Instructors molesting students...

[thesensei]

Well, it's sad that this topic has to come up. It seems that in the past few years, the problem of instructors molesting students is happening more and more. Last week, at a school that I was involved with, the owner/head instructor was arrested for molesting 2 of his teenage/female students. The issue has not been resolved/come to trial yet, but he admitted "inappropriate touching" of one of the students to the police. I withdrew from the school, as I cannot place myself under the authority of someone who I cannot respect. Plus, I would not allow my daughter to continue attending, so I do not feel that I should. BTW, he is not instructing at the school, but he still owns it!

So, what are your thoughts on this issue? Have any of you had the misfortune to see this happen? What was/would be your response?

Instructors, what do you do to keep yourselves from compromising situations, and ensure the morality and integrity of those teaching with and under you?


Salute

 

[Drac]

This is NOT the first time this kind of sick behavior has happened and brought to the attention of all here at MT..Click the SEARCH feature and type in "Instructor Arrested", scroll down until you find Another MA Instructor Molests Children..Be warned its not pretty..Many of us have posted there including myself..

 

[Robert Lee]

Sad state when something like this happens both for the under age child and for the M/A as a whole.

 

[tradrockrat]

Give me five minutes with him. I'll fix the problem.

 

[matt.m]

Give me five minutes with him. I'll fix the problem.

You know I have always thought that with nonsense like this that "There is nothing that I cannot fix with my hands" in respect to sickos like that.

 

[Fluffy]

I had one "friend" who ended up marrying his student/victim (one of three) after spending time in jail, another who somehow ducked charges only to try and smuggle some 'BC Bud' over the border into Washington state......the idiot got caught. Both former school owners, and who I would conceder before all this great businessmen and outstanding instructors.

All for not.

*shakes head* Stupid Losers!

 

[John Brewer]

Well, it's sad that this topic has to come up. It seems that in the past few years, the problem of instructors molesting students is happening more and more. Last week, at a school that I was involved with, the owner/head instructor was arrested for molesting 2 of his teenage/female students. The issue has not been resolved/come to trial yet, but he admitted "inappropriate touching" of one of the students to the police. I withdrew from the school, as I cannot place myself under the authority of someone who I cannot respect. Plus, I would not allow my daughter to continue attending, so I do not feel that I should. BTW, he is not instructing at the school, but he still owns it!

So, what are your thoughts on this issue? Have any of you had the misfortune to see this happen? What was/would be your response?

Instructors, what do you do to keep yourselves from compromising situations, and ensure the morality and integrity of those teaching with and under you?


Salute

Sir my thoughts are with you. This type of thing is seen in everything from schools to churches. It is very tempting to approach this in a physical sense as some of the above posts. If it happened to a child of mine I can only hope that I would trust God to take care of it instead of me. I commend you for your stand on removing your daughter from the school.

Sincerely,

John
aka Crane 557

 

[Andrew Green]

Happens in other sports as well, a few years back I believe it was hockey coaches getting blasted.

Once one hits the news others seem to follow.

Martial arts is very hands on, well, some systems are. How would you teach grappling with out ever touching someone? Even traditional kata, there are a lot of instructors that physically move people into proper position.

It's a risky position in a sense, because even a honest instructor could end up with a less then honest student with a chip on his/her shoulder. Never be alone with anyone you don't absolutely trust, never lock the doors, and don't push people into uncomfortable situations. If they want to only work with same sex people, let them get comfortable doing just that.

There are crazy people out there, both instructors and students. Students need to be careful of the instructor, and the instructors need to be careful of the students. Same as in offices with "Sexual Harassement", yes, it happens and should be punished. But there are also stories of people loosing there jobs for very innocent comments...

 

[Ceicei]

Last week, at a school that I was involved with, the owner/head instructor was arrested for molesting 2 of his teenage/female students. The issue has not been resolved/come to trial yet, but he admitted "inappropriate touching" of one of the students to the police. I withdrew from the school, as I cannot place myself under the authority of someone who I cannot respect. Plus, I would not allow my daughter to continue attending, so I do not feel that I should. BTW, he is not instructing at the school, but he still owns it!

I'm sorry it happened at your school. I would do the same thing you did--leave the school. Honor of the owner/instructor reflects upon the school. If he/she is not honorable and is still there, then I do not feel comfortable, even if the other instructors may be honorable. It is my opinion that the owner/instructor sets the tone and philosophy of the school. When that hits the news, it ruins the reputation of not just the school, but casts suspicion upon other schools as well.

Instructors, what do you do to keep yourselves from compromising situations, and ensure the morality and integrity of those teaching with and under you?

While I am not an instructor yet, I do assist teach at times. My school allows all classes to be open. That means parents are encouraged to come and watch their children who are students. For the adult classes, the spouses/significant others/family/friends, etc., can stay to watch. The school has grown big enough at this point that we do have both male and female instructors/assistant instructors in all children's classes.

Some children do have problems with their uniforms/belts. If the parents are aware of how to properly adjust the uniforms/belts for their children, then they will do this. If not, then the instructors will adjust for them in full view at the edge of the mat.

Private lessons are never done behind closed doors. The only reason the lessons are called private is because this is one-on-one between student and instructor and anyone can watch (there are no doors to the training area--it is a large open space). This is a facility that also houses a dance school and a gymnastics academy, so there are always people around.

All children's classes do have lessons on being environmentally aware, and this includes awareness of what behavior is appropriate/inappropriate and what to do.

- Ceicei

 

[gardawamtu]

Unfortunately, this is not a problem restricted to MA schools. It is a problem at any institution where adults have access to children. In fact, predators seem to flock to these types of institutions for precisely that reason.

In the past year at my church, we have instituted a child protection policy. It requires that every VOLUNTEER (not just staff members) who works with the children at any level go through a background check. There are other regulations as to who can be with children and how many children and adults can be in a room. I may be able to get you the particulars if you are interested.

If I were running a dojo, I would have a similar policy that was explicitly discussed with parents when signing their children up for the program. I would require instructors to go through a similar background check if they were working with children. The emphasis has to be on protecting the children.

This would also be a good time to talk to instructors and new students about care and incidental contact between men and women (especially for self-defense scenarios that have close-contact or grappling).

I would also be very careful about the layout of a particular school. I would prefer for everything but the changing rooms and restrooms to be a very open space.

 

[Kacey]

It's always horrible when something like this happens - and, unfortunately, it's not limited to martial arts, or even to sports.

Some years ago, I was talking to the orchestra teacher at the school where I teach special education, and we started talking about things we do in our off time - so of course the TKD came up. One of the comments he made was that part of why he was retiring instead of teaching a few more years was because he was afraid to touch his students - in the context of things like standing behind a student seated in a chair, and reaching his arms around to adjust the position of violin and/or bow.

He then asked me how I avoided difficulties with touching in instructing TKD, and I told him that I never touched a student of either gender, adult or child, without someone else present - preferably several someone elses. Like Ceicei's class, my class is open - the door is closed because we are in a racquetball court converted to a dance studio, but the overlook from when it was a racquetball court (the area above the court where observers could watch the game without getting hit by a ball) is still there, and parents and/or spouses often sit up there, people getting YMCA tours come and watch the class, racquetball players walk past to the remaining courts, and so on (the racquetball players are why the door is shut; they're very noisy, and they often swear... which I'd rather not hear).

In addition, when I grab students to adjust their body position, I grab their belt - not their body. Students who need help with their belts and/or dobok top are helped by someone of the same gender, usually in the locker room.

Thankfully, I have never had a problem with this issue in my class - and I intend to keep it this way.

I do think, however, that caution can go too far the other direction. A man I knew when we were both in the same teacher training program told me that he had been interning at the same school his then 6 year-old daughter attended, when she fell down and scraped her knee. She came running to him, and he hugged her, cleaned her up, kissed her forehead, and sent her on her way... and was later chewed out for it, because (as he was told) there was no reason for any adult working in a school to touch a child at all, except for things like cleaning the scraped knee, for which she should have been sent to the health aide. He was excused because she was his daughter, but told to be sure it never happened again, with her or any other child - because if other children saw him treat his daughter that they might want similar treatment in similar circumstances, and another child might misconstrue (or a parent might) and get him into real trouble.

 

[Drac]

Give me five minutes with him. I'll fix the problem.

Watch it "Trad"..Some bed wetting cry baby liberal will take offense..I once posted that its too bad that I wasn't the arresting officer in a molestation case..Some idiot posted that I souldn't be a cop with that attitude..

 

[chinto01]

How can you even think of doing that with a kid. Something is terrribly wrong there. Makes my stomach turn.

In the spirit of bushido!

Rob

 

[MJS]

Well, it's sad that this topic has to come up. It seems that in the past few years, the problem of instructors molesting students is happening more and more. Last week, at a school that I was involved with, the owner/head instructor was arrested for molesting 2 of his teenage/female students. The issue has not been resolved/come to trial yet, but he admitted "inappropriate touching" of one of the students to the police. I withdrew from the school, as I cannot place myself under the authority of someone who I cannot respect. Plus, I would not allow my daughter to continue attending, so I do not feel that I should. BTW, he is not instructing at the school, but he still owns it!

I don't blame you at all for getting out of that school! I would've done the same thing! Its a real shame when people take advantage of kids like this! There really are some very sick people in this world!

Have any of you had the misfortune to see this happen?

Fortunately no!

What was/would be your response?

I would do what I could to prevent it from continuing. First and foremost, I'd get the hell out of that school. From there, I'd think notifying the Police would be a good option.

Instructors, what do you do to keep yourselves from compromising situations, and ensure the morality and integrity of those teaching with and under you?

One thing that I always tried to do in the adult classes, was to pair up students of the same sex. I also carried that over to the kids classes as well. If it meant having 3 people paired up, then that was the way it was. Its really a tough situation, as I also feel that its a disservice to the student to not have the chance to experience working with a male student, just to get the feel of working with someone bigger, stronger, etc. I found it best to get the feedback from the student themselves. I never wanted to put someone in an awkward position, and made it clear that if there were any concerns about something that was happening in the class, to make sure they addressed it with myself or another inst.

I feel that male and female students can and should be able to work together, but it all comes down to how we going about it.

Mike

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

That is just so sad and disturbing! Unfortunately it will not be the last time something like this happens.

Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com

 

[stone_dragone]

Martial arts is very hands on, well, some systems are. How would you teach grappling with out ever touching someone? Even traditional kata, there are a lot of instructors that physically move people into proper position.

I for one am a very hands on teacher, however I have yet to find the situation arise that requires me to adjust someone's front stance with manual-gluteal (hand to a$$) contact. Maybe I'm behind the times in teaching methods...

I agree that the temptation to handle this kind of event physically is overwhelming and retribution should be swift and harsh, but ....uh...where was I going with that. Oh yeah, Beat the crap out of them during the arrest and let his future room-mates in county do the rest.

 

[Drac]

I agree that the temptation to handle this kind of event physically is overwhelming and retribution should be swift and harsh, but ....uh...where was I going with that. Oh yeah, Beat the crap out of them during the arrest and let his future room-mates in county do the rest.

GREAT post..My kind of thinking...

 

[IcemanSK]

the sensei:

I too am sorry that this happened. I'm glad that you are considering the best interests of your family. I hope the students involved are getting the care they need for themselves.

In terms of what I do as an instructor to prevent this situation from coming up...I do a lot. When I was a seminary student, it was drilled into my head that, as I pastor, I need to avoid even "the appearance of inpropriety." Doors open & secretary outside the door during counseling, etc. As an instructor, I've had a background check for my organization, I am never alone with a student (male or female) in a room that isn't accessible to anyone. The room I teach in has chairs outside for parents/friends & the shades on the windows are always open. I involve parents in outside activities (tournaments, etc) so that I'm not the only one with the students, ever. When it comes to training against "bearhugs" & other full body grabs, I'll explain to parents what we're doing & encourage them to be there.

Protecting children against abuse is our job as instructors. And we as instructors, need to protect ourselves from false allegations by being an "open book & having appropriate boundaries with our students."

my .02 cents.

 

[Drac]

the senseirotecting children against abuse is our job as instructors. And we as instructors, need to protect ourselves from false allegations by being an "open book & having appropriate boundaries with our students."

my .02 cents.

AMEN!!!

 

[terryl965]

the sensei:

I too am sorry that this happened. I'm glad that you are considering the best interests of your family. I hope the students involved are getting the care they need for themselves.

In terms of what I do as an instructor to prevent this situation from coming up...I do a lot. When I was a seminary student, it was drilled into my head that, as I pastor, I need to avoid even "the appearance of inpropriety." Doors open & secretary outside the door during counseling, etc. As an instructor, I've had a background check for my organization, I am never alone with a student (male or female) in a room that isn't accessible to anyone. The room I teach in has chairs outside for parents/friends & the shades on the windows are always open. I involve parents in outside activities (tournaments, etc) so that I'm not the only one with the students, ever. When it comes to training against "bearhugs" & other full body grabs, I'll explain to parents what we're doing & encourage them to be there.

Protecting children against abuse is our job as instructors. And we as instructors, need to protect ourselves from false allegations by being an "open book & having appropriate boundaries with our students."

my .02 cents.

Iceman I was going to post but yours said it all.
Thanks
Terry