding you're head in because you punched him. Now you fear for your life and could use a force multiplier with a solid legal defense.

 

[Highlander]

There was just to many misconceptions about what is legal and how to handle reporting it.

What misconceptions did you hear. This would be a great topic worth discussing

 

[Highlander]

But now I'm curious. Any of you guys know of anyone who had that problem? Maybe I'll ask other guys I know who've been around forever, and in the arts as long or longer than me.

They give a couples examples of this in the podcast. Summary- 2 friends went into friends room during party. Random dude was in there with a chick. Tried to punch home owner when asked to get out. Home owners friend stopped the punch and chain punched him back. Guy left went to the cops and got the friend arrested for "jumping him". Ended up settling out of court to save money

 

[Gweilo]

I am not sure, why it takes 1 hour and 17 min to debate, if a person punches me, I am entitled to stop and restrain, or punch them back, I am not entitled to stop restrain ,then punch them 20 times, snap their arm, or break a leg, any actions other than reasonable actions, you have to be prepared to convince 12 people of your actions

 

[JP3]

I think - especially within the self-defense oriented world - there's a lot of bits and pieces passed around and rebroadcast by folks who don't really understand them.

That method of "gaining knowledge" isn't limited to the SD arena,. It is quite prevalent all over the place, I've found.

 

[dvcochran]

One of my students got attacked by a guy with a machete. A guy got road rage followed him to his home and attacked him with a machete. My student swept him to the ground by his throat and punched him a few times and his head hit the pavement. The guy went to the ICU and eventually filed a civil lawsuit. Ended up getting dismissed because he filed a suit against the attacker first. My dude's dad was an undercover cop and a student of my dad for a long time. Suit ended up getting dropped. Just because you're in the right doesnt mean you wont get screw in the end.

The reason I like this pod is because they talk about the fights worth getting into vs the fights not worth getting into. The fights that you can walk away from should never happen. Also liked how they discussed how self defense can easily swap from one side to the other. Personally think they have good convo and gave solid advice

Did this happen in KY? I live in TN. The ease to video things now-a-days MAY make me think twice about an outright strike to someone unless they attacked first. A restraint or takedown I would not hesitate. Not very sure how sound that logic is however.
My wife is an attorney and she has often said TN is the patron saint of the counter-suit. That a counter-suit usually carries more clout than who files first. Sad that it has to be that way.

 

[CB Jones]

Yes but if the guy you attacked gets on top of you and starts pounding you're head in because you punched him. Now you fear for your life and could use a force multiplier with a solid legal defense.

No....that would be Manslaughter or Aggravated Battery