Kenpo Question

[Mon Mon]

I do not study Kenpo but i am curious as i have read some of my Arts books I have heard how Kenpo came to Japan. I am wondering what is the relation to Japanese Bujutsu and Kenpo? Also What was the first style of Kenpo in China and how did Kenpo become Kung Fu or how are the 2 similar and different in techniques or philosiphy?


Thank You

 

[theletch1]

The best way to find out what you want to know is to check out www.tracyskenpo.com He has a fairly detailed history of kenpo on his site as well as a short history of James Mitose. Mr. Mitose is responsible for bringing kenpo from Japan to the U.S. Happy hunting! Theletch1

 

[Blindside]

Hi Mon Mon,

Lets just say the history of kenpo is an ongoing debate, and that there is NO concensus.

Basically, everyone coming off Ed Parker can get back to his instructor, Professor Chow, then the debate takes off.

Good luck and take everything with a grain of salt,

Lamont

 

[kenpo3631]

Originally posted by theletch1
The best way to find out what you want to know is to check out www.tracyskenpo.com He has a fairly detailed history of kenpo on his site as well as a short history of James Mitose. Mr. Mitose is responsible for bringing kenpo from Japan to the U.S. Happy hunting! Theletch1

You may want to bring your pillow too. Tracy is very long winded and some of it seems a bit hokey, considering all the "secret" file stuff. What up with the Parker bashing stuff?... Just my opinion though

 

[Samurai]

My understanding is the term "Kenpo" or "Kempo" is another translation of the Chinese term "chunfa" or loosely translated, FIST ARTS.

Now kenpo is not kung-fu, but the orgins are in the Chinese fighting arts.

Jeremy Bays

 

[theletch1]

Ok, I didn't say the only way to find out what you wanted to know was from the Tracy site..... it is a good starting point though to point you in the right direction. There are as many different ideas as to the specific history as there are students of the art. It seems our history is just as maleable as our future. I, for one am content with going back as far as professor Chow and then seeing just how many different theories I can find from there.

"Make civilized the mind... Make savage the body"

 

[jazkiljok]

Originally posted by Samurai
My understanding is the term "Kenpo" or "Kempo" is another translation of the Chinese term "chunfa" or loosely translated, FIST ARTS.

Now kenpo is not kung-fu, but the orgins are in the Chinese fighting arts.

Jeremy Bays

yes, a term also used by the Okinawan masters who came to Japan to spread their arts. It was commonly used in tandem as in Karate Kenpo, long before Mitose came along. The Okinawan's had less issues with referring back to the Chinese mother arts then the Japanese, so they kept on using it even when "karate" was changed to mean empty hands (dropping the chinese connected "t'ang" hand)

In fact when the the Japanese Karate Club in Hawaii invited the leading masters in Japan to the islands back in the 20s and 30s just before the war- ads for demo's called them masters of karate and kenpo. All well before Mitose started his Self Defense Club.

So Mitose didn't bring Kenpo to the islands.

But again as you note- Kenpo is like saying Chuanfa and it doesn't really tell you anything about the style or what is being taught.

Ed Parker put Kenpo on the map in the states (even worldwide) and his dominance and popularity there transformed Kenpo from a generic term to one more closely associated with what he was teaching in the arts.

peace.
:asian:

 

[WilliamTLear]

Originally posted by Samurai
My understanding is the term "Kenpo" or "Kempo" is another translation of the Chinese term "chunfa" or loosely translated, FIST ARTS.

Now kenpo is not kung-fu, but the orgins are in the Chinese fighting arts.

Jeremy Bays

KENPO is translated Fist Law, or law of the fist (just a minor point, although the understanding could be the same as chuanfa).

As for Kenpo being a martial arts style... American Kenpo is not really a style of martial art, but a system. Just some clarifications from a Kenpoists point of view.

Sincerely,
Billy Lear :asian:

 

[WilliamTLear]

Originally posted by kenpo3631
You may want to bring your pillow too. Tracy is very long winded and some of it seems a bit hokey, considering all the "secret" file stuff. What up with the Parker bashing stuff?... Just my opinion though

I think that some of the things posted on Al Tracy's site is pretty far fetched, especially about Mitose and the lineage information presented there. I've always been told by all of the instructors I've had (Trejo being one of them) that Mitose isn't part of our lineage, oh well... No reason to beat that dead horse again... It's almost unrecognizable.

Sincerely,
Billy Lear

P.S. You back from Bosnia?

 

[kenpo3631]

Originally posted by WilliamTLear
I think that some of the things posted on Al Tracy's site is pretty far fetched, especially about Mitose and the lineage information presented there. I've always been told by all of the instructors I've had (Trejo being one of them) that Mitose isn't part of our lineage, oh well... No reason to beat that dead horse again... It's almost unrecognizable.

Sincerely,
Billy Lear

P.S. You back from Bosnia?

Not yet...

This post came from Germany. I am at the staging point for the actual deployment. Typical Army....:rofl: We get activated then wait three months to get in country.:asian:

 

[WilliamTLear]

Originally posted by kenpo3631
Not yet...

This post came from Germany. I am at the staging point for the actual deployment. Typical Army....:rofl: We get activated then wait three months to get in country.:asian:

I remember.

HURRY UP, AND WAIT!

Good to see you posting.

Keep in touch,
Billy Lear, UKS :asian:

 

[Chronuss]

one of the best places to start for some history is The Journey by Tom Bleecker. very good book with some histories and experiences of some of the high ranking Kenpo practioners of today, including Mr. C., who is on this board, Mr. Trejo, and Mr. Planas, even Elvis is included. also, the Infinite Insights series has some Kenpo history throughout all five books.

 

[bahenlaura]

Originally posted by WilliamTLear
I think that some of the things posted on Al Tracy's site is pretty far fetched, especially about Mitose and the lineage information presented there. I've always been told by all of the instructors I've had (Trejo being one of them) that Mitose isn't part of our lineage, oh well... No reason to beat that dead horse again... It's almost unrecognizable.

Sincerely,
Billy Lear

P.S. You back from Bosnia?

i agree.
you just have to go on the net read on. there are lots and lots of info. when you are finished use common sence and go from there.
don't believe verything you read.
don't believe me.

 

[Kenpomachine]

It's amazing how many good informations you can get from you, guys. :asian:
Over here we only get a piece of the history and the rest you have to go search on the net, and as bahenlaura said, you can't believe all you read :shrug:

 

[theletch1]

I've heard it said that you should believe nothing you read and only half of what you see..... makes researching our history a bit tough doesn't it. There are enough folks on this forum that you should be able to get just as confused as the rest of us and then come to your own conclusion.... until some one comes up with a time machine to find the "truth" any way.

"make civilized the mind....make savage the body"

 

[WilliamTLear]

Originally posted by theletch1
I've heard it said that you should believe nothing you read and only half of what you see..... makes researching our history a bit tough doesn't it. There are enough folks on this forum that you should be able to get just as confused as the rest of us and then come to your own conclusion.... until some one comes up with a time machine to find the "truth" any way.

"make civilized the mind....make savage the body"

There is always someone out there that can tell you their version of the truth... Expereince is the best teacher.

 

[Michael Billings]

Oss Billy. The grasshopper learns from riding the wind.

-MB:asian:

 

[bahenlaura]

Originally posted by Michael Billings
Oss Billy. The grasshopper learns from riding the wind.

-MB:asian:

Ooosss!

However when the wind gets too violant. Grasshopper needs to have faith and land somewhere for shelter.

:asian:

 

[Katie Simmons]

Originally posted by kenpo3631
You may want to bring your pillow too. Tracy is very long winded and some of it seems a bit hokey, considering all the "secret" file stuff. What up with the Parker bashing stuff?... Just my opinion though

Parker and Tracy had a falling out back in the late seventies (or therabouts). It was basically the start of all the bad blood between the American Kenpo people and the Tracy crew. It deeply hurt both Ed Parker and Al Tracy; neither of them ever got over it. All the bashing is just spite. They each sort of trained their respective followings against the other, and we all know how it went from there. Anyhow, we know for sure that Ed Parker taught both Al and Jim Tracy. To get the history further back, just contact Ted Sumner at www.sanjosekenpo.com. He's got documentation for most of it.

 

[Chronuss]

Or...if you're feeling reeeaaaalllly brave, you could ask Mr. C. on this very board. Mr. C. is a very knowledgable man whom I've the esteemed pleasure (or maybe he had) of beating my fat **** around. usually, if you ask Mr. C., he'll usually get back to you.