Is Tae Kwon Do useful

[noonesfool]

I signed up 2 months ago for Tae Kwon Do and I'm starting to doubt it's usefulness.
I signed up for self defense purposes and I'm not impressed with it so far.
I've learned some kicks but they are useless against a close attack and less effective for actual defense.
I'm not into sparring at all since they love tap you and does'nt mirror real agression.
The instructor lied to me and said it was "self defense" so can anyone point me to a art for slef defense.
I signed up for Ying Jow Pai Kung Fu and it seems more into actually defending yourself.
I've been there one month and I used some moves on a red belt and they could not counter them effectively so I wonder.

 

[Mon Mon]

I will say this i am happy you found an art that suties you if your still looking for a defensive martial art then i would recomend any martial art that dose not compete in turnaments. The Martial Arts that don't compete in Tournaments Generally are used for Self Defence Alone. But it really depends on what your looking for.

 

[jfarnsworth]

If your looking for practical self defense knowledge you'll have to look else where. If you want to learn to kick and very well then TKD is for you.

 

[ThuNder_FoOt]

I'm sorry Taekwondo couldn't help you to find your path. I believe that you need to do all types of sparring. Whether its full-contact, light-contact... which ever. I believe they all have individual qualities to be gained no matter what your goals are.

 

[arnisador]

Many TKD schools, esp. in the U.S., are very sports-oriented and may not be as good for self-defense as one might hope. This isn't true of all of them! I agree however that if you've found something good for you, that's great! Please post about your Ying Jow Pai Kung Fu experiences in teh Chiese Martial Arts--General forum! There is some discussion of this style (Northern Eagle Claw) there, e.g.:
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1739

 

[RCastillo]

Originally posted by ThuNder_FoOt
I'm sorry Taekwondo couldn't help you to find your path. I believe that you need to do all types of sparring. Whether its full-contact, light-contact... which ever. I believe they all have individual qualities to be gained no matter what your goals are.

Good point!

The sad part is, TKD can be good, but they caught up in too much protocol, and chain of command that they forget to focus on what the students need, want.:asian:

 

[noonesfool]

Thank you all for your 2 cents about the situation but I believe my Master stinks period.
I'm sure Tae Kwon is a great art but it was misrepresented to me from the start.
My master does'nt care about the student since he has a contract that he uses to lock you in for 1 year.
I just got promoted in Tae Kwon but I was not taught the basics by the master to pass.
He assigned a black belt to teach me the tenants of Tae Kwon and the counting system in Korean and he got frustrated and told me to fake it because he did'nt know himself.
I told the master and he shrugged it off and said look online.
I taught myself and when I passed I told him off some..
The students from the other schools knew the game but I was the only one from my school and I was behind.
What is a real dojang and master supposed to be like?
I was given a 20 minute class once and then told to go home because I did'nt need to know anymore.

 

[karatekid1975]

noonesfool,

I feel for you. I'm also at a McDojang. I'm sure there is great TKD schools out there, but they are few and far between these days.

I just got back from visiting home and my original dojang (Tang Soo Do). I had the best workout there since I left a year ago. This TKD dojang doesn't even compare to my TSD dojang. I forgot how hard it was there (TSD). The workouts are intense, the self defense is realistic, even the sparring has take-downs ...... I could go on, but I would make this dojang (TKD) look really bad.

I know some TKD dojangs do teach self defense, but what I learned here (TKD) is, in my opinion, not realistic.

You just have to find a REAL TKD dojang. Not a "sport" one. Since you know now what to look for, ask questions ..... a lot of questions. If the instructor is not willing to answer or won't let you watch classes, get the hell out. Go find someone who will.

 

[J-kid]

Some TKD kicks are ok but most TKD schools suck , Alot of tkd schools are labeled mcdojo Meaning belt factorys where you really dont learn much in self defense. On the plus side i know someone who has crosstrained and using alot of TKD kicks effectivly , There punchs are crap and alot of fancy kicks suck and they have no grappling skills (AHHH ) You should never sign a contract, You can take them to court to take the contract off just say they promosed Street effective fighting skills and tricked you if you want out of the contract. If you wanna train for real fighting i can give you a list of good arts that arnt over hard to learn yet offer real street skills. I am not saying that all tkd places suck but alot of them seem to. Here is my list

Sambo They dont use choked but good leg locks.
Savate Kick boxing but it is becoming harder and harder to find a good school thats not messed up with karate conseps (sorry the 2 dont mix)
Judo Has alot of good throws but you have to find right school.
BJJ(Brazilin jujutsu) Hard to use multiple oppenents on street.
R.O.S.S its kind of Questionable but yeah why not.
Hapkido its not bad but has its ups and downs like having no hooks for one.
Kickboxing has alot of push punchs
MTkickboxing adds alot of elbows and has a powerful KICK called the MT round house is very devastating kick.
JKD some of the traping concepts are arnt so great but has some great moves and works with some boxing and kicking.
eskrimer i like a good stick fighting art and has some useful hand traping and punching ideas.
Kung fu lets just say fight like a MAN DAMMIT! go with bruce lees version JKD
Kenpo well its ok it has its ups and downs its upgraded i will give you that but still needs alot of work to make it worth much.
Karate the only karate i have heard good things about is Kyokushin Karate they do alot of bare knuckle sparring but thats all the good karate ive heard of.
Boxing has alot of the best hand technecs out there cross train that with a good kicking and grappling art and you will be a top fighter.
Wrestling really good for take downs and pins works well with strikes there are branchs of wrestling just like all arts.
Very few tkd places but you must do super cross training to make it worth much.

This is my veiws on these arts. Other things i think Chambering punchs, that sucks, because it leaves your face open and you will be rocked or knocked out. Most blocks are to weak and slow to stop punchs, Horse stance is not a fighting stance and was designed for fighting on boats and wont work in real fights on land. A real fact humans are natural grapplers with the ablity to strike we come from Primates and are designed for gripping trees and so forth making it easyer for use to grapple now if we where horses and had houlves then striking would be better for use as humans. somthing else i think if you dont train for the three ranges of fighting you will never get any where the three ranges are Long distance Sort distance and up close. You need to know Good kicks for long distance. Then when you get closer you need to know good hand technecs and elbows knees etc. then closer you need to know good throws/takedowns then submissions and groundwork. With out all aspects of fighting everything from the basic kick to a head butt or a throw a fighter is incomplet and can not call them selves ready for anything . If you really want real self defense for the streets buy a gun. And the only reason you point it is to shoot.(guns arnt toys) Another thing wal on the topic of giving you some intresting facts there are alot of myths in martial arts everything from stoping bullets with teeth to killing somthing with a open palm to the nose they are mostly lyes. There is so much to learn about martial arts yet so little time some things work better then others. a way to look at it is every martial art is a tool and some tools are better for diffrent jobs like you wouldnt use a hammer to screw in a bolt. If you have any questions for me send me a message i will answer all questions to the best of my knowledege. One last thing i forgot to tell you, If your school is charging you more then 25$ a belt test and Your being promoted every three weeks it seems leave the school they just want your money there are many scams and they will try brain washing you. Go to this site WWW.mcdojo.COM I hope that i have been helpful Best of luck to your training.

 

[jfarnsworth]

You seem to have done a lot of research here. What you typed up here based on personal trial and error in each art or opinion based upon reading and research? I'm interested in your response.

 

[MountainSage]

Judo-kid,
We must be long lost brother! Your post mirrored what I would have wrote. I am a 5th grade,blue belt, in TKD and see many of the problems with TKD. Each TKD school has good points and bad points. My school stresses MA concepts for daily life, e.g. how to move more effectly in work and play, stress management, etc. There is some self- defense, but it is pretty lame, yet the art was never sold to me as a self defense art. I wanted to get back into a shape other than round. I now see the value of adding a grappling art to any striking art. Remember nothing scares the hell out of a person more than someone crash their person space. If you can get in really close, an attacker will get really far from you.

Mountainsage

 

[J-kid]

Well take it as you want, my post was just my 2 cents.

 

[noonesfool]

It's a shame to find this out now since I knew nothing when I signed up.
Mcdojang is right since no one cares about the student just the money.
Well I needlessly got charged $50 for a stripe test and that goes to the school.
The vast majority of schools in my area want some sort of contract except the Kung Fu I found.
I took a liking to the Kung Fu because it has a good self defense class every week and no test fees.
I do have a gun for personal defense of my home but when I go to work and school the gun is prohibited.
I often ride public trans to school so your left open and I have been robbed.
You can thank our society for the reduced rights of gun owners so all I have left is my body.
This kung fu class also has a structured kick boxing curriculum again once a week.
My choice of martial arts in my area is weak and not alot of schools that offer different diciplines.
There is about 30 taekwondo schools and a handful of stuff like Karate and 1 Kenpo.
Everyone will do some sort of Martial Arts if the gun is outlawed like in Okinawa way back when.

 

[white belt]

ALL martial arts have their McDojos/Jangs. The blocks taught in hyung/kata are not useable until the real application is shared. McDoJangs don't understand real applications and the student realizes they are meat, w/o real knowledge, before long. I trained at a MMA club on nights off from TKD for sometime. A guy was passing himself off as a former lightweight world contender in boxing. His gig was to share hand skills to the group. A few of us smelled a rat and investigated his record. He was a former amateur boxer who fit someone elses profile. He thought he could cash in and be a big shot. He started believing his own stories and fought a pro MMA bout at a large civic center. He was SEVERELY knocked out, before the one minute mark, and was taken to the hospital. He left town WHEN he could walk again. THEY ARE EVERYWHERE. Kung Fu has Dim Mak (death touch). How many Kung Fu instructors have used it and PROVEN it works (killed) as opposed to the number who teach it? I, as a sincere TKD man, apologize for Instructor Numb**ts treatment of you and am glad you found happiness elsewhere. If he continues, his hand will play out too. I have students coming to me from such places who are sorry they did not look me up in the first place. When I hear this kind of thing, I can't help but wonder how many have had your experience and are now categorizing my Do Jang based on such crap. You are better off. Best of luck in your studies!

white belt

 

[karatekid1975]

I totally agree with you, white belt. If I was at your dojang, I'd more than likely be happy.

It's a shame that there is so many McDojangs out there that are making TKD look bad (I'm at one .... I should know). I know TKD is a good art, but there are so many McDojangs out there that don't care. They are in it for the "buck." It makes me want to go back to my TSD dojang, but I can't (being 300 miles away).

I wish I could go and change this (my TKD) dojang to what I heard it was .... tuff! It was'nt easy to pass any grade. Now it's cake. It's a total waste of a good art

 

[noonesfool]

Nice talking with all you people about Mcdojang but like with everything else buyer beware.
I've never heard of Dim Mak and the instructor never mentioned it to us.
I would be suspicious if he did now trying to pawn off a mythical tactic as a practice.
It's kind of like that dude that was on stern claiming to give women orgasms by just touching them.
Mcdojang serves fastfu you don't know what it is but it sure looks good until you just realize what you bought.

 

[cali_tkdbruin]

Please remember this, any martial art is better than no martial art.

I'm so proud and happy that I've chosen the art and way of life of the Korean martial art of Taekwondo. It has become my total way of life. It is the best decision that I have ever made... :asian:

 

[noonesfool]

I'm glad you found something that you like....
I was'nt saying that the art was bad but the guy who was teaching me was crap..
I hate to say it but now I have a bad impression of instructors until they prove themselves worthy of the title they flaunt.
If I just wanted to know it for fun then thats different but I want to hurt those that would hurt me..
Some of the moves if you land them right would kill someone but lack the flexibility of a real life encounter.
I don't want to kill anyone and the KungFu is teaching me how to take them down and neutralize the situation before it gets that far.
It's a shame that we must think like this but the cops do not care enough to even showup in my town.
I got robbed and they said oh well it was only stuff and did'nt really file a report.
Good luck on your quest for whatever you seek also the kung fu seems more spiritual in practice and thats something else that I needed.
Best Wishes

 

[the_kicking_fiend]

Tae Kwon Do is as useful as the practioner is skilled. Someone who is unflexible will not fit it with the art form for obvious reasons. But In self defence I have used even the most extravagent Tae Kwon Do techniques to great effect. In a street fight I've used jumping back kick to utterly wind an opponent then while he's stunned and clutching himself gone into a 360 turning kick to blow him down the ground round his chin.

I'm not saying I recommend using such outlandish techniques but they *do* work in the suitable siuation and for every other situation there's often a much simpler technique like a knee breaker, an arm lock or a simple uppercut.

The martial art is never to blame for a poorly skilled student.

At the same time though I support that different martial arts suit different individuals better.

your fiendly fiend,
D

 

[fissure]

noonesfool , welcome to the ever deteriorating world of commercial Martial Arts. Reading through this thread brings to mind many problems discussed all over this board. Many here have at one time or another experienced what you are going through.
I would suggest you try to find a small "club" instead of a commercially run MA business. Often Karate/TKD/ect clubs are run out of local high schools,youth centers,rec. centers,ect.
When the money aspect is removed from the equation, the quality of the operation as a whole increases. If the instructor isn't making a living from the school then he can teach the same way they did in the 70's and 80's. I remember disruptive students being thrown out of the Shotokan club I used to belong to. Take my word for it this NEVER happens at commercial dojang/dojo!